I think there's a difference between someone invading someone else's privacy and invading someone else's secrecy, don't you? I think that when one partner violates the privacy of the marital relationship by going outside of it to have their needs met, I don't see a problem with the innocent spouse needing to check that this violation is not continuing. Of course, these opinions are at odds with the opinions of a wandering spouse, but let me tell you, a spouse with nothing to hide, has nothing to hide, and a spouse who is remorseful and wishes to make amends will not balk at having their movements checked and will not be at odds with my opinion. But snooping , while it may uncover truths, is a terrible way to live, living with someone you can't trust. I did that for a while.
Looking at cell phone bills, I can tell you from experience, if you thought highly enough of yourself so as to marry a fairly intelligent mate, your intelligent mate will be clever enough not to use the cell phone for outgoing calls. Mine bought an ATT 800 card, and called from phone booths. The lesson I learned from that was, they can find ways to outwit you.
You are so right, NY. I'm so confused right now, understandably so. My H says I can check up on him whenever I feel the need to. In that sense, I feel like I can believe him that he has no more to hide. But just yesterday when I was checking my email, he walked through the door and said,"What? Are you checking my phone record again?"
Is he still hiding something? Or is he getting irritated because he thinks I'm still distrustful of him?
The thought has crossed my mind that he may possibly still be making contact with OW through another means of communication. Pay phone, a friend's phone, etc. Two days ago, someone sent him a text message. He said that only 2 buddies do text messaging with him, and he walked away as he was checking it. Hmmm....could it be OW? I hope not. He has separate passwords for voicemail, online cell phone records, and text messaging. I know the first two, but not the one for texts. I don't even think these types show up on his invoice anyway. Just more info to drive me crazy!
H is at his sister's house right now helping with installing a satellite receiver. I'm feeling pretty down right now. Today was very hard to act cheery. I haven't cried today though, so that's good. H said he's going to stop and get a movie on the way home for us to watch together. We haven't done that in a long time. I'm looking forward to it. We would usually lay together and hold each other while watching a DVD. I would love sooo much for that to happen tonight. I just feel like if it doesn't happen, I'm afraid that I may begin to cry. I'll try my hardest not to.
Valerie
"I can't change the direction of the wind, but I can adjust my sails to always reach my destination." ~ author unknown
Quote: My H says I can check up on him whenever I feel the need to. In that sense, I feel like I can believe him that he has no more to hide.
JV,
Even though he may have something to hide, he says go ahead and check up on him. If I remember correctly, back in 1984 Democratic front-runner Gary Hart was accused of having been involved in XMAs and being a womanizer. He told the press to go ahead and follow him around. Within a week, a picture of Donna Rice sitting on his lap on a sailboat was in every newspaper in the country.
It just goes to prove that sometimes we men aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer.
I can't deduce if someone is hiding something or not by what they say. Don't even try. It does seem out of place for someone who said you could check on them, or someone who knows you're going through a period where you check on them, though. Typically, they say, cheats get indignant with you if they catch you "invading their privacy", if you want to use that as a measure of behavior.
I think there's more to checking up than calling him. I think you need a 24 hour itinerary, and the phone numbers where he's going to be at. Checking phone records isn't going to help since he knows you're checking phone records. They're going to be clean even if he is still cheating. Keep your eyes and ears open. If he's lying, sooner or later you'll catch him in one. It's difficult to remember all the lies and have them harmonize with one another.
Hey there! I'll give you a little background on me and I'll try to keep it brief. A little over a year ago I left my husband after for an affair that went on off and on for a couple years. Please don't judge me to harshly just yet. What I did was wrong, extremely wrong. I know it was however I had to come to that on my own. I used the same lines your H is using. I love you but I'm not in love with you. I stayed as long as I did for our kids as well but even that wasn't enough to keep me there. I was very confused by the things going on inside of me. I have since come to understand that it was ALL a sensless case of infatuation. The OM was something new, adventure, risk, challenge, an adreneline rush and I fell in love with that, not OM. I thought I loved him and I believed we'd go on to even be married someday. Then I moved out on my own and things changed rapidly after that. I said I'd keep it brief so basically I ended up six months later scraping myself up off of my apartment floor from a drunken depressed stupor that not only was killing me inside but killing my body as well. I had to completely crash before I could rise up. During this time my H wouldn't leave me alone and OM wouldn't leave me alone. Both pulled and yanked at any little piece of me that they could get a hold of. The more H begged the more I locked up until not one single word of what he said was even heard by me. I was completely deaf to him. The more he pleaded the more I moved away. Now, get this one....the shoe is on the other foot. I got myself into counseling, I found meaning in my life through my belief in God. I am now, after a lot of work and the accepting of responsibility for what I did, a very happy person with one thing missing and that's my husband. I went to him back in August and told him I'd like to work things out. I followed that same desperate cycle of begging and pleading like we all have. Do NOT do this. I had no idea how further damaging this can be and looking back now on my reaction to my H when he pleaded with me, it makes sense.
