My goodness Sal, did your pinky get stuck on the 0?
I don't mind the sun sometime
The images it shows
I can taste you on my lips
And smell you in my clothes
Cinnamon and Sugar
And softly spoken lies
You never know just how you look
Through someone elses eyes
BHS-"Pepper"
No kidding about the stuck pinky, CN...actually I believe it was 33000...can you believe that?
Quote: Sally, What are your plans with respect to the money?
Are you going to confront him with it?
I have to say that I had NO idea it was that kind of money. That's a lot of cabbage!
HP
Actually though, I wasn't that surprised. I had seen his statements but was thinking it was more along the line of 26000. I don't think I need to confront him with it. FWIW, and as much as it appears otherwise from what I've posted he's not an idiot...he's got to see that he's in deep financial doo doo here. I think confronting about it will just help him with the whole "big mean mommy" thing he trys to turn me into...funny cuz I am NOT that woman. It's just another way of blaming me for his problems.
At some point he'll probably make some comment about how we can't (insert something reasonable that costs money here, like re-tile bathrooms, take a vacation) because *I* don't contribute enough to the family financial situation I just got a real job after years of planning my life around the kids...working, but not making as much money as I can potentially. However, I managed to raise two amazing teenagers and accomplish tons of other things (finishing my degree, etc) and still bring home close to what I would have made if I had been working full time plus paying for day care...and was still around for the kids.
So anyway (now that I'm done tooting my horn) if I can manage to NOT say something like, "well I'm sure your little stripper buddies are taking a nice vacation this year, with all the money you threw at them", it will be a miracle.
Again though, feeds his little internal drama. But the subject will come up. I'm thinking about being reasonable and suggesting that he file bankruptcy. I have a feeling he's considering it already anyway, but wouldn't have the nerve without a little push. Frankly I don't think he deserves to get off that easy, but I have myself to consider. And since the bills are all in his name, it really doesn't hurt my credit directly.
He is really being an angel lately. I'm afraid what will happen when he's "done" with whatever happens with his DWI...will he go back to the same behavior?
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
MustangSally Your H needs to pay off what he owes. Filing bankruptcy just lets him off the hook for HIS irresponsible behaviors. That only teaches him that he can screw up and get away with it.
I agree with you Lou, in theory, but what if he gets hit by a truck tomorrow and I stuck with two kids and a mortage and either paying for his previous lap dances or filing for bankruptcy myself?
I think it will be almost enough punishment for him, knowing his personality and his pride in his "perfect credit" to file.
I hesitate to bring up bankruptcy for precisely the reason you mention but I have to worry about how I'll help my daughter get through college, etc with that crazy debt hanging over our heads.
I don't know what the solution is, filing for BR feeds directly into his "not taking responsibility" problem and yet I can't imagine how we will ever, ever, ever, pay this off...we are far from rich. It boggles my mind that he has let this happen.
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
and now, re reading, for some reason, the $$$ are the least of my worries...I need to get the marriage stuff together.
He's got so many other problems (the DWI could end up costing his job, for example, if they find out) that frankly, he could really crack...he puts up a strong front but I'm afraid he's torn up inside...wish I could be the person that reaches him but apparently I'm not, anymore.
He's out of town for a couple of days and frankly I'm just enjoying the peace...he left this afternoon. I wish I could take off work and just hang around at home and get stuff done.
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
So, what would you like to see happen in your marriage?
Where do you want it to go from here?
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
MustangSally asked
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I agree with you Lou, in theory, but what if he gets hit by a truck tomorrow and I stuck with two kids and a mortage and either paying for his previous lap dances or filing for bankruptcy myself?
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If something happens that you are stuck with the bills, Yes, then file BR.
I worked in a deliquent boys group home. The ones that had the most problems (never took responsability for their actions) were the ones that had someone bailing them out. In order for some people to mature, they have to go through the fire and sometimes they have to go through the fire several times.
If you say he at a breaking point, you do not have to act sarcastic toward your H. You can minimually support him. It is his debt. It was his choice to get the lap dances.
Did the credit card company hire the lap dancers? Did the credit card company benefit from the lap dances? No to both.
The credit card acted as an agent of your H. The credit card company pair your H debt, your H promiced to repay the credit card company for what amounts to a short term loan. So Why should the credit card company not collect its loan payments it made to your H?
I might be in a minority, but I see not paying for bills for non esentials fun things similar to not paying a gambeling debt. You lose and cant afford it, you pay anyway. Can't pay, you never should have played.
