Hi Card; I am sorry to hear this. You have really been hit with a double whammy with the marital issues and your W's health problems.
Originally Posted by Card29
Another aspect of this I'll jot down. We have a decent age difference. I was her first serious R. I was aware of this and waited longer than I initially wanted to propose. I wanted to see if she really wanted to stay, and she was unwavering until 12 months ago, or less. But I wonder if some of this is just her wanting to explore, like she got into a serious R before she knew enough about herself. I don't think there's going to be clean understanding due to how MS also changed her brain and body over the last 6+ years.
I empathize with you here. 11+ year age difference between me and W. Each of us only had one serious R before we met each other. ("Serious" basically translates as we each did some sexual stuff with our previous partners but neither was anybody we should have thought about staying with). I had plenty of dates but few that showed promise of leading to an R. I never really regretted the end of my dating life. I was glad to be out of that scene when I met W and she made me very content.
Her...I am now not so sure. She always had body image issues related to her weight. She had weight loss surgery and lost around 125 pounds, which is fine. Now she is going through cosmetic surgery not only to deal with the aftermath of the weight loss, but to fix other "flaws" like loose skin on her arms, sagging breasts, etc. She's now wearing bikinis, which she would not been have caught dead in before.
It's hard not to suspect that she might be thinking, "Hey, I never had much in the way of Rs earlier in my life...I'm still in my 40s...do I really want to be with this guy who will be 60 next year? Taking care of him in his 70s when I'm still pretty young?" (She's very attractive btw).
MS is a tough haul to deal with, in oneself or a loved one. I have a friend who has it plus other health issues (almost died of COVID). He has mentioned that it is definitely affecting his marriage but hasn't gone into details.
You have more experience on this board than I do, so I'm sure you know what it offers. It's a hard road, but you won't walk it alone.
Me 59 W 47 T 26 M 23 S18, S14 BD May 2023 D filed June 2023 OM1 confirmed: December 2023 OM2 confirmed: October 2023
Oh Card I am so sorry to read this. I remember that feeling all too well, the feeling someone has physically ripped your heart out, you can’t breathe, you can’t eat, the stress of it all is exhausting and painful. Let the emotions go, cry when you need to cry, exercise if you can ( it’s a huge help to go to the gym or hit a boxing bag anything to get the blood flowing no matter how depleted you feel).
It sounds like your W is not in a good place at all and running. Running from problems and running from life. There would be a lot to unpack there for her but like I said at least she is seeking counselling which I think is a big tick. Whether it helps nobody knows. These are her issues and hers alone to try and work through. We can only support we can’t fix. You need to start looking after yourself and the kids of course while being there to support W when she needs it. Remember whatever she is going through, whatever destructive path she is going down, don’t let her take you down with her. She can destroy her life bur don’t let her destroy yours too. She is obviously going through a lot I would say depression is in there ( postnatal quite possibly) the thrifting you mentioned that’s her escape you said she likes it, she was obviously in a down mood and needed to fulfill her needs of making herself happier at that point and that involves shopping. I think you need to let her do what makes her feel better for now no matter how selfish that is if her. She’s trying to navigate a dark time in her life. Just be sure to have your boundaries where it affects you.
In regard to support I am so sorry to hear you feel you have nobody. Keep posting on here there’s a lot of people around that can be an ear, journaling is great. What about searching up any local support groups in your area? I am not sure if there’s specific groups around for spouses that have been left or marital issues? Are you seeing a counsellor yourself alone ? May be worth asking them as to what else can be done to get you better support. Remember you need to be there for the kids now, you need to be your best version. Read DR again. Remind yourself how to GAL because honestly at the start you feel like you’re faking to make it and then one day everything just feels so much better
Thank you for your thoughts Pattnee. I definitely need to re-read DB as it’s been many years. I’ve read through Sandi’s rules. I dont know if there were 37 of them 9 years ago, but the ones I recognized, I remembered word for word. I read them so many times the first time. It [censored] that I have experience with this l, but I can already tell a difference this time. First D, I begged, cried, pleaded for weeks before I found DB, and the half ignored the rules for another few weeks before mostly getting it.
I will be sure to exercise. We’ll see what the house arrangements will be, but for now she’s staying at a friend’s house. I have the kids. Problem is S1 goes to sleep at like 6pm right now, so I’ll have to be creative in GAL.
I feel a little less lonely now than I did today. I reached out to a friend who moved away a couple years ago. We’ve chatted here and there and hung out when he was back home visiting, but I felt like we had drifted. We talked for an hour and it was great. He was so supportive and understanding. I also spoke with my sister, BIL and there little kids on facetime. That boosted me, too.
D11 was so happy to come back to me (week on / week off) and see S1. She’s an amazing big sister. But I’m dreading telling her what’s going on. I’m hoping to wait until after counseling on thursday, but we’ll see. At dinner, she was asking where W was. She assumed she was working late. “I’m glad she usually doesn’t have to work late normally”. D11 adores her step mom, it’s going to hurt. I already know to tell her it’s not her fault. Anyone have more advice?
