Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums THE SEX-STARVED MARRIAGE It's Unanimous- We both want out.

Alas, I do think you're right.

As I said a while back it shouldn't have to be THIS hard. Work, yes, but constant struggle with minimal payoff... no. Like Sisyphus pushing the rock up that damned hill. You can't get traction.

I don't know if my bf and I are like you and H or like the NOPs. I don't know if we have enough to sustain us once we take off the masks and lay down the weapons. I've been in enough Rs to know that ALL of them hit a wall of some sort sooner or later. Like NOP says, at that point you either stay and love or go elsewhere and start over. The tricky part is knowing which to do. There's GROWTH to be had on either path, but I also want the path that has some FUN on it.

I remember reading a relationship book years and years ago (I've read 'em all through ALL my Rs) where the husand and wife had all sorts of conflict over all sorts of things. They went to a C who taught them communication skills, and negotiating skills, and goal setting, and methods for affirming each other. They did all these things and the conflicts settled down to a tolerable level. When that happened, they discovered they didn't like each other very much. So they divorced. The guy (who was telling the story) remarried. Someone asked him, do you and your new W have a bunch of conflicts to work through? He said, "He11 no! We just get along!"

One might argue (reasonably so) that he learned many skills in his former R that carried over to the new R. But there are just some people you get along with better than others. Your styles are just more compatible with less work.

Another metaphor springs to mind... that of playing a musical instrument. You can practice and practice and study theory and play the piano flawlessly, but if you are not in love with the instrument, it will show. There's more to success in these matters than technique, and frankly, more than "love" ("whatever that is," to quote Prince Charles-- who by the way, was born one day after me). There's a blend... study, technique, practice, willingness to take risks, then just trusting and letting it fly. In music and in life.

((((JJ))))

JJ,

I'm confident that you enjoyed your 300 lb. Rush Limbaugh analogy. And, no, I wouldn't be sexually attracted.

But I think you're being too hard on yourself, perhaps inadvertantly. The analogy you need to consider for your H is that he woke up one morning and said, "Because you look like Angelina Jolie and not like Jennifer Anniston, I'm not sexually attracted to you enough to have sex 3 times a week and like it." (Kind of like Brad Pitt in reverse.)

IMO, this is NOT about your H's inability to step up to the plate sexually. It's about his unwillingness to practice. Incompatability may be innate in the beginning, but it only continues because of inflexibility.

From Lillieperl:

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I think it's too superficial to reduce your marital crisis to "I'm HD and he's LD and for our marriage to work one or both of us will have to compromise in a way that damages our integrity."

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I'm vigorously nodding. I've polarized on issues many times in my Rs. All the arguments about XXX are never really about XXX. It's about the need to polarize, the need to stake out territory, the need to be right. Not feeling safe enough to compromise.

I know that it's very easy to polarize on even the tiniest of differences. I wish I knew a surefire way to avoid it. I don't. The only thing I would know to do would be to breathe and look deeply within and ask myself what I am doing to contribute to the polarizing and what I might do to nurture a safer environment.

SD wrote

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All the arguments about XXX are never really about XXX. It's about the need to polarize, the need to stake out territory, the need to be right. Not feeling safe enough to compromise.

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Wow. This is good. (And not just because you agree with me. ) I need to ponder this a bunch.

SD, does your name indicate that you are lesbian? Sorry if I'm not remembering enough of your history from what you've written to already know the answer to that. If so... are you familiar with a phenomenon known as "lesbian bed death" wherein sexual activity drops way off in lesbian relationships, eventually ceasing altogether? I read up on it, seeking answers to my sitch. Anyone can go to google and put in this phrase in quotes and get info on it.

What is the generally accepted explanation for it, and do you agree with that explanation?

I believe it's about being too enmeshed, not having enough detachment, differentiation. I'm not sure whether the theory is that the partner is sooo close and familiar that there's not enough oxygen to ignite a spark, or that protecting the sexual space is the only way to preserve any individual identity. Or life gets in the way and resentments build up... I'd believe any or all of the above.

