Re: ZufriedengestellterBube as she used to like dogs, W’s obsession has gotten D17 to the point that she said she never wants to have a dog
I get this way too, so I know some of the feelings. Like Lil's bf, manytimes the dogs/cats get more affection and on a regular basis than the family members.
BB and D34 have a good R but sometimes strained R. BB has not wanted to see D34 as often but D34 got new a cat. Now BB wants to go see D34. Is the new cat a grand baby? What's up with that.
ZB, people get attached to pets to cover up or fill in for some losses in their life, precieved or real.
I know some of BB's loses. She says people want things from you and sometimes don't have time for you or people don;t respect your opinions. Pets accept you mo matter what you do or feel.
I say to myself, yea, right, get a pet to pay the property taxes, buy you another 47" TV, take you out to ear, or rub your feet for an hour. Does your W feel like she is always giving?
Also Do you know what your W's losses are? I am serious.
Knowing about what "she thinks" are loses or slights may not fix anything but might give you a clue as to what you might do next.
Here’s the really short history.
1974 – regular sex with HS GF.
Fall of 1975 – meet STBW.
Dec. 1975 – M – SL as listed above.
Mar 1987 - first time IC.
Feb 1988 – D born.
Oct 1989 – first time with OW.
Dec 1989 – second time.
Jan 1990 – move out – sex with OW gets regular and great.
Apr 1990 – D from W.
Jul 1990 – move back in.
Dec 1990 – M W for second time – SL as above with IC maybe 2 or 3 times a year.
Mar 2004 – hysterectomy and HRT.
Summer 2004 – start having IC weekly – not sure why. HRT?
Spring/Summer 2005 – drifting slowly but surely back into old ways This post by you was heartbreaking ZB.
I’ve covered some of this before, but the fact is that I really don’t know a lot about W or her life before we met in college. I do know that in her FOO women are generally treated like second-class citizens. I know that her father worked second shift, her mother was working in the dime store (Does that term date me?), and at nine years old, W had pretty much assumed all of the household duties. I know that her parents, especially her mother, were highly critical of everything she did; she just never quite measured up. And then there’s the allegations of abuse by her older brother. What I know of her life wasn’t terrible, but it wasn’t exactly a picnic either.
The other thing I can tell you is that the dog thing, like the sex thing, predates me. Even when she talks about her childhood, which isn’t often, the vast majority of the stories and memories seem to center around her pets. I never though much about it though since she grew up on a farm with no close neighbors.
When I think about this and add in things like her admission to the C that she hates men and her unforgiving nature when someone “wrongs” her, I see that animals have always been her best friends. Always. It kind of brings to mind Tom T. Hall’s song, “Old Dogs and Children and Watermelon Wine. Do you know that one?
Re: ZB working in the dime store (Does that term date me?), Used to go to 3 of them when I was in 5th. grade. Haven't been to one recently, Oh, now they are dollar stores and have different company names. growing up and living with a mother on social security (dad died) ment we did not have much money. "dime" stores were "Big Time" places.
especially her mother, were highly critical of everything she did; she just never quite measured up. Wow! ZB, almost the same here. BB's mother made suggestions and BB took it as criticism. Sometimes my MIL was critical but she was a genuinely good person. That is why I said "Precieved Slight". Were they criticisms or just mothering traits? Your W's situation may be different.
Two ways to look at the slight. If it feels like a slight it is to the receiver but is the sender always responsible for how the reciever takes things. I think not but I do realise it can hurt. But that is another eggshell territory where you have to weigh too many comments to make much conversation worth the effort. I have often said something thinking it was helpful in some way only to have the words taken as being criticall. I have even been guilty.
When things are strained to begin with the notions of slights pops up way too often. In good R's these slights can be taken for what they were intended to be, information and small talk.
When I think about this and add in things like her admission to the C that she hates men and her unforgiving nature when someone “wrongs” her, I see that animals have always been her best friends. Always. Spoky ZB, some simalarities right on the money!
BB had a few good friends that lived on the block, but yes, pets were some of her best friends. BB even had an imaginary horse when she was with some friends.
The pets issues wirh BB was the main reason I never totally objected when she was getting more pets. I was hoping she would work through some of her childood wishes, issues. She is down from 13 to 8 and intecually talks about that is too many sometimes but never sees herself with fewer than 5 or 6 pets.
Its not that I don't like pets, its more BB will do a lot of things for the pets when I feel left out.
It's kind of some women that don't mind their H MBing as long as the woman is getting her "fill" (pun intended) and intimacy needs met.
