Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers Finally! 2015 is coming to an end. :-)

There are four kinds of horses: excellent ones, good ones, poor ones, and bad ones. The best horse will run slow and fast, right and left, at the driver’s will, before it sees the shadow of the whip; the second best will run as well as the first one, just before the whip reaches its skin; the third one will run when it feels pain on its body; the fourth will run after the pain penetrates to the marrow of its bones. You can imagine how difficult it is for the fourth one to learn to run.

“When we hear this story, almost all of us want to be the best horse. If it is impossible to be the best
one, we want to be the second best.” But this is a mistake, when you learn too easily, you’re tempted not to work hard, not to penetrate to the marrow of a practice.

Zen Story,
Culled from Zen Mind, Beginner’s Mind by Shunryu Suzuki Roshi

Your changes have been difficult J. Seemingly impossible to deal with at times. They have been hard lessons but you have met every challenge with greatness. You are an example to all of us. Be well Ancaire, be well

I think the letters to your children were a nice idea.

I am finding that saying and doing nothing works better to get me what I want then saying the things I really want to say...you know the ones that we role play in our mind. Not saying anything is my 180.

When we were trying to figure out how the kids will spend christmas, I just wanted so badly to rub it in and make a comment like " you and your mom thought divorce would go over smooth and easy, how's it working for you? Kids don't want to see you for christmas". Or " did all your friends and supporters tell you how hard the holidays would be, or how hard it really is on kids...not that your decision was made based on them?" Or "I'm the one that does the daily grind. You chose this and now you want them christmas? What about all the other days of the year"

Instead I just kept quiet and let him know how hard the back and forth would be on them. And you know what, he decided it was best for them to stay with me and just visited in morning before our parties started.

I think if you back out graciously and just give husband the time to reflect, instead of giving him a person to oppose it will work better for you.

Yes,that is so true Ancaire! It is so sad that they think they will be happy because they have not looked inwards and realised that they need to change themselves too. One of the reasons I want to shove DR into H's hands so badly!




I understand how frustrating this is for you! I'm right there with you on this frustration. We haven't had any loving interactions for a long time until our holiday this August when H took me in his arms and kissed me when we were sight seeing. I was blown away by it and thrilled that we could get back on track. H cannot even remember it!?!?!?! He can remember all the bits leading up to that moment and all the bits after that moment on that trip, but not that kiss. Crazy!!!! MWD does say they will re-write history and they certainly do. It is so frustrating! My H says, "I'm sure you're not lying about it happening but I honestly can't remember it."



Me too. You are an amazing person for being able to look at yourself and be honest about your part in it and an even better person for wanting to do something about it! If only our Hs could see themselves as clearly.



You are right. It is so incredibly hard to do when it is sadly not just his own life he is messing up. Mine OK, I feel he is entitled to do that but our children's lives? No. I'm not sure I can get to a place that forgives him for changing our children's lives forever.



At least you have learned it Ancaire! You are doing well with it. I need more practice here I feel lol!

Oh how I wish we could say those examples you give in your post JulieH! I've said all of those in my head when trying to sort out Christmas too!

Hang in there, Ancaire!

Venting here to those of us who are following your sitch rather than letting it out on your H is a great decision. You'll probably get a more helpful reaction and you can have the freedom of not walking on eggshells while you do.

Love the idea of the letter to your kids!

Ancaire, you are definitely not to blame, we ALL could be better spouses. And for what its worth, I wouldn't work on getting the kids to forgive him, let them resolve it on their own times in their own ways. You are not responsible for their relationship with their father. I am learning this in family therapy, and my children are a lot younger than yours. Let them work it out or not in their own way.

I agree, Fo. They need to work it out. But, when I was in a much darker place, I encouraged them to hate him. I'm not proud of it - but when they would say something negative, I would be there cheering them on.

My letter was an apology, for all of it (the catastrophic mess after BD) that I was responsible for. I wanted to let them off the hook in case they were avoiding H for my sake. I think two of them were, because as soon as they received that letter, H was suddenly welcome, that night, to something that had been planned for weeks.

I feel better. I needed to attempt to clean up MY mess. I'm done now, though. The rest is up to H.

There's no guide book for this and you have your feelings to deal with. The letter was great and the kids can now act on their feelings re H.

All the best for 2016. Rd. xx

I think it's a fine line with the kids and what to tell them. Based on seeing what my MIL did, (she never let him know why she went back to work full time and why father was never around when he was younger. In fact she would constantly say things like "your father is a great provider. He worked all the time to provide for us". .even when husband was older, over and over, and over in a really weird way). And then he tried to reproduce a unhealthy enabled relationship.

I want my sons to know that their fathers decision is not a normal or acceptable way to act so they don't repeat the cycle, but I don't want them to think they are rejected by dad either.

You did it! Christmas over and done...

Yep, emotions higher than a kite. It is standard for the holiday season. Try to avoid him until the holidays are a memory, neither of you will say what you mean right now.

Dont blame yourself. I am not gonna give you logical reasons why not, just dont. You said you were going to focus on GAL, now that sounds interesting. How can we do this without straining the poor heart?