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I think all in good time surfer. When she is ready to talk, you now have a set of skills to validate and listen. This is how she will see your 180s and realise she is being an absolute foooooool to throw away this amazing man

Anna,

I guess so.

I must admit, I don't feel like an amazing man at the moment. But its just cycling. I get that.

Thank you.

Surfer.

We went to MC together. The C said she felt I felt unlovable and that someone had 'made' me feel that way. I know you choose to accept rather than being 'made'. But at times, it comes back and I feel like I am unlovable if I am honest. It won't last, its a feeling, it's transient, like all feelings are. But it hurts, rejection and even the most pragmatic and kind hearted feel it.

It will go.

Surfer.

Ha ha, Cherry even....:)

Been working all day - got a bit "snow blind" to typing....

Going to stop working and chill now....

Surfer, you make very valid points, and I would like to state that at no point in sharing my stories do I ever wish to deflect my own responsibility for making mistakes in my marriage, or give the impression I think everything is H's fault. That wouldn't be realistic. Though I was never the one who made the choice to cheat or abandon the family, there are definitely things I wish I had done differently or handled in another way. That said, though I realize there are two sides to every story and his is just as valid as mine, I can only offer my own perceptions as how I saw them from my point of view. I hope my comments can be taken in that spirit.

I do agree that most troubled marriages reach a point when you could probably breathe in front of the other and somehow do it wrong. In my own situation, there was definitely some of that at play.

One of my colleagues works in domestic violence prevention and makes the point that we often want to blame someone for being the bad guy when a toxic relationship develops, but the reality is that most of these occur because of situational factors. I.e., it's a bad barrel (match of partners) rather than a bad apple (individual). That really resonates with me. I very much disagree with the way my H chose to step out of the marriage to deal with his unhappiness. Even more, I disagree with the idea that personal happiness trumps the good of the family overall, and that family is disposable. But those are my personal morals and values and they are not shared by everyone. Nor do I assume the right to judge my H or anyone else for feeling differently. But I know I can't have a healthy relationship with anyone who doesn't feel the same level of commitment to family as I do.

**

Cherry, is your H controlling overall? That is such a hard situation to be in, especially when you're pregnant. I can remember being nine months pregnant and hugely miserable, but trying desperately to clean the house and keep him happy because I was worried he was going to leave again (he left anyway). Those are the situations you really just can't win at, so you just have to do your best and let it go.

I didn't think he was, and certainly not too start. He didn't like me having male friends, again, at the start he didn't say anything. But as time went on- I would get digs about talking to guys and the "you know he only wants one thing". He also would make a point of making sure every man in our work place knew I was his girlfriend (I'm not big headed in the slightest, but I had a LOT of attention from guys in the office, not that I can ever understand why!). We got together soon after I started there and he proposed a couple months later, we were married within 8/9 months. And he would say "I had to marry her before someone else had the chance to".

I was always always open and honest, he had access to my phone should he have ever wanted to look, and I did to his up until he started being wayward again. But he never would have found anything, even in this sh*tstorm that is reality right now- I tell guys I'm married.

After we had baby, he became more controlling. He didn't want me to take baby to see my family. And if I did, he would get angry with me. I don't know why as he always had a great r with them, especially my dad. They treated him like one of their own.

Then there was more behaviour that could be perceived as controlling, like he didn't trust me. Even now, when I've gone out- there's the "where are you going" "who are you going with".

I never really saw him as a controlling type but it's only now when I look back I can start to think maybe he is a little controlling.

I'd say only a week ago, I was still retching trying to make food, all because I was concerned my actions would drive him away. This past week I've started to ease off on that, as I thought he's seen an L, he's seeing another woman. I've been busting my ass to be the best mom/woman/wife/lover and he's still gone.

And I still can't mention anything about myself, EVER, without getting "it's not all about you". He asked me my feelings about something last week, when I told him what I thought/felt and I got "it's not about you, you always bring it back to yourself", kinda hard not to when you ask me specifically how do I feel about something... I guess I cannot win

Cherry

Ohhhh how weird. People are so similar re: "always bring it back to you". I used to get this soooo often. I think that is them not feeling heard. Validation. Is the key with this I think.

I miss my wife so much. Not the person she has been/is. But my wife.

Take it as a good thing that he said he 'had to' marry you. He and others, clearly, see you for being great company and of course attractive. I think as a person you definately are and I mean this in a no -sleezy way. Because if anyone was to ask "I am married" too.

I went to a wedding, alone sadly, one of my best friends who had actually had a horrible time. He cheated badly - told him to sort his 'sh!t' but eventually they both did. If they can, we all can.

Anna, Cherry, what are the things you did that you regret?

Surfer.

herry

Ohhhh how weird. People are so similar re: "always bring it back to you". I used to get this soooo often. I think that is them not feeling heard. Validation. Is the key with this I think.

I miss my wife so much. Not the person she has been/is. But my wife.

Take it as a good thing that he said he 'had to' marry you. He and others, clearly, see you for being great company and of course attractive. I think as a person you definately are and I mean this in a no -sleezy way. Because if anyone was to ask "I am married" too.

I went to a wedding, alone sadly, one of my best friends who had actually had a horrible time. He cheated badly - told him to sort his 'sh!t' but eventually they both did. If they can, we all can.

Anna, Cherry, what are the things you did that you regret?

Surfer.

Herry?!

I wish in the early days I had taken more time to listen to him. These are skills I have now, how to validate etc.

In a way, I see maybe we did everything too quick, we moved in together after 4/5 months. Maybe we should have taken some more time. But then all of this felt so right, and for the first 3 years or so, we were an absolute dream team. But if anything, I think we both became very codependent. We just were together 24/7, we relied on one another for everything.

I think my insecurity got to him after a while. He was always telling me to be more confident. Truth was, my ex before him was physically, mentally and sexually abussive. I would put on a confident act, but as anyone got to know me and I would relax into their company, maybe I was a bit more insecure. I've worked on this the last 2 years, I saw an ic to help me deal with past problems.

Although we had a great sex life, he will still tell me this now. I wish I let him know every single day how happy I was when he came home.