Wish I could learn to stop taking bait. Its not a matter of just STFU. He's now learned to manipulate the silence as being disobedient/unsubmissive. UGH. The Bishop still hasn't spoken to him yet either. They're off this week. So lots & lots of opportunity for porn. Friday is the OW's birthday - still circled on his calendar. Duh. He thinks I don't know. But maybe he can't "undo" it... guess I should give him that benefit of the doubt. He threw out a few jabs about her recently. I didn't take that much bait, at least. So tempting to say awwww, it's really too bad that didn't work out huh. Sniff.
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
Today I got a few txts. He's been trying to communicate, but only under his very limited rules. "When you're ready to talk like a normal couple, rather than "bible talk" posturing, then I'll take you seriously."
Which is strange because he's the one who keeps trying to frame it in biblical terms. I can work within that to some degree, but of course he's the expert. Now there's this. Of course, he sees all my validation attempts, etc, as "psycho babble" because he knows what it is. It's really easy to get defensive here, or to shut down...which I know won't help either. Tips, friends?
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
I wouldn't reply to that. You need to enforce a boundary where you will not be dictated to or condescended to. If he does it, don't debate or explain how he's doing it, because he won't admit it, he'll make it your fault. YOU decide when the boundary is crossed, and if he does, you walk away and don't engage. He'll stamp and pout and use that as an example that you're unreasonable, but at some point he'll have to face the reality that you aren't there playing with him anymore. Take the batteries out of the 'Kyrie game' he keeps playing and let him go a week or a month and see that you're not responding when he tries to push your buttons. Keep moving forward with your life. At some point he'll have to decide if he wants to pull his $hit together and have a relationship with you or if he wants to keep pressing buttons that don't do anything as you fade from his life. But that only works if you do your part. So maybe you need to get tired enough of this circle to break your part of the dance. You'll get there.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
Today I got a few txts. He's been trying to communicate, but only under his very limited rules. "When you're ready to talk like a normal couple, rather than "bible talk" posturing, then I'll take you seriously." Which is strange because he's the one who keeps trying to frame it in biblical terms. I can work within that to some degree, but of course he's the expert. Now there's this. Of course, he sees all my validation attempts, etc, as "psycho babble" because he knows what it is. It's really easy to get defensive here, or to shut down...which I know won't help either. Tips, friends?
Wow, that^^^ is some serious gas lighting. I'd have to say he's projecting, but not sure if that will help you.
I'm flummoxed and very frustrated for you, but wanted to let you know we are here for you.
Sometimes we want to smack the WAS on behalf of others, but I'm not sure THAT helps you either.
So,
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Ad hoc old post from very early in my journey, when I was getting to grips with level 1 abuse. I hadn't understood at that point this was all about control.
When H goes into verbal diarrhoea mode. I spent my time analysing it.
Spew- incoherent rubbish designed to put you on edge. response: STFU and walk away
Abusive spew: incoherent rubbish designed to put you on edge and insult response: STFU and walk away, next day correct boundary infringement
Rant- all of your "faults" that annoy them designed to control response- STFU and then validate " I can see why you might think that"
Abusive rant- designed to control and insult response- STFU and walk away, next day correct boundary infringement
Sulk- make you feel small for wrong doing response- STFU and ignore, act as if did not happen
Rail- designed to press your buttons keeps on about one issue, can even involve following you to the loo response- STFU and leave to go GAL
Disappear- designed to make you worry and apprehensive response- STFU detach and act as if all ok
Tantrum- no purpose whatsoever but feels good response- STFU and look surprised
Blame- design to shift responsibility response- validate and deflect if not responsible, if are responsible diffuse by accepting responsible then apologise then walk away
In all sitches detach and if necessary act confused. confused
A very early post, at this stage I was suffering from between 2 and 5 verbal abuse episodes a day
V
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
I wouldn't reply to that. You need to enforce a boundary where you will not be dictated to or condescended to. If he does it, don't debate or explain how he's doing it, because he won't admit it, he'll make it your fault. YOU decide when the boundary is crossed, and if he does, you walk away and don't engage. He'll stamp and pout and use that as an example that you're unreasonable, but at some point he'll have to face the reality that you aren't there playing with him anymore. Take the batteries out of the 'Kyrie game' he keeps playing and let him go a week or a month and see that you're not responding when he tries to push your buttons. Keep moving forward with your life. At some point he'll have to decide if he wants to pull his $hit together and have a relationship with you or if he wants to keep pressing buttons that don't do anything as you fade from his life. But that only works if you do your part. So maybe you need to get tired enough of this circle to break your part of the dance. You'll get there.
Hi Zues, Hope you're doing ok. It's so tough... he pushes one button - "I need you (not in those words)" but everything I do is unacceptable, which keeps me on his string. If I "don't play" then I'm being disobedient and unloving. So it's an unending cycle (passive aggressive much? But he accuses me of that when I don't play too!).
