Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers A WW? (8)

I have to say that I think your W somewhat gave you a gift here. It's not nice and not what you may want but it is a gift. I think she is being 100% honest. Will you please listen to her? I know I suggested only a short time ago that you stop trying to help her and that it is clearly making her mad when you do try. So why do you keep doing it? I'm really not trying to be mean here but you are just not getting it. I think she was extremely honest in what she wrote. This is honestly how she feels and she's telling you as much. Imagine how you'd feel if you said to her, "please do not try to help me with anything!" And her response is, okay I won't and by the way I am doing your laundry this afternoon. You'd be like WTF and mad as heck. Right? This is why she thinks you don't listen to her - perhaps because you don't? Or is it you just shrug it off and do what you want anyhow? Or are you just not able to help yourself or stop yourself?

You know that I am no fan of your W and all she has done. I think she is wrong on so many things but on this, wow it seems crystal clear. On top of it, your actions are pushing her farther away. Just stop and let her be until she asks. As I said weeks back, I think it's possible she might start to miss you offering to help and start to want it again.

Others hopefully can suggest some actions on what you should do but if I get anything from her last email to you, it's a total open door to how she feels amd why / right or wrong she was very honest with you and I think that's a huge gift!

Any chance for an update? I know you've been busy but something must be going on in recent weeks. Hope it's good.

Don, sorry brother, been traveling and haven't been great at posting here recently. Have to get some sleep tonight but will post tomorrow. Appreciate you my friend!

Lt -- take her up on it. Quit worrying about what she's doing, how you can help her, etc. You can't. DETACH. Think about what you want out of YOUR life and go get it. Seriously, why even try to attach/connect at this point? You've done everything humanly possible your way, and it's not working. Try something completely different: be outwardly happy, be the positive lighthouse, keep the road home for her paved, but just be there, not pushing, not pursuing, not trying to demonstrate anything, just letting her be in her cranky, complaint-filled world, if that's where she decides she wants to stay. She's "so dead inside"? Not your problem, brother! That's entirely on her, even if she wants to say you're responsible for her feelings. That's buck-passing scapegoating no-personal-responsibility BS.

I know from sad experience how impossible the in-house separation is, so I hope you don't take any of the above as preachy. I never could personally manage what I'm advocating, but I think it might have helped our sitch had I pulled it off, and I KNOW I'd have been a lot happier a lot earlier.

Ok, an update since my last post. I've been travelling a lot recently. First the trip out west with D, then two trips for work late in April and earlier this week. Between the two trips I got pretty sick and was dragging for about a week and a half. Finally starting to feel better, but definitely wore on me w/ keeping up a happy face at home.

So, we'd been working to sell our house, which has been on market about 45 days. Got, negotiated, and accepted an offer this week. Closing is in a couple months, so now we have a deadline for a move. W has an obvious axe to be out of the house, so her motivation was very focused on moving the house. Provided input and a little bit of pushback on the price we counter-offered with, but she drove the process for the most part. Felt we could squeeze a bit more out of the negotiation but felt like I balanced Ws desire to sell the house w/ maximizing the return on the sale. W has mentioned nothing about any search for a new place to live. If you'll remember, I offered to her a month ago that the decision is hers on our next residence. I offered my aid, should she want it, but had planned to let her drive it. A bit frustrated that we've sold the place and don't have a plan going forward (that I know of), but we will see.

The day before I left for my business trip this week I went to the doctor since my cold didn't seem to be getting better. Put me on some meds. Got home w/ the meds and W asked "Are they steroids? Because you shouldn't fly with steroids in your system, you could get really sick". First time she's shown any sort of empathy for me in the past year. That evening (same evening we were going back and forth on the house sale) she offered and made me dinner. The same thing D was eating, but it was a gesture I've not seen in the past year also.

Ws car wasn't ready until sometime while I was gone this week. I left her mine and took a cab to the airport bc it seemed like the right thing to do. Noticed she'd shuffled around in my console as some stuff was moved around, but whatever. I find myself wondering if the concern around the meds or the house sale didn't drive her to do something quasi-nice for me. She's also no longer stacking our pillows on each opposite edge of the bed when she makes it, but that could be accidental.

There are still plenty of times when she's over the top rude about stuff. W let me know our attic fan wasn't running when I got back from my trip. I went up there, checked it, and couldn't figure out what was wrong w/ it. Got an electrician out there to take a look and it happened to be working when he got there (W was home for it). Asked W what he said and she shot back there was nothing wrong with it and it was fine. Very annoyed about it, though it was her that told me it was broken, and honestly it was not working when I was looking at it. Is what it is.

