Quote: What made him realize he has been hurting the marriage?
Forgot to answer that question. I think what made him realize he had been hurting it was seeing how much nicer of a person I was when I felt porn wasn't standing between us.
Thanks MM...nice to know someone else has been in a similar sitch. One thing about my alcoholic hubby was he liked having sex. Sometimes I think it would be better to have stayed with him: at least I knew it was about the beer and not about me. In this siuation, I'm not quite to that point yet.
So tell me, mystic MM, what is your magical formula for getting out of this situation (while staying in this marriage) and still keeping my sanity?!
I'm sure you wouldn't have left your alcoholic H if his drinking didn't have a negative effect on your marriage. I'm sure you wouldn't care about your H's use of porn if you didn't feel that it had a negative effect on your relationship. Figure out exactly what it is that you need that you're not getting in your relationship. Demand that your H makes a reasonable attempt to meet your reasonable demands. Don't give up or give in on any issue that compromises your integrity or self-worth. If your H needs to give up porn in order to meet your needs, let him be the one to come to that conclusion. It's not your job to "fix" him. Your job is to standup for yourself and your very valid needs.
Try this. Tell your H "I would like to have sex tonight. Can we make a date for 8 pm.". If he says "No" ask him if he has any suggestions for how you might find sexual satisfaction since he is unwilling to oblige. If he offers to babysit while you go to the bar, take him up on his offer. You get the gist. I'm only kind of kidding.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Was there a specific issue for the counseling such as sex, or just general marital issues?
What does your husband do with his time?
Thanks, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
The counseling was specifically about our sex issues. With his spare time (he works about 10 hours a day at an office job), H likes to watch TV, watch TV, and (sometimes) watch TV.
Quote: Demand that your H makes a reasonable attempt to meet your reasonable demands. Don't give up or give in on any issue that compromises your integrity or self-worth.
You see...this is the part of "differentiation" that is difficult for me (though I admit I have understood this concept more clearly at other times). How do I demand without being a b*tch? (Or does that even matter?) How do I not give in on any issue that compromises my integrity...without just leaving him? Because I REALLY honestly feel I have tried every approach to this situation and he shows very little long-term interest in improving it. He will "give in" in the short run to appease me and keep me around a bit longer, but then we fall into this pattern where I get desperate again and make ultimatums and he improves...then things go back to normal and blah blah blah.
Quote: Tell your H "I would like to have sex tonight. Can we make a date for 8 pm.". If he says "No" ask him if he has any suggestions for how you might find sexual satisfaction since he is unwilling to oblige.
That's an easy one. He'll just tell me to go into the bedroom and play with my vibrator. And he won't even really care if I do - he'll probably be relieved 'cuz it takes the pressure off of him. Besides it doesn't really solve the problem which is I want to be desired and wanted by my H who I love and want to be close to. I can play with my vibrator when he's not home. When he's home, I want HIM.
This is why I know an affair would not work for me. Because it's not just about the sex. It's about being wanted and desired by the man I love and who proclaims his undying love for me.
And here is one of those times (I mentioned before) where I play the conversation in my head and I already know the outcome:
Me: Hey, honey, I would really like to have some hot lovin' with you tonight after the kids go to bed. Can we make a date for 8 p.m.?
H: We'll see.
Me: No, I'm serious. I want this to be something we plan on for later.
H: I worked 10 hours today! Give me a break!
Me: Well I worked hard today, too, honey. But I want to be close to you.
H: The weekend is coming up. Come pester me then.
It is this neverending...NEVERENDING...cycle of excuses with him. He wears me down. I can go on and on from every angle, but in the end I just get tired of feeling like I am at the point where I am BEGGING MY OWN HUSBAND TO HAVE SEX WITH ME!
Perhaps you need to be very specific in your demands and in stating the consequences of your demands not being met. You might have to go so far as to say "I want to have sex on Wednesday, Friday and Sunday. Your decision to meet or not meet my needs/wants in this regard will give me a clear signal about how much you care about this relationship. I am unwilling to stay in a passion-free marriage. Ask yourself "Is not having passionate sex with my wife more important than saving my marriage?". You are the only one who can answer this question. I eagerly await your decision.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Seriously, in essence, isn't a statement like that basically an ultimatum or a threat? And if he doesn't come through for me, then don't I have to then follow through and leave him? You see, that's what I don't like about ultimatums: I might not actually be willing to follow through with that one. And, knowing how important our marriage is to me, he might realize that and call my bluff.
I'm not saying I'm unwilling to give him such a "put up or shut up" demand. I am totally willing to do it. What I'm not sure I'm willing to do is live with the consequences if he DOESN'T heed my warning.
Am I making any sense here??? It's kinda like telling your kid "If you don't stop fighting I'm going to pull this car over and make you walk to grandma's house!" but you wouldn't really do it and they KNOW you wouldn't. This is why, as parents, we are smarter to give demands we know we will follow through on, like "If you don't stop fighting we are turning around and going home and you are going to spend the rest of the day in your room." What is the marital threat equivalent of this? "If you don't start putting out I am not going to do your laundry and make your dinner anymore?"
You are totally making sense. If you are willing to stay in your marriage as it is, then you shouldn't make an empty threat about leaving. Consider this. In your above post, you said that the sich was making you practically suicidal. How could following through on leaving him if he is unwilling to attempt to meet your needs be any worse. The problem that you and I share is that we let it get this bad before being willing to take a stand.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
I agree with NOPkins about making a schedule. H and I had a very erratic sex life, and the thing that got us on our way was the once a week date nite which we both made a commitment to-- no ifs, ands or buts.
Believe it or not, we still mess it up...last Sat( our date nite) H made some unflattering remarks to me which I called him on, confronted him on his need to get me upset to ignite passion, etc etc etc...BUT we still ML. It keeps the connection going while we work out the issues.
IHJ---who will bring up going to a sleazy sex store again on Sat because I am strong, confident and differentiated ( yeah right)