Me 38, WAW 30 D11 (former marriage) S2 T 8 years M 3 years BD 8/20/23 S 8/20/23
Hi Sunflyer, thanks for your thoughts. I’m sorry you’re going through this, too. It sounds like your W is going through chaos, too. I’m probably mind reading with the “wanting to explore” thoughts. Easy to do when we’re vulnerable.
My XW battled/battles severe depression and I know that was a factor in our D. Unfortunately MS seems to be just as destructive. Everyone’s MS is different, but W’s has been unrelenting, plus she was diagnosed 10-20 years before most people get it. I think she feels her life slipping away.
Me 38, WAW 30 D11 (former marriage) S2 T 8 years M 3 years BD 8/20/23 S 8/20/23
So glad you feel less lonely too. What about hobbies? Things you can do at home to GAL and occupy yourself( please don’t video game or drink because that’s my H issue and that’s not constructive at all) I have started to enjoy having a bath, or watching movies with D14 ( the notebook the other night her request), board games. You may find solo things and hobbies you may like? Building things? Painting? Puzzles? Social is good I invite people over but I know you don’t have anyone around. Don’t be scared to reach out to old friends and chat? Maybe look into support groups for this that maybe have virtual meetings? Anything that stops you sitting around and wallowing in your thoughts and distracts you is a success in my eyes. MS is a horrible disease and W is most likely petrified and pushing away people in fear of not dragging them down with her. Maybe she feels she doesn’t want to ruin your life? There would be more underlying factors and issues. People handle medical crisis and issues very differently. Withdrawing is common for many. I really feel for your wife she must be also struggling with the idea that she can’t be a good mother to your son as she progresses or maybe even questioning her mortality and how long she will get to see when do things It really is horrible.
In regard to what to tell your D11 for now I would just tell her she’s having a bit of a hard time and having some space. I don’t think you need to bring her into all the emotional side of things. The less they know for now the better. Until you both have a more solid idea of what’s going on at least. She will click on, kids are smart and know more than you think. It’s also ok for her to see you sad or cry. Emotions are so healthy and kids need to understand it’s ok to cry. My kids often saw me teary in the early days and I would just say “ I just miss dad and am sad and it’s ok to cry when we are sad or miss someone” .Mind you it’s only if they saw me I always made sure to try and hide it as best as I could but I remember those early days were very hard.
Sun I’m so sorry to hear about your wife too. I don’t know if age matters. Maybe it does. H is 49 I am 41. I’ve never thought about the age difference even though he looks older than me. I always saw us as equals. He did used to say he was jealous of me but I think that’s just him and he’s always jealous of everyone. I was prepared to grow old with him even though he would age and have more issues sooner than me. age is Just a number but in a MLc they certainly start to question their mortality and their life and everything they think they miss
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
Hi Sunflyer, thanks for your thoughts. I’m sorry you’re going through this, too. It sounds like your W is going through chaos, too. I’m probably mind reading with the “wanting to explore” thoughts. Easy to do when we’re vulnerable.
Yes, trying to read the tea leaves is, in the end, not productive. Plenty for us to do looking after our side of the street.
Pattnee's suggestions are good. I do some of those things myself during the times I can't GAL outside of the house. I find it hard to be bored.
Me 59 W 47 T 26 M 23 S18, S14 BD May 2023 D filed June 2023 OM1 confirmed: December 2023 OM2 confirmed: October 2023
I like the idea of thinking of some nice hobbies as part of GAL. I did sell my friend system a little short. I definitely lack the classic, “lifelong buddies” friendships that seemingly everyone else has. But I’ve told a couple friends in town and they have been a great ear. I’ll be sure to find some time to hang out with them regularly, even if it’s popping by for a 1/2 hour after work before S1 needs to go down.
Normally I have no problem with crying (it’s usually happy tears, to be honest), but I’ve hardly shed a tear yet. Wish I could. Instead I have the chest tightness, nausea, etc. Feels much better atm after a couple of good phone calls, though
Thank you for the support
Me 38, WAW 30 D11 (former marriage) S2 T 8 years M 3 years BD 8/20/23 S 8/20/23
You are probably just numb. And emotionally guarded. I am sure the flood gates may open. And even if they don’t we all deal with grief differently. Unfortunately as a female we are super emotional and cry a lot haha or at least I did. In regard to “lifelong” friends the good thing is it’s never too late to form new friendships. My H is in a very silly position whereby he has no friends other than a handful of school friends from 30 years ago. Even though he has lived in our state for 20 years and had “ friends” along the way from work, he lets those friendships go. Friendships take work to form and maintain. I guess as with everything it’s put in the too hard basket. He is also an introvert so I suppose that’s out of his comfort zone. He would have benefitted from friends now while he goes through his MLC
It’s never too late to make new friends. Find a local hobby, maybe a sport? Or something that involves groups of people whereby friendships can form? There’s always so many things, there’s running groups if you like being fit, or else what about other dads in your community with young kids? Don’t put so much pressure on yourself right now to change everything at one. Allow the emotions and grief to flow and don’t look more than a day ahead. Wake up every day and find 3 positive things to do just for you. On days I am busy it can even just be something simple like a bath, or putting on my favourite music while I finish dinner.
