Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers WW Patience, Limbo amd Fear

One last thing. Also you need to stop making excuses for not DBing.

"Since I'm so close to the end of the line here, I started a relationship chat."

Really? So we can use any subjective gauge for deciding to set aside DBing principles? You have no idea how close to the end you are. You were thinking you were close to the end, but are you really? And even if you are, was it the right move to start a R chat?

Did you feel better or worse after the R chat? Do you think it progressed your sitch?

Keep on DBing.....even if it really ends, you keep on DBing! DBing isn't for her...it is for you. Do you realize that I even use validation in my discussions at work? Validation is an AMAZING tactic for communicating with people. It is transformative. People can't help but be drawn to you when they feel you understand how they feel. It also diffuses things. If more exspouses would validate one another there would be less disputes post D!

So always be DBing.

I just want to say thanks Wayfarer and Steve. Your posts resonated well and kicked me right out of that mindset. All but one day since your posts have been good. I've been happy, W and I communicate more and kids are thriving. On one day, W criticized me twice in front of S1. When I confronted her, she blamed me. Not a good sign but maybe things are still improving overall. I could tell she felt attacked. I spent about 2 hours thinking of how to communicate the boundary in a way that wouldnt hurt her and brought it up in a nice, pleasant way. Still she gets hurt and I blamed. She's of course said nice things and has even corrected D4 when she acted not great towards me. My actions maybe set us back again though I wont stand for being negatively criticised to my kids. Example...daddy is not good at changing diapers and cleaning you. Mommy is better.

I learned from someone (I didnt ask for this info) that she is on the fence right now. She is looking for someone to tell her or justify with her whether to stay or D. Ive been painted bad and some hurtful lies were told about me. No self reflecting on her end yet that I know of. Is this all normal? The anxiety talking here...what if she never self reflects? I'll always be the bad guy. The last week other than one day was so nice. The one day still bugs me so I know thats my own issue to get over. I think I started to attach more and let the criticism get to me.

As to the criticizing. Men on this page seem to really like dig in with this when it's a WAW or WW and it doesn't matter how "alpha" they are or not. As a wife and a mother and an A type woman. When your wife criticizes you can you take a step back from your personal pain, and ego and hear what she's saying when she says these things? Women for the most part, don't criticize and nag because we like to and we like making you guys feel like crap. It happens because we've felt unheard for so long. What I hear when you say what your wife said to you is that you are not as meticulous and careful changing and cleaning the little one as she is. Or you don't do it the way she'd like it to be done. Now was that a good way to say those things to you absolutely not. That is a terrible way to communicate a want or need but that's not really her strong suit now is it? So maybe baby steps on that. Don't hold her to expectations she can't meet. The conversation should've been you validating her and then finding out why she feels that way. What are you doing wrong changing the baby? Or what does she think your doing wrong changing the baby? Find out. If you are doing something wrong that will keep him happier and healthier in his diaper longer so be it.Tell her you'll be more conscientious in the future, but you'd really like it if she'd just come out and ask you to do those things instead of making back handed comments in front of the kids. If she's just being controlling that's the time to address both the fact that you can get from point a to point b with out the exact same route and it's really not that important, and talking to you that way is inappropriate. She's either going to hear you or not, but at least you took the high road. You're wife is not a child, and even though she may act like one, you shouldn't speak to her as if she is.

