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Hi Betsey

I do agree with Renew and PIB, he may be getting in the pool very slowly because he remembers what Bruce looks like, and the sheer memory might make his slower. I think it is a great thing if he even goes, building the connection little by little.

I do understand your desire to "get something" out of your time and investment, I would guess you are going to achieve that no matter what. You have a great way of being able to pick and choose what works for you and apply it to real life.

Glad things are going great for you.

Hey guys,

I promise not to eat anyone or yell! I appreciate your feedback and encourage you to tell me what you think. That being said...

I hope that you all understand that this isn't an ultimatum I shared with him. I'm cautiously optimistic that he will choose to work on our M.

However, I have been separated for 15 months now, and had a 5 month stint in MC with him last year. I know ambivalence when I see it. I don't mind him exercising caution while making progress, and I hope you don't think I want all of it right now. I am unprepared for that sort of progress--even in myself.

However, I can no longer tolerate spending a lot of money waiting for him to make up his mind. He's had one foot out the door for a long time now. As I mentioned, I love him and want him. I want him to rejoin our family and accept our faults for what they are and nothing more.

Spending $130 every other week for him to wait to see if there is something worth saving is no longer an option for me as it was last year. I will gladly invest in our M, knowing that it will take a whole lot of effort along with the check... but I won't tolerate him sitting there with nothing to offer.

Does this make any sense? I want some reassurance that he's in the game... not still trying to figure out if he still likes playing baseball and thinking about quitting for good.

I know that many of you feel that this is a hard line for me to take. But I've been emotionally separated from him for 2 years now. I will be turning 42 soon, and I want to make plans for my future--either with or without him.

I've given him the benefit of the doubt for a really long time now. Now it's time for me to get the same from him.

Renew, Mr. Wonderful either participates 110% or 0%. In the years that I've known him and been married to him, he hasn't operated any other way. Last summer, the extent of his participation in MC was showing up. I realize that it's a start. I felt that then, and I feel it now.

But he wouldn't do what the MC suggested or any homework that involved considering me in the future. I'll know pretty soon after heading into MC which path he will take.

Putting in an effort doesn't mean that he will be operating at a miraculous speed and rate of progress. It will mean that he's willing to really try to get closer to me. I'm a fair woman (for the most part) and will be able to discern that he's trying.

So trying will be considered as 110%. Not trying or being willing to make ANY move will be interpreted as being unwilling to work.

And if that's what happens, I will ask the MC to counsel me out of our M. That is, give me some help transitioning myself and our girls into living life separately on a permanent basis.

I love him a lot, folks. I really do. But for the first time in my life, I love myself more. I love my girls so much that I've been willing to make some big changes in my behaviors and how I think. I've learned so much. But I won't allow any man to hold me prisoner only because he's afraid of making a mistake. I've given him plenty of latitude and time to sit on the fence to figure this out. It's time for action.

Please feel free to give me your feedback....

Betsey,
I do understand everything you said. Please keep in mind that last year when you both were in MC, you both were different people. You, by your own admission, have made real significant changes. But remember, Mr. W has made changes too. He has been on his own , just as you have.

I think and know, that you will go slowly before you make any radical decision concerning your M. You have the patience to give him some time to show progress. You have the wisdom to give him space while he puts actions into making progress towards a new M.

He's at least willing to get into the shark tank again! Let's not expect him to make a swan dive in. Let him get used to the water first.

Pattie,

Yes, I believe that's how I really see this reentry happening. Thanks for clarifying this.

Let's see if I can word this to accurately reflect what is in my heart for this man...

I love him, guys. I want to put my heart and soul into loving him again, and hope he will work on the same thing. I have reason to believe that he will do this.

I'm willing to watch him get into the pool and get acclimated to swimming again. I'm willing to exercise more patience with him in regards to me and our M.

How can I say this without putting all of us down for being where we are? I guess I have to be blunt: I am no longer interested in observing baby steps as my lifestyle indefinitely. It's been a great litmus test for a year now, and I've appreciated the concept. It has served me and the rest of my friends here very well.

Triple J asked me what has changed for me now? Honestly? Here's my answer: I'm now confident in myself as a woman, mother, person, friend. I see that I consistently make good choices and have a moral value system that is worthwhile and logical.

But I'm willing to risk everything I have to get what I want and deserve. I want to love with all my heart and I want to be loved in return. By a man who WANTS to love me.

I think Mr. Wonderful is that man.

I don't know if I've shared what transpired during MC last summer. Mr. W. has always been a person who values words. When we first walked into MC, I asked if he wanted to be there. He refused to respond. MC told me to allow him his silence and let his actions do the talking.

Well, his actions mirrored his words: nothing.

Our last joint session together was awful. I finally mustered the courage to ask him what his intentions were on going to MC every other week for 5 months. He said, "I did it so I could see if you or MC could give me a reason to get back into the game, and so far you both struck out. At least if we D, I can tell everyone we went to MC for 5 months and it didn't work."

Let me repeat the immortal words of Gene Kranz in Apollo 13: Failure is not an option.

I am not a failure and no matter what path Mr. Wonderful chooses, I will still not be a failure... as a wife, mother, woman, friend, daughter, sister, lover or human being.