BB had issues wither step dad and I can see where I kind of am in the same place. Her step dad was a good parent. Did not like some of the lazafair attitude / hands off practices some of the more liberal parents had, but he was not controlling. Babide too much, yes, but he brought a lot to the relationship when he married BB mom.
ZB, will your W ever get to see you are not like her male family members and quit associating their old behaviors to you? Is this an issue or am I relying on my experiences.
They say young people marry their opposite gender parent. Don't laugh. My D married a guy somewhat like me. Are you a substitute dad in her mind?
I am not saying everyone does this. BB is not much like my mother.
“Old Dogs and Children and Watermelon Wine. Do you know that one? Might have heard it way back when in a "dime store" time. I am into Tchicovsky/1812 Overature, Queen"s Bohemian Rhapsody, George Winston, a little Tuxedo Junction jazz, Bee Gees, ABBA, Tangerine Dream, America, George Gershwin, and other "Best of" popular music.
I smell food, I have to go, but here is something funny.
Mensa Invitational 2005 winners: Rules, Just change / add one letter of a word.
4. Foreploy: Any misrepresentation about yourself for the purpose of getting laid. Foreplay
5. Cashtration (n.): The act of buying a house, which renders the subject Financially impotent for an indefinite period. Castration
Re: ZB working in the dime store (Does that term date me?), Used to go to 3 of them when I was in 5th. grade. Haven't been to one recently, Oh, now they are dollar stores and have different company names. growing up and living with a mother on social security (dad died) ment we did not have much money. "dime" stores were "Big Time" places.
especially her mother, were highly critical of everything she did; she just never quite measured up. Wow! ZB, almost the same here. BB's mother made suggestions and BB took it as criticism. Sometimes my MIL was critical but she was a genuinely good person. That is why I said "Precieved Slight". Were they criticisms or just mothering traits? Your W's situation may be different.
Two ways to look at the slight. If it feels like a slight it is to the receiver but is the sender always responsible for how the reciever takes things. I think not but I do realise it can hurt. But that is another eggshell territory where you have to weigh too many comments to make much conversation worth the effort. I have often said something thinking it was helpful in some way only to have the words taken as being criticall. I have even been guilty.
When things are strained to begin with the notions of slights pops up way too often. In good R's these slights can be taken for what they were intended to be, information and small talk.
When I think about this and add in things like her admission to the C that she hates men and her unforgiving nature when someone “wrongs” her, I see that animals have always been her best friends. Always. Spoky ZB, some simalarities right on the money!
BB had a few good friends that lived on the block, but yes, pets were some of her best friends. BB even had an imaginary horse when she was with some friends.
The pets issues wirh BB was the main reason I never totally objected when she was getting more pets. I was hoping she would work through some of her childood wishes, issues. She is down from 13 to 8 and intecually talks about that is too many sometimes but never sees herself with fewer than 5 or 6 pets.
Its not that I don't like pets, its more BB will do a lot of things for the pets when I feel left out.
It's kind of some women that don't mind their H MBing as long as the woman is getting her "fill" (pun intended) and intimacy needs met.
BB had issues wither step dad and I can see where I kind of am in the same place. Her step dad was a good parent. Did not like some of the lazafair attitude / hands off practices some of the more liberal parents had, but he was not controlling. Babide too much, yes, but he brought a lot to the relationship when he married BB mom.
ZB, will your W ever get to see you are not like her male family members and quit associating their old behaviors to you? Is this an issue or am I relying on my experiences.
They say young people marry their opposite gender parent. Don't laugh. My D married a guy somewhat like me. Are you a substitute dad in her mind?
I am not saying everyone does this. BB is not much like my mother.
“Old Dogs and Children and Watermelon Wine. Do you know that one? Might have heard it way back when in a "dime store" time. I am into Tchicovsky/1812 Overature, Queen"s Bohemian Rhapsody, George Winston, a little Tuxedo Junction jazz, Bee Gees, ABBA, Tangerine Dream, America, George Gershwin, and other "Best of" popular music.
I smell food, I have to go, but here is something funny.
Mensa Invitational 2005 winners: Rules, Just change / add one letter of a word.
4. Foreploy: Any misrepresentation about yourself for the purpose of getting laid. Foreplay
5. Cashtration (n.): The act of buying a house, which renders the subject Financially impotent for an indefinite period. Castration
Re: ZB working in the dime store (Does that term date me?), Used to go to 3 of them when I was in 5th. grade. Haven't been to one recently, Oh, now they are dollar stores and have different company names. growing up and living with a mother on social security (dad died) ment we did not have much money. "dime" stores were "Big Time" places.
especially her mother, were highly critical of everything she did; she just never quite measured up. Wow! ZB, almost the same here. BB's mother made suggestions and BB took it as criticism. Sometimes my MIL was critical but she was a genuinely good person. That is why I said "Precieved Slight". Were they criticisms or just mothering traits? Your W's situation may be different.