I feel like being explicit with him (though as you've said, he won't admit it): "I'm happy and ok, not because things are good with us, but because things are good with me (he'll respond: its always all about you and what you want - whaaaa!). I'm ok because I'm not staying resentful and bitter. That was my mistake in the past - expecting you to make me happy, but I've learned that's not a good expectation. When we connect, it's great. When we don't, it's not great, but if I go into it without that expectation, I won't feel let down or bitter. No blame.
But that's a lot of "I" statements...and it WILL get turned into "it's all about you". Harumph. And thanks for the responses - it really helps me not feel so alone sometimes.
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
Ad hoc old post from very early in my journey, when I was getting to grips with level 1 abuse. I hadn't understood at that point this was all about control.
When H goes into verbal diarrhoea mode. I spent my time analysing it.
Spew- incoherent rubbish designed to put you on edge. response: STFU and walk away
Abusive spew: incoherent rubbish designed to put you on edge and insult response: STFU and walk away, next day correct boundary infringement
Rant- all of your "faults" that annoy them designed to control response- STFU and then validate " I can see why you might think that"
Abusive rant- designed to control and insult response- STFU and walk away, next day correct boundary infringement
Sulk- make you feel small for wrong doing response- STFU and ignore, act as if did not happen
Rail- designed to press your buttons keeps on about one issue, can even involve following you to the loo response- STFU and leave to go GAL
Disappear- designed to make you worry and apprehensive response- STFU detach and act as if all ok
Tantrum- no purpose whatsoever but feels good response- STFU and look surprised
Blame- design to shift responsibility response- validate and deflect if not responsible, if are responsible diffuse by accepting responsible then apologise then walk away
In all sitches detach and if necessary act confused. confused
A very early post, at this stage I was suffering from between 2 and 5 verbal abuse episodes a day
V
I hear you Vanilla. So did you D your H or did he D you?
He sincerely believes I'm being passive-aggressive. Maybe even trying some DB ideas (detaching). Of course I recognize it's all about control for him. Whenever I try validation stuff he sees it as psycho babble BS. Remember, he's a trained counselor. There should probably be a "Spouses of counselors Anonymous" because its such a unique place to be! Act confused = I'm stupid. But, whatever. 2-5 is about right. Hope you're well Vanilla.
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
Ad hoc old post from very early in my journey, when I was getting to grips with level 1 abuse. I hadn't understood at that point this was all about control.
When H goes into verbal diarrhoea mode. I spent my time analysing it.
Spew- incoherent rubbish designed to put you on edge. response: STFU and walk away
Abusive spew: incoherent rubbish designed to put you on edge and insult response: STFU and walk away, next day correct boundary infringement
Rant- all of your "faults" that annoy them designed to control response- STFU and then validate " I can see why you might think that"
Abusive rant- designed to control and insult response- STFU and walk away, next day correct boundary infringement
Sulk- make you feel small for wrong doing response- STFU and ignore, act as if did not happen
Rail- designed to press your buttons keeps on about one issue, can even involve following you to the loo response- STFU and leave to go GAL
Disappear- designed to make you worry and apprehensive response- STFU detach and act as if all ok
Tantrum- no purpose whatsoever but feels good response- STFU and look surprised
Blame- design to shift responsibility response- validate and deflect if not responsible, if are responsible diffuse by accepting responsible then apologise then walk away
In all sitches detach and if necessary act confused. confused
A very early post, at this stage I was suffering from between 2 and 5 verbal abuse episodes a day
V
I hear you Vanilla. So did you D your H or did he D you? I filed, he did not respond to my filing. H disappeared to Italy with yet another OW (no 5 or 6) I called Maggotroni. He came back, haunted the village I live in, stalked a bit. Then threatened had his poisonous friend visit me.
I have asked the court baliff to serve.
I asked the court to chase.
He sincerely believes I'm being passive-aggressive.
He may or may not. It doesn't matter, what matters is what you think of you. He may think you eat 10 dozen chocolate Easter Eggs a day, or pick your nose every Tuesday. These guys are so addicted that they cant truly even know the day of the week.
Maybe even trying some DB ideas (detaching). Of course I recognize it's all about control for him. Whenever I try validation stuff he sees it as psycho babble BS. Remember, he's a trained counselor. There should probably be a "Spouses of counselors Anonymous" because its such a unique place to be!
I am getting to be the DB Queen. You have to when you live in crazy town.
Act confused = I'm stupid. =WTF you make no sense
But, whatever.
2-5 is about right.
I seriously prefer NC.
Hope you're well Vanilla.
Tired, overwhelmed with work.
---------------------------------------------
Its tiring to recover from this level of abuse. It was as bad as it gets, addiction and abuse. Then I read about brave DBers like Red and I almost feel I had it easy!
Stay well.
Are you 12 stepping yet?
V
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
