JJ--I now understand what you meant by your question. I completely read it wrong...and now that I've gone back and looked...I'm a little embarrassed at my outburst. Please accept my apologies. You have a very good point and while I don't mean to minimize my W's feelings, I probably do it more often than intended.
I guess I have trouble with my tone, whether I'm talking OR writing. People frequently misinterpret my tone of voice (the W included). I wonder why it is that I am not able convey what I want to say in the appropriate tone. But, I know my W's feelings are valid--whether or not I agree.
I am frustrated. I just wanted some understanding from her and some validation that I'm not completely beyond repair. Does that make sense? So, I start feeling sorry for myself and strike-out inappropriately (in tone only). It is so hard to love somebody so much and not be able to show it appropriately because of something that isn't firmly in your control.
I appreciate all of you so much. You guys do so much to pull me back to reality--whether I want to be there or not.
I am so thankful for my kids! They are the purest joy in my life at this point. I never want to hurt them...in any way.
I am doing the best I can with all of this. Over the last week, I've lost sight of my goals. I tend to do that when some of them are met. I focus on what I accomplished and take my eyes off all the others. So, I need to re-direct my energies to achieving ALL of my goals.
Here's a GREAT BIG BEAR HUG to each of you--JJ, GEL and Honey!! You guys are the greatest!!!!!! K
I have been following your situation. I wish I had time to try and help you, but my time here is very limited, and is about to become even more so.
I do want to briefly address your recent concerns. I know that you have a serious plate-full to deal with. Even so, please add to your reading list the following two books; "Surviving An Affair" by Harley and "Love Must Be Tough" by Dobson.
The things I have written to csw will also apply to your situation. Additionally, you will want to consider the issue of STDs. This is an important discussion to have with your wife before you are intimate again. A condom will not protect you from all STDs. The most common STD is HPV (genital warts), and it is readily transmissible, even with a condom.
I am sorry that what I have said will likely be tough to swallow. I could also be wrong. Follow your gut on this one. You have to make your own decisions.
Please do continue with the progress you have made, and in the changes you have made to yourself. The folks that have been posting to you have given you excellent advice.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I’m glad to see you back. Ever the optimist, I thought your wife had turned a corner and that you were so busy having crazy monkey sex that you didn’t have time to post....
I’ve been really thinking about this issue lately. I’m not sure if I’m right or if I believe it, but it resonates with me.
Is it possible that DR is mis-titled? I know it would have the marketing success that it does with a title along the lines I propose, but here goes: I think calling it something like “how to get over an idiot spouse” captures the strategy. Michele references this quality of the book sporadically. But I wonder if all the victims on this website miss the theme of the book and just read into it what we want.
I’m going to paraphrase some of the things I’ve been thinking. They aren’t directed at you. They’re actually directed at me.
1) Your wife is a crazy bitch. People who love each other don’t leave their spouses unless their spouse represents a clear and present danger to their safety.
2) Your spouse does not care about your children. It’s been documented that children of divorce generally fare worse than children in intact homes. Your spouse is putting her desire for happiness above your children’s desire for happiness.
3) You have absolutely no responsibility for the impending divorce. It is 100% the fault of your spouse. Divorce is legal status. You may have contributed to the lowering of the quality of your marriage. But you did not seek the legal status. Quality of marriage is a variable. Sometimes it is high, sometimes it is low. Divorce is black and white. It either is or it isn’t. You have demonstrated a willingness to work to raise the quality. Your spouse has elected to pursue a legal remedy, instead.
4) People who love each other don’t want to impose unhappiness on their spouse. If your spouse tells you the only way she can be happy is to leave the marriage, then you, as a loving spouse have an obligation to say “I that is the only way you can be happy, then go.” To say anything else is to demonstrate a lack of compassion for the one you love.
5) You’re probably not much of a catch in your current state. You’re a whiney, insensitive slob. Fix these things. Start taking care or your body. Dress for success. Be a good parent to your children. Learn to talk about amusing and insightful topics. These things are all attractive to women. You will become attractive to women.
6) Don’t concentrate on winning your wife back or saving your marriage. Concentrate on creating a person who is wildly attractive to the opposite sex. Pimp it out.