All WAS/WS will paint us as the bad guy. Now you may be a little bit of the bad guy here. There may be things you need to work on in the MR, as a dad, as a person. That's all of us LBS none of us are without fault here. No body is married to Jesus. Although for a period of time my WH thought he was Jesus in our marriage and I was the devil and the cause of all of his and our issues. Some of his complaints about me were totally and completely valid. I figured some out on my own. Some I already knew. Some I had to have my bff get real with me about and face. Some of the garbage he threw at me was exactly that garbage or his own crap he was projecting on to me. But I took the time to hear what he said. Even if he was angry when he hurled those things at me. Even if a lot of it was to justify his affair. Even if sometimes it was more garbage than truth. Because that's what he was feeling. He has to sort out on his own how much is him and how much is me on his own time. But I can figure out what is me and work on me with or with out him. Now that the OW is out of the picture and he's still very unsure about the MR, a lot of the narrative he's been telling himself is starting to fall apart and he's having to face reality vs the reality he created to justify what he was doing. It does lead to tiffs or just flat out confusion sometimes, because he still really really wants me to be the person he made up in his head. So he'll try to tell me things I've done or will do that never happened or in all likelihood wouldn't happen. And within hours he'll back pedal. None of this is a pretty, smooth or easy going process. All that being said she may never self reflect. And you have to accept that. You can't take her journey for her. You can only take your own. DBing at it's core is about self reflection and improvement. Worry about you. Your actions, reactions, personal growth, and parenting through this.

Thank you Wayfarer. Your part on your H thinking he was Jesus for awhile made me laugh.

What's getting me is the often present anger and disrespect. I've never had anyone treat me this poorly. My IC and I still dont understand how nothing has changed 7 months in now. Today my kid spilled his milk. I took his tray, put it on the counter and started cleaning while also giving D4 some food. W walked up to the tray and made insulting gestures basically saying through non verbal that it was stupid to put it there versus the sink. I said "what am I the bad guy now for taking care of the kids?". Consequently I get a death look, she says no and now she is withdrawn again.

This thing by itself, not a big deal but there isnt good moments inbetween to make up for it. I could live alone and only have to deal with this stuff when transferring the kids. What is the point of ever going back to this kind of marriage?

At this point, I know I am happier when she is not around. When she traveled and was gone, my world felt brighter. Now its painful. At home, I feel like Im around a person who has their sights set on me. I'm the problem, I'm a monster. I deserve this because I didnt give her the life she wanted. (She said literally, I never expected us to have any problems, why did you let this happen).

I know my flaws and challenge them. Working on them for me and the kids.

Im not sure why I'm posting today, I guess I'm hoping someone talks me out of filing again. Im two weeks away from the deadline I gave myself when this started. Looking like I either file, or I live in turmoil. I want it to work for the kids but I dont know that i want this woman anymore. The longer I stay, the more abuse I receive and the more alimony she gets. Why stay? I could be working towards my kids and my own future right now, but right now, my earnings half go to her future. This delays hopes of retiring. Why cant my W or most WW/WAS be somewhat nice? I show zero disrespect. I lead the family by example. I'm near the end of my patience. I have lost hope and I think Im losing myself. I cant detach when Im around her. The passive aggressive remarks almost daily still find their way.

C,

My guess is that if you file you are playing right into her hands. She can tell the kids you filed. I think your anxiety is still getting the better of you.

Nothing's changed because nothing's changed. You haven't changed enough for her to notice, and neither has she. To be honest if you put the tray some where I felt was precarious and the 4yo could've knocked it down and made it worse I probably would've made a face too. Because that is something I'm super bad at being as A type as I am. It drives me crazy when people don't do things the way I'd do them. I'm working at it. Trying to let go of the control. But control is a coping mechanism for me, so it's harder than just being less of a jerkface it's letting go of how I survived my childhood. My biggest concern here is how you reacted. First of all that was a super passive aggressive statement. Next and probably most importantly, did you really need to say anything at all to her nonverbal cue? Here let me answer that for you. No, no you didn't. You made a choice to make an already tense moment worse. You could've just as easily been annoyed in the moment and then let it go. Like every long term couple on the planet. You escalated the situation because you wanted to.



No LBS here is going back to "that kind of marriage." None of us. All the vets, all the people piecing right now are not time traveling. They are starting over and building something better, a stronger foundation, better skills, deeper connections. If you want this, you aren't wanting what you used to have. You're wanting something better than before. Something where neither of you feels trapped. Something to run toward, not away from.