D is pushing me away a bit when W is around. D was concerned when I was sick and was extra nice to me which was awesome. But when it's the 3 of us and we are together, I notice that D doesn't act as close to me as she does when W isn't there. That part has me a bit down. Love that kid though, she's my driving force!

Have had a couple IC visits since that text w/ my W. IC thought it highlighted that she's all over the place in her mind. He also found a lot of truth to the statements but there's not a lot of consistency in the messaging. Thinks it highlights how disparate things are in her mind right now. When my Ws car was ready after that last text msg bt us, she sent me a msg saying:

W: "Let me know if you want me to get someone else to take me to pickup the car"

I didn't respond quick enough and just got back:

W: "Nevermind, it's taken care of"

She also asked me to get tulips on the way home the next day to put in our house for showings. She also asked me to grab a dining room table from someone (since we don't have one) and get it back to the house so we could stage it. The dining room table was a pain (heavy as hell and awkward), but our friends H and I got it loaded in about 45 minutes through brute force. Got it home and into the garage, but then W got annoyed that I couldn't get it in the house. I told her the two of us could try, but I thought it was too heavy for us to get in w/o damaging it. My brother in law couldn't come over and when I offered to call my Dad, W said "that's the dumbest idea I've ever heard. he'll hurt himself trying to move it." I offered to get someone to come the next day (it was 8pm) and she said that the realtor had scheduled photos of the house first thing in the morning. Found a neighbor, eventually, to help, but W was annoyed the rest of the evening. I'd no clue that we had to rush it bc of photos. Seemed like poor planning on her part.

So, W seems to have no issues asking for things when it suits her. Regardless of how I execute, something is always wrong w/ it in her mind. I've not offered anything, except leaving my care for her while on my trip, since those previous text messages. The two of us really haven't talked face to face, minus the discussion about the attic fan.

So, some out of the norm stuff and some continuation of the coldness. The coldness, for the most part, is more neutral now, but still flares up at times. Don't see it as a positive, just more of a change, though I've no clue for what reason.

There's a conversation to be had shortly. I need some clarity around our future w/ the deadline to move. I'll probably over to line up the moving company. But I need to see what she's thinking wrt 1) a place to move and 2) do we move together. I've setup a meeting w/ my L to discuss scenarios for #2 next week. Need to know the options should I or she push this thing towards S w/ the house now sold.

I'm on the fence about forcing the issue of S. I wonder how much longer I can be this punching bag w/in my own home. I don't feel disrespected as much anymore, and when I do I stand firm. It's more the random bouts of coldness and the lack of having a partner who is warm and caring. The counter to S though is my D and what it does to her. Not an easy spot to be in and I find the decisioning to be brutal. IC thinks I tell W that "I know i'll be fine. I'm working on myself and have gotten to a point where I can be happy either way this turns out. I'm worried about you and the anger and resentment that you are holding onto. It seems to be keeping you from being happy. It probably makes sense for us to put a timeline (6m or a yr) on this and if we're unable to work on our R then we should make plans to S." One of the reasons I'm going to see L in case we have a conversation so I can be prepared to frame up options. I hate to go that route, but I'm not sure I can continue to go down this path.

Had a dream last night of W and I laying in bed. In my dream I woke up to W rolling over beside me and then rolling on top of me and us just holding each other like that. Seemed so real. Woke up to her facing away from me on the other side of the bed and it was like cold water being splashed in my face. I feel ready to be close to someone, but W does not seem to want that to be her. How much longer to I allow her to "feel dead inside"? How much longer do I allow myself to be shunned by someone who I cared so much about? Dunno.

Don, I agree. I think that text exchange was a gift. I probably needed to hear all of that. It's so foreign to me to not offer to help when I perceive someone as being in need. I guess it's somewhat involuntary and I do it w/ everyone. You're right though. W doesn't seem to want it and so I'm forcing myself to not offer. If it's something that needs to be done and I want to do it, then I just do it. Otherwise, W needs to come to me and ask for aid.

One thing that's sitting out there is docs for our closing attorney on the house. they hit our email when I was out of town this week. I asked W via text:

Me: "Saw the docs from the closing agent, but haven't looked. Anything we need to do there?"