I'm sure JJ is fascinated by all this, too, but I'm going to end the hijack here.

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I believe it's about being too enmeshed, not having enough detachment, differentiation. I'm not sure whether the theory is that the partner is sooo close and familiar that there's not enough oxygen to ignite a spark, or that protecting the sexual space is the only way to preserve any individual identity. Or life gets in the way and resentments build up... I'd believe any or all of the above

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Okay, but if this is the case, why was my H low drive right from the beginning of our relationship and why did two women before me end relationships with him because of his low drive and why has he told me that the reason he only had a few relationships before me was because he didn't have enough drive to pursue women?

Conversely, if my HD is just in response to his LD, why have I consistently been sexual and felt horny on a regular basis since I was 15? I KNOW that if my H suddenly disappeared from planet earth I would still want sex at least 2 or 3 times a week. The only reason that my sex drive is directed at him right now is because I care about being in a relationship with him and I am generally monogamous. I don't mean that I am monogamous in a moral sense. I mean that throughout my life I have never had the tendency to have my sexuality directed at more than one male at a time.

UPDATE

My H's new view on our relationship is that we shouldn't divorce because as soon as he is through dealing with his current employment/financial problems he is going to start working on being sexual again. When I calmly pointed out to him that he makes decisions that put him into these kinds of crisis modes and that he has been LD even when his employment situation was good, he went completely ballistic and smashed a laundry basket and a trash can to bits and punched a hole in a drywall partition.

Earlier we had another discussion about how I'm not doing my part to improve our sexual relationship by being more seductive. I asked him if he could tell me 5 specific things I could do to be more attractive or seductive. He said "I know you think I should just naturally be attracted to you, but would it be beneath you to "slut it up" a bit when the kids aren't around?". Anyone on this BB who knows me well is probably thinking "WTF?" and that was my thought too. I said "Well, the other evening I took off my shirt and started fondling myself in front of you. I'm not sure if I know how to "slut it up" any more than that.". He said "That's not the kind of thing I'm talking about. That's not enough.". I replied "Well then you are going to have to be more specific because I don't want to be held to some nebulous standard of "be more attractive or seductive or slutty"". He said that it made him feel better that I might admit that I am not so sexy that he should automatically be attracted to me. He said that I would be more attractive if I showed more humility about my sexiness. I pointed out that he used to complain that I wasn't sexually confident enough and now he is complaining that I am too sexually confident and yet telling me that I need to "slut it up" some more. I just repeated that he was going to have to be more specific if he wanted me to honor his preferences in this regard.

I am so confused right now.

I'm actually starting to feel sorry for the guy. Some guys I know love to mow the lawn...I hate it. I can't imagine being in a position where I have to mow the lawn to keep my W, but thankfully I can hire a lawn surrogate to satisfy my W.

You know, there's some unique opportunities that happen before a. death, b. job change, and c. divorce. You have almost unlimited freedom. You can take that expensive trip to go base-jumping in Norway before you die. You can call your boss an a$$-hole on your last day of work. And you can ask your H to do whatever the f' you please before you D.

If I was in a position where I had nothing to lose, I'd probably push for an open marriage, swinging or trip to a sex club...I'd take the sexuality up a notch instead of down. Crap, who knows, maybe my W might tap into something that turned her on...or maybe not...whatever.

-Dave
(who shouldn't post after having a couple drinks)

JustJenny, I do not know how to slut-it-up. Ask your H to name a scene in a movie that he thinks is sexy. Also ask him to name an actress about your build and age with a hair style he likes so you have clues as to what H "thinks is attractive and sexy.

My W insist that I get a short hair cut and not have any facial hair or the sex lamp is turned off. I am not in to hair style, so short is OK with me.

My pesonal preference for women as they get older is shorter hair. My W convinced me of that and I agreded with her after looking at several pictures of young and older women.

The hair thing is so easy to change and who knows, you might like shorter hair. I used to like women with long hair when I was 25 but now have grown to like the shorter styles.

OG Lou. Longer than a crew-cut.