If you're happier when she's gone so be it. You wanna call it so be it. But the fact you are actually buying into anything she throws at you in anger or despair is not only concerning, it means you're not actually done. If you were really done you wouldn't take a thing she has to say to heart.


You're timeline is arbitrary and can be changed at any time. You want to file tomorrow, go ahead. You want to change your time line to a year from now, that's within your power too. This isn't a real deadline. Don't give it more weight than it deserves. You don't want to live in turmoil, then don't. It's your choice here to continue investing your emotions in your W's roller coaster. You could work harder on detachment. You could walk away and call it quits. But I can tell you filing isn't going to stop the turmoil.



Ok I realize this is chaotic because you're just journaling so I'm going to try to sort this out. Literally everything in this paragraph says you have absolutely no idea what you want but you're leaning towards being out. The fact is if you aren't in the least self possessed in this you are essentially making a rash decision. I found myself again because of this mess. Some days I wonder what I'm doing standing. But for the most part I know what I want and how long I'll wait for it. You can't make a good decision in crisis. You need to truly work on getting out of crisis mode.



Core, buddy, come on now. You just told me something you did that was crazy passive aggressive. No body's Jesus here. Let's not forget that. You try to show zero disrespect. You try to lead the family by example. You aren't without fault. And if you were fully aware of every single one of your flaws you wouldn't be here, or floundering. We're all works in progress. Own that. And own the effort, trying is a big deal. There's no shame in being a person trying to be the best version of themselves.

Hey Core,

We have always been on a similar timeline, but I can see some situational differences. Maybe with your living situation just not enough time and space.

I know my W and I could not have progressed or I detached much without physically separating. There was too much tension and no time to self-reflect. We still see each other a lot, but also have some time and space.

Just a thought from the outside.

I see what you're saying and thats where I'm stuck. If i don't confront the blatant act of disrespect then I would just be a doormat. If I don't want the action to continue then it needs to be confronted. I was home for 10 min during lunch break, helped out my kids, helped with a mess and made sure that the kids were ok before finishing cleaning. The kids couldnt get to the tray. I see no reason to get that angry over it. It truly concerns me. Yes shes is her own person and can be mad at things but where is the anger coming from and why would I keep my family around it?



God I hope if we decide to R it is different. I am still blamed for everything. I haven't seen any self reflection on her end. Mentally she has to want a break from all her internal anger. How long can one avoid a situation?



True. I want to get out before I go numb. Its been a long time since I've had love or any kind of connection from her. I've seen others that regret postponing it. I wonder if that'll be me.



Im glad you called me out on this, I didnt realize it was passive aggressive. Slipped in the heat of the moment.

She told me the other day that Im turning my IC in a weapon to use against her and that im not listening to her. This happened after I set a boundary around controlling how i interact with the kids (I'm allowed to feed them what i want on my time). She asked me to apologize for bringing the issue up. Literally asking me to apologize for setting a boundary she doesnt like that hurt her feelings and its all targeting her. The victimized passive aggressive reaction deeply concerns me. I feel very manipulated and controlled. Somedays I truly think I'm the victim of abuse. My counselor believes I am which reinforces me thinking I need to file to save myself. Other days it doesnt seem that bad. How did other know when to finally pull the plug? How can I ever be ok putting my happiness over the kids having a family which looks functional?

I'm confused myself again on what I should be doing while at home with W. I am 99 percent sure OM is out of the picture. I know for a fact she is on the fence. As a reminder, W asked to recon but got spooked. Since then we've been more friendly and talk daily about more than the kids. No real emotional or physical connection.

I'm keeping on validating, boundaries, 180s. I'm still debating filing myself. Do i go back to basics for now? It seems like being friendlier is at least more peaceful than when we didnt interact. Once we got friendlier, I think that may be what moved her a little away from 100 percent certain she wants to D.

You should be at home with her as little as possible. Speaking of that, what are your GAL plans for tonight?