Thank you DejaVu6 for your words of encouragement. I will catch up with your posts later.
So yesterday he rang to talk to me about the kids and the fact that the youngest son (21) had given him a hard and frosty reception when he came to collect the dog (me out for the day GAL!) I told him that I was sorry to hear that but that H needed to put on his big boy pants and sort it out. If that meant he was going to be met with a frosty reception a few times then he needed to man up and persevere (said in a teasing manner and seen as such)
Good!
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He then moved onto starting to tell me about the OW and how they were talking but weren't a couple and that they were talking because of the problems she was having with her ex. I was a bit rude and stopped him mid sentence and said that I really didn't want to talk about her as she was none of my concern and her ex husband certainly wasn't, and I didn't want to talk about our R either. He seemed a bit taken aback. I explained that as far as I was concerned there was no marriage whilst he was in a relationship with another woman and when that ended (because I knew that it would) he should come and talk to me and we'd see where we were at. In the meanwhile neither myself or the children were interested in his sex life. He just said 'fair enough' we both know where we stand then.
Strong, but why say you'll be there for him after he gets done with his little girlfriend? It sounds like plan B.
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I did take the opportunity to talk 'business' about the house etc and did ask that before he got his feet under the table with OW he needed to wind down the marriage and all that entailed. He said that he knew that, but there was no hurry. (I suspect cake eating) He had said that he would help to prepare the house for sale but no inclination to even sort out the garage or loft at the moment but he did let slip that he wouldn't need to be back at the house so much because the OW had offered to do his laundry. I laughed and asked if that was to keep him away from the house and he said that it was.
I asked him to think about whether that was fair when he had the marriage to wind up and he said 'probably not' and when I asked further what the motivation from her was and he said 'I think she's worried that we'll get back together'
It remained very civil and I just asked him to consider whether he wanted to be controlled to that extent which would very obviously lead to a decline in civility between us and may also herald her wanting to keep him away from the boys. He said he would give that some thought. I told him calmly that he may be prepared to have the OW control his life but he could be certain of one thing; she wasn't going to control mine.
He told me that whilst he was what I would still describe as crazy H; he was happy being crazy H at the moment and felt more settled than he had in a long time ie I'm better off out of the marriage.
The whole thing hasn't upset me, but has unsettled me. It felt quite final and emotionless. I regret engaging him for so long on the phone and felt myself going into 'lecturing' mode but drew back quickly. I did however want to take the opportunity when it presented itself to lay down some boundaries and reiterate that I wasn't going to be involved in his drama.
Make your next interaction more concise, you clearly have the strength and the smarts. But we all have emotions, and they can overrule everything if we don't keep them in check.
I love the boundaries.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
I need to work on being concise without coming across as cold. When I try to be friendly I talk too much, so need to practice.
I think I should have phrased my 'open door' better. Do I leave it unsaid? Is it something he would pick up from my demeanor rather than spoken word? This where I struggle. To detach I put up a hardened shell which makes it difficult to sound pleasant and supportive. I know I'm too much a black and white character in general so when I lay done boundaries I can tend to come across as harsh and nasty.
Why does he feel the need to tell me about his relationship with OW? We have talked about it in the past (before I knew better) but I have told him now, more than once, that I am not interested in her crazy life or her affair with him. So why keep bringing her up and telling me 'we're just talking, we're not a couple' Is it to push my buttons and see what I'll come back with, or because he is used to me being his emotional crutch where she is concerned?
When I think of the number of times that he has 'cried' on my shoulder in the last 4 months about how badly she has treated him and how he sees her for what she is and how toxic it is. He's making his choices to choose that over the marriage so why keep telling me?
