Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Midlife Crisis WAW to MLC XH bookends (it's complicated!)

Good Morning Un

Please stick to one thread. It keeps things clearer and easier for folks following along.



MLCers do tend to become narcissistic. They are so absorbed, consumed, by their pain and torment, by their running from it. They lack empathy. Their running is about them. Their emotions are cranked to eleven and they simply have no bandwidth for anything or anyone else.

Are they narcissists? Or more a symptom of the crisis they are lost within?

For those true narcissists, it’s another personality characteristic for them to work through on top of everything else.


Not really. Your DBing, your coping will be the same.

MLC is highly covert. They suffer an internal struggle with their demons. The cause of which they do not even realize, never mind understand. Their progression is glacially slow and internal.

Their running behaviour usually becomes quite overt. There are two types here: wallower and the highly energetic ones. The wallowers are more sullen and will brood and more display that all-present consuming depression. The energetic type burns the candle at both ends. More continually showing how great and wonderful their life is.

It is a spectrum of course, just being how overtly and far one leans towards whichever end of the scale. Most MLCers settle into “their” pattern, remaining such for their journey.

The type of running behaviour is separate from their energy level. Spending, drinking, drugs, fast cars, fast partners, affairs, shoplifting, theft, illegal and illicit activities, and so on. Again, a spectrum. How far they “need” to go depends upon the person and their pains, past, coping skills, etc.


It is always best to do your inner work. Become the best you possible.

“and don’t look back?” The past is immutable. Unchangeable. Look forward. Like a car, the windshield is far bigger than the rear view mirror for a reason, for that’s the direction you’re going.

The future is full of possibilities. It’s where hope lives. Where healed and whole lives. Where happiness and joy awaits.

Live your present moment. Fully. That requires some looking back, and some looking/planning forward. Slowly you accept your past. Slowly you pull your desired future forward. Slowly your present changes. The joy and happiness, the whole and heal, becomes the now. Living and loving life.

You will look back at times. It’s ok. It’s your past and lots of good lessons/wisdom there. Just don’t get lost going down memory road.

You will look forward at times. It’s ok. That’s where you’re heading. Figure out your headings and work towards them.

Live the present moment. Be grounded in the here and now. The past is immutable, the future ain’t here yet, the present is all you got. Embrace it.

D

I ask because after several intense therapy sessions, it has been brought to light that I was raised by a covert narcissist.. and married one. EXH's brother is an overt narcissist, who emotionally abuses H (I've witnessed it, and it's heartbreaking!) and physically abused EXH as a child. So in saying don't look back, I mean how likely is a narcissist to truly going to want to change if they've found a fresh supply? How does this change the way you DB, if you decide to stand? I'm looking for advice from someone who has stood for one. The extra challenge is standing while working on changing your own narcissistic traits you've picked up... are you more likely to flub DBing? He stopped calling me at the end of August, so we're now at no contact... which means I have no idea what's going on with him. He's never really shown an interest in the boys, so the lack of communication with them is no surprise... if he did call them, it was to see how I was. They know to give him short answers when it comes to me. My mind is so much clearer now, and now I'm cycling through all the stages, but with my rose coloured glasses off. My compassion says wait it out, learn the skills I need to neutralize his power moves, in the meantime... and hold faith that he finds the strength to seek professional help. One positive is that everything I thought I knew about my/our past has shifted in perspective, and I have a lot of work to do on myself... so finding less and less time to worry about him.

Good Morning Un


Most people only change when the pain of not outweighs the pain of growth.

My experience is the vast majority of people do want change. They like being comfortable. Even positive change is balked at. Think software updates. Arggg. Not another one. I know and like how it works now. I don’t want to learn the new and improved stuff. (Of course, new and improved is questionable when considering software. At any rate, just illustrating.)

Change is more force upon than wanted. It is a rare person who looks to change and grow.



DB in a nutshell. Your past relationship crashed and burned. If you both go back as is, things just repeat.

The LBS, usually being the more rational one, more willing one, does their inner work. Grows. Evolves. The spouse notices and becomes interested.


Absolutely. Yes.

Once you heal and grow, you will not want nor accept a narcissist as a partner. You’ll place a rock solid boundary and let the chips fall where they will.

Then, it is up to H to step up and change. Or not.

You’re fine either way.


I think with willingness to look inward, see yourself, you’ll do fine. Most flubs come from emotional reactionary outbursts. You know that which you control. I believe you’ve got a good handle on yourself.

Coupled with the rose-coloured glasses being off. You are seeing clearer. Keep walking the path.

You can only do your part in all this. Like the lighthouse, you shine. Yet, a stubborn captain could still ignore and crash upon the rocks.

Do the best you can on that which you can, and give the rest to God.

Hope you’re having a wonderful Sunday.

D

So, was really touched at how many people were inspired to change their lives by the quote "If you can't love yourself, how the hell you gonna love somebody else?", and very stupidly thought it might be something I could share with him.So yes, did text it to him.