I know how hard it is to believe that things can turn around and my story by no means is that of complete success. To me, complete success would be me and my H together with our two daughters and have that 'they lived happily ever after' ending. This hasn't happened yet and I'm not sure that it ever will but you can bet that the amazing metamorphisis that my life has taken is getting eyed.
I have gone from a drunken, unfaithful, lying slob of a woman that I hated to someone sober, happy, loyal, faithful, honest and true. It's okay to love yourself is what I found out. Take care of you, change the routine a little. Shake it up, buy a new shade of lipstick and if you don't wear it then start. Anything that makes YOU feel like a million bucks. It doesn't matter how limited your budget is, find something. Find a couple somethings and interchange them, your a mom so I know you are versatile.....show it! Now when H looks at me he can see that I take care of myself. When we speak I am respectful to him. Men want respect and women want love. I know it's hard to respect him after what he has done and no one expects you to tolerate it. However, responding with respect to him is the decent thing to do and you'll come out all the better because of it. I've noticed a lot of tiny changes in how my H looks at me and how he responds to me. This has taken 7 months to achieve. Please note that I spent the first 3 months doing heavy begging and pleading and the next 2 months learning to put it to rest and the past 2 months I've been completely quiet about marriage or any relationship talk and this is when I seem to have started making some progress.
Right now time is what is needed. Just as the others have shared with you. Time and patience. If he tells you he wants to work things out there is still some hope whether it's for the kids or not. Get in to some counseling and don't let it go a moment further. Seize the moment.
I'm sorry if I ramble on. I'm not shy about sharing the things I did that destroyed my life. We are here for you and this board has been of great help to me.
Just checking back in. Amy and the others have offered some really good advice. Listen to it. This is hard. One day you feel like you can do it and then the next day, you think there is no way you can continue. This is normal. What we are trying to do isn't natural. Loving someone who doesn't want our love, who is confused. They will say things tha will hurt. You have to be strong. We all make mistakes (backsliding). That's okay, just learn from them.
We all know from our own personal experience, that begging, crying, pleading, R or ow talk do not work. That is the hard part, to not let your emotions get the better of you in front of your H. It does get easier (not easy) just easier at time goes by.
You can do this. Keep your PMA up, focus on you and your children. Sherry
Sherry is right! This is not a natural thing and just as I did with my H and my H did with me, we say mean, cruel, and hateful things. To me this is a lame attempt to justify to ourselves what we have done. My H has gotten himself mixed up with a married woman himself and is doing no different than what was done to him by me. It doesn't pay to throw this up to him or say anything to him at all. You may as well throw another brick in the wall that's already tall and still considered under construction.
You worry about taking care of you and taking care of your children. Find happiness within yourself and the improvements and changes you make to you. This will be contagious to your H. I'm assuming you are both living under the same roof and this is an advantage when doing this. My H and I live apart and we only see each other for a little bit on Sundays and then only on occasion otherwise. Utilize this and let the wonderful things you find in yourself spread through out your home.
Do your darndest to not become bitter and allow it to consume the woman he loves. This is very hard to reverse. In my research I have learned that men are passionate overcomers and women are passionate caregivers. It has nothing to do with being weak, it's just the way we are made. Continue to be passionate about caring! I've come to love my life and I'm very happy other than the fact that H is missing in action. I've learned that the world keeps turning.
It won't be easy as Sherry said, but it does get easier! There are a lot of wise people here who are going through what you're going through. If you need to vent take it out in prayer if you are a believer. Just don't do it in front of your H or your kids! It takes practice to do this, but make sure you do everything you can to smile as much as possible. Remember, it's contagious.