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
I am sorry you find yourself here again. I am copying Cadet’s welcoming thread for your reference; lots of useful information in those link, included those abbreviations.
I’m glad you are dusting off divorce busting and know the wisdom in letting go, keeping pressure to a minimum, and not to pursue. Do re-read DR, there is plenty you can do in your situation.
I look forward to conversing with you.
D
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Welcome to the board.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by Michele Weiner-Davis. The following link is the first chapter:
Once your registration to the site has been completed you can post and start a thread. Please have only one thread active at a time (per forum); it keeps your situation organized and is easier for those following along and posting to you. There are a few forums which help categorize posters’ situations.
When your thread reaches 100 posts, it will be time for you to start a new thread. It is a good idea to link your old thread to your new one, and even link the new one back to the previous one. That makes it easier for the folks following your story. (There is a help thread on linking in the sticky threads at the top section of the forum’s display.) A moderator will “close” your full thread which prevents further posting to it. It is still available to read.
Post in small frequent replies on your thread. Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity can be very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Post on other people’s thread to give support.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Situation tonight is she went to stay at a friend’s. Son is asleep here. And I have no idea how to explain any of this to D11 , who is back with me starting tomorrow (I have her week on, week off).
Any immediate recommendations?
Regarding D11, I’d not divulge too many details just yet. Certainly answer her questions honestly and age appropriately. And if things around the home between you and W have been declining for a while, D11 may have more of a handle on things than you figure. She may ask some difficult questions. Do not lie. Ever. You can tell her you can’t talk about it right now and will discuss later. Or I don’t know, however, I will discuss this with you when I do. Things like that, just ensure you do get back to her.
Explanations can be pretty vague right now. And they are. For you don’t know the underlying cause or reasons.
What daughter needs, and you need to ensure, is that she doesn’t blame herself. In your conversation with D11, you explain the problems are only between you and W. Tell D11 you love her. And are there for her.
Your W is obviously depressed. Her MS, possible deterioration, poor treatment from her MIL, new baby, new responsibilities, and so on; one’s plate can get overfilled in short order.
Originally Posted by Card29
She went to Europe to visit her best friend twice this year. Gone for a total of 5 weeks with a 1yo at home and she never acted like she missed either one of us. I picked up on it and asked about it a few times. Finally a few weeks ago, after she’d had a couple drinks, she opened up and said she “didn’t feel any emotional connection to anything”. Said she felt like she could have not come back and didnt feel like she would have missed anyone, including S1. That was deeply troubling, and she even admitted it was. That’s when we started counseling. I’m not an expert but I don’t get the impression that it’s common for a WAW to also lose a connection to their child?
You are correct, it is pretty rare for a walk away wife to behave such. A WAW is walking away from their husband and marriage, not their children. Five weeks away from her one year old son, and for her to feel next to nothing. To even consider she could have remained away and not missed anyone, illustrates a lot of depression. That withdrawal into self. Such inner suffering, that the world and others doesn’t really register. W simply doesn’t have the bandwidth.
However, she recognizes it, and is attending consulting. Both good things. Do be supportive, and listen when she feels like talking. No pressure. Just validate her feelings. She has to find her way out of the darkness.
Originally Posted by Card29
Just feel sick this morning. Cant focus at work. Almost scared to see D11 later.
Focus on you and kids. GAL. Do stuff to shift your focus off W and your marriage for periods of time. Go for a walk. Go to the gym. Dig the garden. Physical activity has many positive benefits.
Let go the fear of seeing daughter. It’s likely not rooted in seeing D11, or even talking to her; those are merely triggers to an imagined unwanted future. Fear highjacks one’s emotions and produces powerful feelings which are not directly causal. Rationalizing the trigger, event, and imagined future, helps uncouple that tangle of feelings.
Originally Posted by Card29
I also am reliving the pain of D#1, too. Not sure why that’s coming back for the first time in many years.
Unfinished business.
Follow the sting. Seek, heal, and become.
Originally Posted by Card29
We’ll see what the house arrangements will be, but for now she’s staying at a friend’s house.
Remain in the house. Also remain in the master bedroom. You are wanting the marriage, and willing to work for it. You are responsible, and care and provide for your family, especially son and daughter. Ensure you display that.
If W wants to live elsewhere, let her. If she wants to sleep on the couch, let her. You don’t!
Hang in there. You’ve got the gift of time. Use it wisely.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