Believe it or not, not paying to me is simmilar to shop lifting non-life support items. With shop lifting you never intended to pay, with bankruptcy you decided not to pay after the goods were delivered. The main difference is when you decided not to pay.
Too many people stick someone else with the bills for their fun. Extreme medical bills, deaths, and similar tragic events are the exceptions, where bankruptcy are or might be justified.
I have customers that take expensive vacations, buy new cars and trucks, have nice buildings and then file bankruptcy, while I work 6 days a week drive 10 and 15 year old cars. I am out $300 while they had fun and never really worked that hard. Why should I pay for their fun?
I also have mom and pop customers where one gets sick and calls me to say they will be a little late paying for their printer repair. They eventually pay. If their situation is bad enough I re-write the bill and sell them the supplies at my cost.
MustangSally, this post is not about you. It is about your H. Sorry your H put your family in this situation.
OG Lou Standing on my own two feet. Learned a long time ago "Dont play if you cant pay" (end of soap box)
First of all NOPkins, I want to acknowledge your question and I need to think of a realistic answer. Being realistic is the tough part.
And OG_Lou, I don't know what to tell you. I agree with you 100%. I don't want to make excuses. I guess the closest I can come up with an "excuse" is that why do the idiot credit cards let someone with a high school education, working class job, have credit almost up to his total annual income? In fact, his available credit is probably more than he makes in a year, he just hasn't *quite* maxed out the cards. His minimum payments probably pretty much equal his take home pay.
Still, I think he is responsible for his own actions. I can't even imagine where his brain was at, spending that kind of money (or maybe we all know what he was thinking with).
And if he were to get hit by that hypothetical truck, I file for BR, get stuck with no credit available to me for how many years? I must admit, that's one of the appealing parts of this, he'll stop getting those "you've been approved" CC things in the mail...or at least he won't be getting cards with $12000 limits any more.
As far as your boys home...you're right, people who get bailed out never learn. We've never been bailed out in our lives, in fact H has been on his own pretty much since he was 16, self supporting, paying his own bills, rent, buying his own car.
Maybe even that ^^^ is a bit of the problem, he's trying to live out the teenage years he didn't really get to live? I'm not going to analyze it. I don't know. A huge lapse of sanity in an otherwise normal guy? I do think he is/was suffering from clinical depression and apparently this was his *high*.
Either way, I'm trying to find a way to handle this. He's 46 years old, he will never pay this off. It doesn't seem right to make my kids pay for this (yeah, I know, it's not right for the CC's to pay it either). I haven't done all the math yet, but I wonder how we'll afford college expenses, pull them out of private school now?(most of their tuition is paid by a grant)...My 16 year old daughter is already working so that she can get the "extras" a lot of kids would consider essentials.
I dunno. I don't want to pretend I think this is right or fair. It is very wrong. I strongly believe he deserves to pay those bills. I don't know what to do though. Maybe this is one way that he gets all the effects of his problems...he gets his credit screwed up, mine stays clear, he can't push other expenses off on me that he should be contributing to, but can't, because of his past "expenditures".
I'm just rambling...I honestly wish there was some way to take back the $$$ from the club owners, and even THAT isn't right. (let the girls have their money...)
Anyway, we work hard, drive old cars (I just got a "new" used car, because my old 15 year old car was literally falling apart). You would think we lived an extravagant lifestyle, considering the fact that we can afford to support strippers...but we live in a small house, in a not great neighborhood. I don't want to complain, just want to make sure you know that, otherwise, we are not blowing money left and right, we don't take vacations...
I guess, re reading this, it all sounds like excuses. I think I'm considering doing things I never thought I would do, just to get through all this and keep our lives somewhat intact. If he lived alone, I think he would deserve to lose his house and his car and whatever else it takes to pay that bill.
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
Sally, What about gently confronting him? In a calm voice and a supportive demeanor, approach him and ask what his plans are for paying down this debt. I think avoiding the elephant in the room with you is not the wisest thing to do, considering that you are married and 50% of that debt is presumably yours. But I don't think that attacking him is going to work either. Maybe a calm and practical approach would help him face up to the mess he has made of his life.
What are you afraid will happen if you confront him?
he's not an idiot...he's got to see that he's in deep financial doo doo here. I think confronting about it will just help him with the whole "big mean mommy" thing he trys to turn me into...funny cuz I am NOT that woman. It's just another way of blaming me for his problems.