I think your H tries to tell you about this stuff because regardless of where he is at with the marriage, you are/were his best friend, and you have consistently been that for the entirety of your marriage. This is the part of your relationship he has taken for granted... and devalued... for all those years. This is the case with my H too. When I see him, he is dying to tell me all of the stuff that has happened to him, etc... like one would a best friend. I struggle with that. Detaching... being open...being friendly but not too friendly... It is a hard line to walk. I do not want my H to cake eat and, at the same time, being distant and cordial feels a bit like punishing him... at least that is what it would feel like to him. If anyone has the perfect "recipe" for this...I would love to know it. Personally... I think you are doing exceedingly well considering how long this man has been a part of your life. You, Yorkie, are no one's victim and I have no doubt there will come a day when your H looks back on this and realizes just how much he gave up. Trust me... if there is already this much trouble in OW land, it is only going to get worse. Continue to take care of you. (((HUGS)))
Thank you for the words of encouragement DejaVu6. Like a lot of people here I expect, I find it easy to talk the talk rather than walk the walk and keep the emotions in check.
Today is going to be a tough day because I've woken up in a 'victim' mood probably because I spend part of the night thinking up nasty emails to send him. My challenge is to get through the day without resorting to sending something.
I'd settled into a good place after a longer period of NC but him contacting me about the kids has put me into a spin again. I will try to build up the detachment happy place again. I felt in control in that place but maybe I'm being a bit childish as I now think that he has also being NC as it is the line of least resistance for him. I want it to be my 'thing' not his.
All our married life he has had the ability to 'sulk' for long periods until I (got cross then got over it) made things better.
He probably doesn't think that I have the staying power in this situation either. He was definitely loving the thought of having 2 women 'fighting' over him. He even said to me once 'perhaps I should put you both in a room and you could each take the bits that you want' I'm disgusted with myself that I allowed him to think that for a while.
I'm going to repeat to myself all day "I will remain dignified....I will remain dignified ...."
I know what you mean about wanting the NC being your thing and not his. I feel that way too. The problem is that my H is so much better at it. And I am the one with the kids at home and needing to contact him for those reasons. It is so unfair... he is off living his life in his own little apartment and dropping by to take the kids out and entertain them. Meanwhile... I'm the one dealing with all of the day-to-day... household chores, home maintenance, scheduling appointments, homework, etc... Sometimes I just want to run away and be the irresponsible one... cater to no one else's needs but my own. There would be so much freedom in that!!! But alas, no, I don't have it in me and I don't have that luxury. My kids need at least one parent with their feet on the ground...even if it feels like those feet are caught in quick sand at times.
Maybe write the emails but don't send them? Or write in a journal [make sure it isn't where he will find it]? I consider myself to be in a pretty good place but this morning while I was driving to pick up my daughter from tutoring, I was actually daydreaming about beating my husband up... or yelling at him until I lose my ability to create anymore sound...lol. I have those fantasies from time-to-time and am quite taken aback by them as I am by no means a violent or reactive person. Still... it would feel kind of good.
I like your "I will remain dignified" mantra. I actually went into the notes on my phone this morning and wrote out a bunch of phrases that I can read whenever I am having a moment. Maybe you could try that?
Regarding fighting over him... you are WAY to classy to do that. Rise above... you will be glad you did.
Now I am going to go try to walk the walk...lol. (((HUGS)))
So, managed not to send an email, but did rather wallow in self pity for most of the day. I did need to speak to him about some house maintenance and thinking about it, I did a 180. He would have expected me to ask or let him do it in the past but instead I asked where the correct equipment was so that I could do it. Maybe deep down I am disappointed that he didn't put up an objection and offer to come and do it, but it has made me determined to sort these jobs out myself.
Gave myself a good talking to and spent a couple of hours sorting out a very messy garage so that I was familiar with what we had for DIY purposes and then spent the evening researching how to do some jobs. I'm going to start with some simple decorating jobs.
Not strictly GAL but it'll keep me busy and I will enjoy the results. House has been rather neglected for a couple of years because he's been otherwise occupied and whilst the house will be sold, it'll make me proud of myself if I can do this. For too long he's been the DIY Nazi and had to do it all himself. No doubt, my efforts will be sub standard compared to his and it'll be pointed out, but I intend to be duck like and let the water run off.
Good for you Yorkie!! I know this is tough but the one thing we (I'm a child & youth therapist) tell people over and over again who are depressed... do FIRST, feel SECOND. In other words, if you wait until you feel better before you do something, you may never get going. So...keep forcing yourself to get up and go and you will notice, over time, that it gets much easier and you will find there are increasingly longer periods of time when you are not thinking about your H or about your sadness and fear. Those times are just as real and valid as the times you are wallowing. It will be a sign that you are starting to heal and that is a good thing!!