X: ???
Me: I hope you're taking care of yourself.
X: (an hour and a half later) Yes for once
Me: That's good.
X: You?

I never replied. Super flub on my part for sending it! Learned my lesson... still our fault that his life is the way it is. No more texts. If he contacts us someday, I know for sure not to mention anything about his mental health... he was open to it before S2 moved in/Uncle's death happened... no more texts to let him know we're still here from now on.

Had a big shift in attitude towards the whole sitch last night, after having to pay someone to help remove a stubborn rusty nut from under the sink... furious that we're struggling while he's off living his easy peasy life... he mentioned awhile back that there was no effort required with his OW (if they are still together, they APPARENTLY have an understanding that they are not in a relationship), and at the same time he mentioned he's staying at his one job because it's easy. I don't have time for his poor me crap. Yes, today is an angry day... I'm just fed up and am taking initiative think like a single mom, and assume it's going to stay that way for quite a long time!

Huge shift in work sitch, so really don't have patience for much right now. Had to tell my unofficial business partner that I can't take over the store... so the boys and I are shooting out resumes left, right, and center! We're on our own now... he puts a tiny bit of money in the boys' accounts, but not enough to get desperately needed new clothes and they both have cell phones that should have been replaced years ago... it's not worth contacting him and hearing the self-importance in his voice that we need him... especially since he can turn on a dime and throw it back on us that it's a hassle.

I'm getting much better at not getting triggered by every 20-something looking female that I see and wondering "Is that what she looks like?" Less triggered by books (I've been moving Smut/Romance to a new place in the store for the last while, and the amount of "older man" stories is pretty noticeable), TV and movies.

I know it's only been a few months since the reconnection attempt got the huge derailment, but it honestly feels like forever. Going dark on my side was the best decision I've made, and at this point I'm kind of relieved that he hasn't called me... still hurts that he has no need for any sort of communication/relationship with the boys. I know if it doesn't bother them, it shouldn't bother me... but it does.

Onward and upwards it is for us!

Good Morning Un

Oh my yes. Working under a sink is one of my least favourite jobs. Laying on your back, on a shelf, very uncomfortable. Reaching upward into that small space. Arms going numb from being elevated. Knuckles skinned from scrapping on all the sharp bits and pieces.

I’m sorry to hear about your work/financial stress. Hoping that you all get positive replies to your resumes.

D

Went to get my hot choffee for my usual sunrise over the ocean gratitude ritual... the young fella not only flirted with me, but he didn't charge me for my drink AND also gave me a stamp so my next one is free too! I think is the first time that I didn't feel like I was manipulating someone.... I actually took it for the compliment it was! GALing sure does take some getting used to, but to have other people notice the different energy I'm putting out there is pretty cool!

Other co-owner filling in for us today, so made a luxurious breakfast for us and the boys and I sat at the table to eat it. We've decided that we're going to make that a regular occurrence. Going hiking later, maybe get some gardening and cleaning done.

Found a journal page last night that I had done when I was pregnant with S19... XH was claiming that my morning sickness was "convenient"... boy, that sure helped with the GALing today! It's amazing what you see with RCG off!

So, update.... S (now 20!) had his birthday at the start of the week. The day before S17 received 3 texts from XH reminding us that it was S19's birthday the next day, and he sent money to make sure that we went out for dinner and got a cake. I texted that I appreciate that, and I sent him a picture of S20 eating his birthday meal, and then sent him a picture of the cake later. He then sent me a picture of the place where he was staying while working out of town for 3 days. He then joked about imagining living in a place where you get to wake up every day looking at a bay (I go every morning to the bay where I live to watch the sun rise).

I guess the no contact gave him some time to think.... yesterday he texted S17 to tell him he put money in so we could buy the stuff we need for Thanksgiving dinner. Again, texted my appreciation, and asked how his trip was. We then got into a conversation about his work... lengthy chunks on his side, short validating comments on my side. If he is still with OW, there really must not be anything between them other than sexual, because this is very much how his attempt at reconnection in June started. I'm at the point that I have no interest in knowing ewhether she's still in the picture or not. One of the comments he made was that someone had to go back to finish the job, and it would probably be him because the other guys have families at home.

For me for the last while, I've been cycling through anger, withdrawl, and depression in shorter bouts... and with being in contact again, I've finally gotten to acceptance. I think this is because I know he's OK. I don't wait around for him to contact me, but it's nice when he does. Nice in a hearing from someone you haven't talked to in a while kind of way, not emotional. For an emote like me, this is HUGE! His loneliness isn't affecting me anymore. I'm not freaking out when his name pops up on my phone. Leaving him to initiate contact, and not sharing anything about what we're up to here. I think I'm finally getting a hang on detaching!!!

I'm at peace again, and I'm focusing on the boys and I. S17 and I went on a 2 day road trip a week ago... the scenery was beautiful!