7) Your spouse is a member of the opposite sex. If you are attractive to the opposite sex, she might be attracted to you. If she is, that is much more convenient and much less costly than a divorce. If not, who wants to be around someone who fits in points one and two?
8) You have the benefit of absolution from point three. Your willingness to give that selfish crazy person a second chance makes you a loyal person. Your children, your family, your friends and the general public value loyalty. You are entitled to be proud of yourself.
I think the way to succeed here is to follow the lead of the WAS. Fall out of love. Think of all the crap that irritates you and makes her unbearable. Focus hard and believe it. One of two things is going to happen. She’s going to leave and you need to realize you aren’t losing that much. Or, she going to stay and you need to realize that just because you achieve the visible goal of staying married doesn’t mean that snow white is moving into your bedroom.
Realize that you have as much choice in this matter as your spouse does. Because you are loyal person, you allow her the second chance. But she is only one among several choices of companions. Figure out who some of those other people are. I’m going to get shot for saying this, but register for match.com. look at some alternatives. They are all available. And looking. Think how much fun it would be to date one of them and not have to deal with all the underlying crap. When you embrace your ability to choose, you empower yourself.
Think about this. Brad Pitt appears to be in the same boat as us right now. No one feels too terribly sorry for him right now. I bet he’s never even heard of DR. Why is this? It’s because he’s wealthy, famous and attractive. He can get almost any girl he wants. Be him. If you are in a place where no one else feels sorry for you, then you’re less likely to attend a pity party in your honor.
Remember the 27 year olds. But don’t get so caught up in it that you forget that loyal people grant forviveness.
Keb I am sorry that this has happened. BUT one piece of advice I have is to ask her if she is really having an affair. I know it seems like it is pointing to it with the phone calls. But she may have made new friends. She may be just trying to find herself again and feeling the need to go out and get away. She may have a male friend that she is turning to for advice or even support but it may not mean it has been sexual.
I kind of feel I am at a point your wife is at right now emotionally. Nothing makes an affair right. It's the ultimate sin in a marriage in my opinion. And you are to be commended for making changes. But I do know what it feels like to have a low libido spouse. It's hurt so bad and turns you into a different person.
Thanks FixIt! Your advice is most excellent!! In my self-pity, I had forgotten about the 27 year-olds!! Not that I plan to go and seek that right away but it does offer an appealing alternative at some point.
I am still committed to this marriage. I made that clear to the W last week. I will continue to fight for what I believe is right but I won't get bogged down in it. Like I said yesterday, I need to continue focusing on my goals...I was doing that a month ago when I started all of this. But, I lost the focus because I made some progress on a couple of them...one of my weaknesses for sure.
One thing I don't want to do FixIt is to convince myself that my life was unhappy with my W. While it could be easy to do, it wouldn't be beneficial to a positive co-parenting arrangement. So, I'll hold off on that for a while.
One final comment for the HDWs...last night, I had a small taste of what my W went through for FIVE years! As you know, I've been sleeping in the bedroom...and making sure to touch my W as much as possible (romantically and not so). Anyway, last night I fell asleep and woke up about two hours later (12:30ish) and she wasn't in the bed. It felt lonely. I could hear her in the living room watching tv or sleeping herself. It was even more lonely. SO, I did that to her for FIVE years. Man! How stupid am I!? If I felt lonely after only one night...
BUT, instead of just lying there lonely, I got up and went to her and asked if she was coming to bed. Which she did by the way! Maybe, if she would have done the same. She never talked about being lonely. I honestly thought (thought being the key word) I was doing her a favor by not keeping her awake with my snoring and my need for the tv. She never made it clear that wasn't the case. But, hind-sight, eh?
Anyway, just thought I'd share that insight with you all.
FixIt--great post as always!! Thanks for the buck up! K
I had a thought for you (hopefully helpful, not offensive ). Have you ever considered that maybe you hold a certain amount of resentment towards your W because although you worship her like you worshipped your six older sisters, she couldn't give you the level of attention that you would have received as a child being the baby boy in a large family of girls? My H has indicated that he might have problems along this line that are contributing to the sex issue. His mother is a completely doting, clingy mother-hen kind of mother (she tried to take him clothes shopping when he was in his 30s, repeatedly ) and so he simultaneously craves and repulses this kind of attention from me. Just a thought. Hang tough.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
KEB, I was thinking of you last night and I suddenly was hit with an attack of empathy. I'm sorry if my post to you yesterday was harsh.