W: "Need to be filled out and faxed"

Didn't offer to do them, but W also didn't ask for me to in her follow up. I know that she expects me to do them. I hate it that she wants me to stop offering to help, but still expects me to do things w/o asking. Unsure how to balance all that.

Trust me, completely get what you're saying about offering unwanted help and pushing her further away. It's the part where she expects me to help her w/o her asking that is frustrating me.

JR, yeah, it's tough to balance detached vs attached w/ the in house I think. There's some level of reliance upon each other to make it work. Though, weirdly enough, I guess we're not really even in house S. Taking a step back, we are still M per our conversations from Oct on. Strange to think about it that way.

I'd never find any of ya'll preachy, JR. You've all been such amazing friends and supporters during this rough journey. I'm trying to detach but it's almost like she fights that detachment and ropes me back in through her moods and coldness. Maybe we'll see some different behavior with me not offering help, maybe not. Unsure of what the next couple months hold.

It's her birthday next week. I asked her what she'd like to do a cpl weeks ago and got back a spew filled msg along the lines of "for my birthday I want nothing. actually, for my birthday, I'd like you to treat it like it wasn't my birthday...". So, D and I are getting her a cake, as she told D in a separate conversation that she'd really like a cake. Not sure what we'll do for mother's day. Maybe let D pick out a small gift for her and a card I guess.

Sorry for the rambling. A lot going on, but not really. Still feel as though the wheels are spinning and we're in limbo. Thank you all for being there for me and wanting to catch up on my sitch. Know that you are all extremely appreciated. Thank you!

So , I forgot about my aunts birthday party being tonight. Remember this morning and I tell W and D that I'd like D and I to go for a bit. D asks why W doesn't have to go. I tell her that I'd love for W to go but I'd at least like D and I to go. dsays ok. After, D goes to the bathroom and W tells me that was the most f'ed up way to approach that situation.

D and I hang out for a bit then she goes to brush teeth. Laura W asks to speak in garage. She tells me it's f'ed up that I did that. Her main points were I've never stood up for D with my parents or with their dog jumping on her. She also says it's f'ed up I did not invite her and it's messed up I don't want to talk to her and that we are so far apart. She tells me I need to apologize to F and stop putting D in the middle of things. I tell her that, yes, I f'ed up by forgetting party. I tell her I'd love her to come but I'd assumed she would not want to. I tell her that based on her last text I had assumed she did not want to talk to me. She tells me that's right she doesn't want to talk to me and then storms off and slams door.

Fun...

We all end up going to the party today. W offered that her and D would go for 30 minutes, we'd take seperate cars, and I said I'd stay the whole time. D and I were hanging out for a bit without W and I asked D why she didn't want to go. D told me that I know that she's shy and she doesn't like being around all those people. I told D that I know what it's like to be shy and what if I stayed with her the entire time we were there. D seemed to be happy about this and agreed.

We get there and D is cautious around the dogs (cocker spaniel and a 30lb English lab). D has always had a phobia of dogs, somewhat driven by W fear of them. Takes a bit but I get D comfortable with them and she spends a good part of the party petting them. W, D, and I sit down on a couch and chat with my aunt and my sister, her husband, and their 2 yr old. I never leave Ds side and she seemed to have a fun time playing with the dogs and joking around. At one point D makes a joke about "balls" (we are somewhat inappropriate at home) and I tell my aunt "wieners are big in our house", to which W responds "no they are not" and laughs. Couldn't tell if it was a purposeful insult or just a joke from W. who knows and I let it roll off.

D and W stayed for an hour and 15 minutes before leaving on a bad excuse W gave. I walked W and D out and W piled into the car before I could talk to her. I sent her a text msg just saying "Thank you" and got no response. I stay and then make it home about 45 minutes before Ds bedtime. Snuggle on the couch and watch iPad videos with D. W on her phone and doesn't participate. W did get dressed up for the party and she looked really nice. Debated telling her that but I knew the response would not be great. Did drive me a little nuts though. Been awhile.

So, that's my weekend. Meet with Ls this week to discuss options should the house sale lead to S. No clue what to make of Ws conversation today. Still feel stuck in the mud with regards to this thing.

LT,

Sounds like some good bonding with your D. Love the jokes. That's good humor going around. Good luck with the Ls.

Have a good day.

Thanks Tryin! D's sense of humor is awesome and jives with mine and Ws very well. Appreciate the well wishes, hope you're doing well also!

Not when she is screwing someone else, it isn't.