Again, thank you everyone, for your continued support and understanding in all of this. It is so very much appreciated, and I am so glad I came to this website.
When I last posted, I had mentioned that my H was going to pick up a movie for us to watch before he got home. Well, no such luck. He got home after midnight from his sister's. He did at least hold me in bed which hasn't happened in a while. It felt really great!
I also have been trying to better my appearance by actually putting on makeup and wearing something other than a t-shirt and sweats. For awhile, it was almost impossible to take more than a 5 minute shower with the new baby. Those of you who have children know what I mean! I'd take my QUICK shower, pull my hair up in a ponytail or bun, and throw on anything that was clean. Now that the baby's a little older and can play with some toys, I have the time to fix myself up the way my H used to like to see me. We were able to go away for Super Bowl weekend, and everyday, at least 2 or 3 times during the day, he would tell me how beautiful I looked, and I knew he meant it. But after that weekend when we returned home was when I found out that he was still talking to OW after making the "it's over" call. I'm still doing my hair, makeup, and dressing better, but the compliments stopped after that incident.
I also wrote in a previous post that he went to the mall (where OW works) to buy me a surprise gift. I guess he knew that I had thoughts running through my mind about him going there, and he said,"I didn't go to see her. I stayed upstairs the whole time. She works at the Old Navy, and I didn't go anywhere near there." He never told me where OW worked before. Now I am so tempted to go see if I could figure out who she may be. I don't believe I have enough nerve to say anything if I somehow found out who she was. I don't think I'm capable of starting any kind of scene either, and I wouldn't want to anyway. I'm just so curious to see who she might be.
Valerie
"I can't change the direction of the wind, but I can adjust my sails to always reach my destination." ~ author unknown
I called the OW and ended up getting a warrant against me. She claimed I threatened her but I didn't! I didn't get anything out of it except that I have to stay away from her and the courts are going to revisit it in April. All I did was call her up and leave a message letting her know that I had talked to her H and he told me that she's still wanting to work things out with him and yet she's still sleeping with my H. Guess it didn't go over to well that I had this information. Funny thing is, she's still doing it...burning both ends of the candle.
I think it's great that you are fixing up. Have you thought about making any subtle changes? Get your eyebrows waxed if you don't already shape them up. What about a highlight for your hair or a little different cut. A new top that isn't part of your normal style, different for you but flattering. It's kind of like underwear. I use to wear plain cotton briefs, my H flipped one night when he discovered that I had on a pair of black lacy ones. He loved it and when he asked me what possessed me to do that I said very simply "You". That was a long time ago, but his reaction to me stuck in my mind. Sounds silly I know, but anything is worth a try....Right?
The I love you but I'm not in love with you line comes from the fact that he does love you but doesn't have ALL of the wonderful feelings that come along with it. At least that's what I believe. Love might be a special look you only have for your S. It's the 'warm fuzzy's' that you feel for lack of a better term at this moment. It is something that wears off with time and neglect. It's not the end of the world though, you just have to work to bring that spark back into life and love. He's lost the spark somewhere and you guys need a jump start. Yes, I know that this is hard with small children, I have two of my own. It's not an excuse though for letting things die. I have seen things like this happen where children come along and within a year of the first being born the quality of love diminishes and gets focused on the children. Yes, children are the world and the future but if you are to maintain a future with your S then you need to have them to be you're world as well. There is room for both, MAKE room for both. I didn't have a lot of help with my babies and with the first one I worked swing shift opposite of my H. This put serious strain on us but we recovered well that summer. We did silly stupid things like move the CD player out into the yard and danced to old classic country songs that we both grew up on. The kids were there running around and having a blast watching mommy and daddy loving each other by dancing and acting silly and having so much fun. I miss those times but even now they make me love my H more than I ever have. No matter that he's gone, my love is strong. You don't have to do this all of the time, just make sure you do it frequently enough to hold you over to the next time. I'd recommend at least every two weeks. These are the things that keep you 'in love' with each other. Simple, silly, stupid, wonderful things that may not make a lick of sense to anyone else but are everything to the two of you. Maybe you've already thought of all of this and I'm sorry for rambling. I hope this helps explain the love you verses not in love with you statement.