I want to rebuild my life with the goal of permanence.

All I need are words or small actions (a wink is as good as nod to a blind horse, you know) that say, "I'm in this game with you, Bets. Please be patient with me, because I'm scared. But I'm here and I'm in."

I hope you all can understand that.

There has been nothing more rewarding to me over the past year than having all of you in my life. Without you, I would still be scratching my butt in the outfield. Instead, you guys taught me how to catch, coach, field, bat and run.

I promise to put everything you've taught me into good use in the other games I play... so please trust me. I'm not abandoning you or the rest of our team. We've been through too much for me to bail. But I think I can win. If I didn't, I wouldn't be willing to put it all out on the line like this. But I have to have some feeling or verbalizing that he's playing the game.... not trying to do a rain dance to have it rescheduled for another day.

I realize that swimming with me is going to take a whole lot of trust on his part too. That's why I'm willing to swim around by myself for a bit to see how he gets acclimated to the ocean and swimming with a shark again.

Trust me.

As you well know from our conversation last night, I support your policy of 0% or 110%. I support it all the more because it is not a vocal choice. Meaning, you are not saying, “MW, I want you to pick which side of the fence you will land on – jump now!” You are going to do what you can do with this MC and watch carefully to explore his devotion to this marriage and make your own decisions from there.

I would grab the reins quick if separation OR changing of attitudes had been only a few months. I would also be setting off caution alarms if I felt that you were crazymaking under a different name. I think that your statement about loving yourself was incredibly strong, and really the key to this process. Only you know how much of something you can take on, and only you know when it is time to release the grip.

I honestly don’t feel that you will need to release any grip. I do have never failing optimism for MW…and for your marriage. I see both of you exhibiting changes that I bet neither one of you thought yourselves or your partner capable of. Your entire family has benefited from this past year Bets. Know that. They have seen their parents demonstrate extreme strength in changing themselves for the better. I say parents because I’m including MW in that. I know, I know...you have changed MORE…but he has done a little too

As I take this time to figure out where I am going and how I am going to get there, know that I still do read this stuff and while time is not something in great abundance right now I will post when I can! And I just wanted to say – GO YOU!!! Because Bruce, you’ve earned a blue ribbon!

Big hug for Mer!!!
I agree with everything she said - I think this is the right path for you, Bets, and you have worked very hard to get to the place where you know that...I am glad to hear you are't leving the BB yet!
Hugs,
Myrrh

Betsey,

Of course you love Mr.W we all know that! You wouldn't be human if you didn't have reservations about his pending participation.

Bets, do you think maybe you're dwelling on the past counseling sessions ? Sounds like they were the pits! Don't expect this new round of sessions to be the same. You have changed and so has Mr.W. Just don't assume the sessions will be more of the same.

You have worked very hard to get to this point. You will not fail now no matter what happens. You are a strong woman.

Excellent! Sounds like you are very centered and know what you want to me. You have really well defined mindset and strategies. I wish the best for both of you at MC. I know things will be better for you no matter what, that you will find the happiness you are looking for. GO YOU! Go Mr.W! Hey, how would he look in a spandex uniform? Spandex thong? Egads!

Dear Betsey

Wanted to pop over to your thread and thank you personally for all the posts you've put thought into over on my thread. Funnily enough, I had just posted a rather similar (in resolve) post on mine before coming over here and reading your latest!

Two points. I have only been here on this BB since very late last year, and don't know all the details of your situation from the beginning, but I got the feeling that Mr W had made much bigger "baby steps" just recently, so things are speeding up a little? Do you need to jump the gun just at this point?

Also, do you need counselling "out" of your M, or just personal counselling that will work for "whatever happens"? The former seems a little negative and perhaps final. Just a thought.

Remember a while back I thought your term 'Mr Wonderful' was heartfelt, rather than a little sly dig? Well, sounds like he is turning back into your original 'truly Mr Wonderful' in small, but clear steps. Here's hoping!

Thanks once again Betsey!

Livnlearn

Hey Bets!

I hear what you are saying and I believe I understand.

I guess, I just wanted to encourage you to keep being patient. I know this is a long tough process...and we each have our limits.

My limit came for me several times before my husband moved back home.

Each time, I told him, "look...at this point a divorce wouldn't impact my life that much...you are already not acting like my husband, not involved in my life at all, and you keep your life private from me. I want to be loved, valued and cherished. If you can't do it...I'm ready to move on."

Twice, he told me, "I'm not ready, I understand if you want to give up...but please, give me a little longer."

The 3rd time, he realized I meant it..I was ready to walk.

And he agreed to move in.

After we started living together, he admitted that he had been stalling me all along out of fear that my changes weren't real.

It was something that, that 3rd time, I was ready and willing to walk away, guilt free, knowing I'd tried my best...and knowing that I'd thrive without him.

It's obvious to me that you are at that point as well.

I hope he comes back to you. But my eyes are filling up with tears, because even if he doesn't, you have become so powerful, strong, and wonderful.

I hope he doesn't lose out on that. But it IS his choice.

Hugs to you, Bets!