I remember when my H pulled away from me, I just couldn't believe it. I could not comprehend that there could ever be anything that could tear his heart away from my own. I now frequent a Catholic website and post from time to time. Whew.......if I had done that back then, I would have had nothing kind to say. I was so full of hurt and anger that I couldn't see any other viewpoint than my own. I was SCORNED, man!
It takes a while to get over the shock of realizing that while the other person loves you, it is not unconditional.
Hang in there and keep on getting a life. You've got her wheels spinning. Concentrate on getting them to spin faster til you spin all the other crap out, lol.
Okay...the old KEBall, the one that can face the intensity of this BB is back! Sorry he disappeared for a while, I'm not sure what happened. I'm back to the C today...hopefully, it was a normal path for someone with my back issues. AND, having said that, you guys can stop walking on eggshells with me!
Quote: I had a thought for you (hopefully helpful, not offensive). Have you ever considered that maybe you hold a certain amount of resentment towards your W because although you worship her like you worshipped your six older sisters, she couldn't give you the level of attention that you would have received as a child being the baby boy in a large family of girls?
JJ--I wonder the same thing myself...and so does my W! One of her points in ending our M is that I only love her like she's one of my sisters. It's a good thing to ponder because you're right (most of) my sisters doted on me as a child--up to our marriage. My W comes from a different background--she's the oldest of 4 girls. While they had a loving mother (their father died when she was 7) and grandparents and extended family, no one completely doted upon them. So, she has a different way about her when it comes to the level attention she provides. And, in marrying her, I naturally started to pull away from my family (mom and sisters)...so, I lost that attention and didn't necessarily gain more from her. BUT, in the beginning, I was so busy ladeling the attention on her (because, Lord knows, I had plenty in reserve), I didn't necessarily notice I wasn't getting it in return. I don't know...I forgot where I was going with this. I guess that could be a definite contributor in the whole S issue.
HP--empathy-smempathy, I deserved the whackings I got yesterday! You're very sweet to be concerned...sometimes, that Catholic guilt escapes from us whether we want it to or not! Speaking of...would you mind sharing the Catholic website? But, you're right about the unconditional part of love...I guess that is one of those bitter pills I need to swallow in this whole thing.
Honestly, I know my wife loves me (deep inside) or else she wouldn't still be around (see GEL, I am learning). She is just hurting to the very depth of her being...I see that in her eyes...so, to protect herself (which she learned to do at 7--see above about dad), she puts on armor--thick, thick armor. She doesn't want me to hurt either but she doesn't see a way back...taking off the armor which by now has probably melded with her skin, would hurt too much. So, that's where we are. She needs something new and fresh...either a new person or a new me. I don't know which she'll choose but I'm doing my damndest to make myself into that.
Life is too short to live this sadly. Twenty years of love is a long time...but it's not a life time. In fact, it's barely over my lifetime so far. I won't stop loving Ms.KEBall...because she gave me what she was capable of giving in that department and because she's the mother of my children. If we can rekindle what we have, GREAT, I will be the richest man on the earth. If we don't, I know I still have her love as a friend. I have the love of my children. I have the love of family and friends (I consider you guys in that category). But most imporantly, I will have the love of myself!!!!! I may not be there yet...but I'm working on it!
Okay...where did the smchaltz come from!? Sorry guys. But thanks for humoring me!!
The people there are hardcore, I'm warning you. I originally went there to get a feel of 'where' my husband was at, kwim? But I ended up liking it and discovering that my own faith was not as weak as I thought. I had just buried it, cause I was so ticked that it "stole" my husband from me.
It took me a while to realize that he stole himself away from me--nothing forced him to do it.
). Have you ever considered that maybe you hold a certain amount of resentment towards your W because although you worship her like you worshipped your six older sisters, she couldn't give you the level of attention that you would have received as a child being the baby boy in a large family of girls? My H has indicated that he might have problems along this line that are contributing to the sex issue. His mother is a completely doting, clingy mother-hen kind of mother (she tried to take him clothes shopping when he was in his 30s, repeatedly 