Very excited, because now that fall/winter hours have begun at work, we have 3 days off a week! We've created a sourdough starter named Audrey, and I'm going to be spending more time teaching the boys life and social skills. Way more time for cooking, walks, and gardening...and we are all going to learn how to bake and do home repairs.

Good Morning Un


Yes, it sounds like you are detached pretty well. Nice when our emotions aren’t dragging us all over the place, isn’t it.

These situations, this grief, is multi-faceted. There are many bits and pieces. As time goes on we put them together much like a jigsaw puzzle. Slowly building/rebuilding ourselves in the process.

At bomb drop, everything was new, we are in utter shock, and every piece starts in denial. We only have a certain amount of bandwidth and time and resources, and as such grief happens piecemeal-wise. A few facets/items getting our attention and progression at a time.

Months (years) in, some of those bits/facets have indeed progressed to acceptance, others are in the stage of anger, others bargaining, others we are depressed about, and still more lay unknown in denial. Perfectly normal this spread across the grief process; only so much time and bandwidth.

This is why we move between stages; experience setbacks, backslides, and such. They’re not really backslides, just seems like it as another piece comes to the fore. Slowly, more and more facets become accepted.

Therefore to assess, or state where one is within grief is difficult. For all the time after the initial shock until full acceptance we are within multiple stages. In fact, we are within all stages for most of the time until that last “bit” leaves denial and starts progressing. Thus, as a rule of thumb, where one is experiencing the bulk of their processing - realizing we are experiencing all stages - is where one is along their grief path.

To compound the stages of grief - or maybe companion the stages is more apt - is detachment, indifference, and the return of your feelings.

I do believe you have found detachment and are entering indifference. Ah, indifference, a time when our feelings toward our spouse are greatly attenuated or numbed. You recognized how you can hear from H, and are non-emotional. Detached and indifferent.

Indifference brings a wonderful peace with it. Make the most of this temporary numbness. This is truly a golden opportunity, a time when you can dig deep within yourself and discover your deeply held beliefs and values, while free from the cacophony of H and his behaviours.

After categorizing your convictions and biases and prejudices. Strengthen that which serves. Craft that which inspires. Discard or alter that which does not, or no longer, serves.

I also will pass on a caution. While indifferent, other feelings will loom larger than they really. Other feelings will seem very large against the void of what once was. This is a time of temptations. Remember, decisions made based on emotions lead to regret. This time of unfeeling is temporary.

Indifference, like all feelings, does flit. It does unwind. The numbness retreats. The old feelings, the old love, does return. However, for those who have done the inner work, made the most of their golden opportunity, this unwinding is not a big deal. In fact, the feelings returning gives substance to one’s immutable past. Thus, more a companion along the journey, rather than compounding it.

When indifference unwinds, grief takes another palpable hit. That unfeeling provided relief. Made it seem or feel we were further along in our grief than we are. Oddly, that return, that hit, provides a boosts to our progress. Usually jump starting one’s realization and exiting of bargaining. Their “acceptance” that the old normal is gone and they must embrace their new normal. And thus ushering in depression.

It’s a strange thing when acceptance happens. It just kind of appears. The dark depression slowly gives way. No big fan-fare. No real warning. One day you just kind of realize it. You hear birds again. You see colors again. The world is not the gray as it has seemed. You’ve worked through those facets.

Don’t fret over it. Grief lasts as long as it does. It will end when it will, and not one second earlier. It’s hard to believe, yet time really is a gift.


Wonderful stuff!

An excellent investment of that gift of time.

D

OK, so it seems acceptance just became another spot in cycling... but at least it's part of the rotation now. I'm guessing as time goes on, there'll be more days of acceptance and less of the depression, sadness, anger....? For example, yesterday and today I am sad and wish I could just hold him in my arms to comfort him. I had a few hours of depression, but it's mostly just been a general sadness about how lost he is. For me the difference between sadness and depression is the ability to function... sadness is that surface feeling as you go about your day, but your brain isn't murky. Depression is laying in bed all day, obsessively thinking about it all.

Made some half decent goods with Audrey, made pancakes a few days in a row and they got better each time. Working on a buttermilk honey biscuit recipe, but for health reasons they're full multigrain. Have to tweak a few more things, but I think I'm almost there! The boys and I did some more gardening today... nice days for it between rain, now that we're in autumn.

... and today back to acceptance and detachment! All while not GALing, just getting some rest. I think there is a benefit to mulling things over while in detachment, as it kind of gives you a chance to look at and react to past and future scenarios that may come up without pressure. Of course, I'm saying this as someone with ADHD and autistic traits. It gives me great comfort to prepare, even if the outcome may not be anything I was ready for. It gives me a chance to prepare relatively non-emotion-based responses.

The next three days are chock-full of GALing, and I am ready for them! I am beginning a really cool 3 week program that explores self-development, and the boys and I are attending some great business events... including a breakfast!
We are still waiting to hear if we got the space for our business... keep your fingers crossed!!!