Two ways to look at the slight. If it feels like a slight it is to the receiver but is the sender always responsible for how the reciever takes things. I think not but I do realise it can hurt. But that is another eggshell territory where you have to weigh too many comments to make much conversation worth the effort. I have often said something thinking it was helpful in some way only to have the words taken as being criticall. I have even been guilty.
When things are strained to begin with the notions of slights pops up way too often. In good R's these slights can be taken for what they were intended to be, information and small talk.
When I think about this and add in things like her admission to the C that she hates men and her unforgiving nature when someone “wrongs” her, I see that animals have always been her best friends. Always. Spoky ZB, some simalarities right on the money!
BB had a few good friends that lived on the block, but yes, pets were some of her best friends. BB even had an imaginary horse when she was with some friends.
The pets issues wirh BB was the main reason I never totally objected when she was getting more pets. I was hoping she would work through some of her childood wishes, issues. She is down from 13 to 8 and intecually talks about that is too many sometimes but never sees herself with fewer than 5 or 6 pets.
Its not that I don't like pets, its more BB will do a lot of things for the pets when I feel left out.
It's kind of some women that don't mind their H MBing as long as the woman is getting her "fill" (pun intended) and intimacy needs met.
BB had issues wither step dad and I can see where I kind of am in the same place. Her step dad was a good parent. Did not like some of the lazafair attitude / hands off practices some of the more liberal parents had, but he was not controlling. Babide too much, yes, but he brought a lot to the relationship when he married BB mom.
ZB, will your W ever get to see you are not like her male family members and quit associating their old behaviors to you? Is this an issue or am I relying on my experiences.
They say young people marry their opposite gender parent. Don't laugh. My D married a guy somewhat like me. Are you a substitute dad in her mind?
I am not saying everyone does this. BB is not much like my mother.
“Old Dogs and Children and Watermelon Wine. Do you know that one? Might have heard it way back when in a "dime store" time. I am into Tchicovsky/1812 Overature, Queen"s Bohemian Rhapsody, George Winston, a little Tuxedo Junction jazz, Bee Gees, ABBA, Tangerine Dream, America, George Gershwin, and other "Best of" popular music.
I smell food, I have to go, but here is something funny.
Mensa Invitational 2005 winners: Rules, Just change / add one letter of a word.
4. Foreploy: Any misrepresentation about yourself for the purpose of getting laid. Foreplay
5. Cashtration (n.): The act of buying a house, which renders the subject Financially impotent for an indefinite period. Castration
Sorry for the duplicates, edit/delete will not work. Computer or site was almost stopped for a long time.
ZB, I notice more and more, what I try to change only works to a degree. You will see on my thread things happen not because of what I did or did not do, but whae BB was motivated (what ever that is sometimes, sometimes it is me withdrawing) I don't have many answers. All I know Is I have to do something different.
Lou and Z-Bube - Interesting posts on person's histories related to current relationship issues.
Just wanted to comment Lou on your sentence:
"You will see on my thread things happen not because of what I did or did not do, but whae BB was motivated" to do.
Of course your actions affect the dynamic of your marriage, but your W actions are NEEDED as well to make the relationship function. Not just function, but survive.
The dyad (any relationship of 2) is the most fragile and unstable relationship for this very reason. It takes both people's efforts to make it work.
Some of us may feel like we are banging our heads against a wall when we put in so much effort and have little returned. Nothing is our marriges will improve unless the OTHER person is MOTIVATED.
I am greatful my H is now showing the motivation to make our marrige work. We BOTH need to WANT it to work to make it a success.
I guess I'm just saying you can do your part as much as you can but don't ever blame yourself for your W actions/behaviors. Those are solely her responsibility as are mine with my H.
but whae BB was corrected to read (but what BB was) It must be those non spelling keyboards , easy to blame it on someone or something else, isn't it?
Re LFL guess I'm just saying you can do your part as much as you can but don't ever blame yourself for your W actions/behaviors. Those are solely her responsibility as are mine with my H. I know she is part of the solutions and I am not to responsible for what she does or doesn't do.
My point was to say, one person can seem to do all of the right things at the right times but not much happens then, and at another time seem to do nothing and are in the "I give up" mode, when bingo, it rains pennies from heaven.
BTW, the "pennies from heaven" ( closeness feelings) quit last evening. BB wants her space again.