Last night I knew my H was home with the kids and I could have come home earlier to ensure that we saw each other but I didn't. The truth is that I was enjoying myself with my friends and honestly, I appreciated not thinking about him. I think it has been a bit easier for me because my H has been physically absent (pretty much) from our home since around March so I'm used to him not being there. I think the fact that he has described our "separation" as "temporary" also gives me a bit of hope but it has also crossed my mind that this might be his way of getting everyone used to the idea. If there is one thing I know about him it is that he HATES any kind of confrontation so he will do almost anything to avoid it. Part of why they tell us to not believe what they say and only half of what they do.
Stay busy!! I love the household improvement idea and learning how to DIY. I wouldn't sell yourself short though. You never know what you can do until you try. And there are a lot of YouTube step-by-step videos out there to help you along your way. Good luck with it all!!! Sending you lots of (((HUGS))). You are not alone Yorkie! There are many, many people her rooting for you.
That's awesome Yorkie. You sound like you're taking charge and doing really well. There is a kind of freedom and pride in doing things for yourself. Keeping occupied helps too. I have re-arranged every cupboard in my house.
Before H moved out one of our toilets got blocked. All the waste would come back up to the rim and then slowly come back down and sit at the bottom of the bowl. H came home, saw it, smirked and said "you'll have to sort out the toilet yourself. I won't be here to do these things for you". He knows how much I hate anything to do with the toilet and that the thought of putting my hand down the bowl, even with gloves, would make me vomit. I just walked out, googled "how to unblock toilets" (bicarbonate soda, washing liquid and warm water for anyone who is interested) and sorted it out. It took two days and stunk like hell but eventually it became unblocked. He never said a word.
So my situation has moved on a bit. I had a conversation with H because I need to get a house valuation and told him out of courtesy. He said that he wanted to be there because he didn't trust me.(!!) We have arranged to meet Monday evening to discuss moving forward apart. He told me that I needed to be aware that he absolutely was never going to live with me again so we just needed to sort out the assets between us. I mentioned that sneaking back into the house when I wasn't there to take things wasn't exactly conducive to keeping things civil.
He said that he does that because whenever he sees me it just deteriorated into an argument about the OW. He suggests thats all I want to talk about. I pointed out to him that I haven't mentioned her for 6 weeks when I said that was it and that I wasn't taking part in the drama anymore. He then proceeded to mention her 3 times in the conversation that ensued.
My H is a lawyer and has always said that we don't need to be paying lawyers when it is relatively straight forward. Well if he thinks that I am taking his word for it then he is a bigger fool than I took him for.
I have agreed to go and see what he has to suggest but if he thinks he can continue to talk to me as if I am an irritating client and bully me into accepting what he thinks is right then I am walking out.
I did ask him to consider that his demeanor now at this crucial time will determine how easily this progresses.
I am quite stunned by the extent to which history is being rewritten and how he wishes to view our 30 years together. I did say that I knew his M.O and out of sight out of mind wasn't going to quite cut it after 30 years. To hear him talk I was the worst wife ever and he's suffered all of that time because I've always had my way. This is the only time that he's stood up for himself apparently.
Wow! I'm very very sad. Not at the breakdown of the marriage per se, but at the degradation of 27 years. How has it come to the situation that I am beginning to despise him when we were best friends for so long.
He denies that I need any consideration for the fact that our 21 year old son lives at home and cannot afford to live independently (he is apprentice on �13000 per year) and that I might need space so that our son who lives away can come and see his family. He said 'they are adults they can sort themselves out' and I pointed out that they are adults but also his sons.
I do want this to be resolved as painlessly as possible but how do you negotiate reasonably with someone who skews the facts. I acknowledge that he doesn't want to be with me anymore but I will always resent that we never tried to resolve any problems. The first I know is when I discover an affair. I'm sorry that 27 years wasn't worth some effort on both our parts.
I ended the conversation with asking him to consider what it is about his manner that prevents us from being civil and I would do the same.
