Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers The final push

I don't know about working, if that even means anything but it sits well with me. Letter writing isn't a no no if it's done right (I've done it wrong too many times).

But, I have several times in what seems like a lifetime ago tried to say what GB has done so well. Back then I was a pursuing blubbering wreck. Not so much now.

GB's choice of language feels just about the right balance of strength and integrity. There are wee bits I will change but mostly it's on the money.

Like you, my W doesn't respond well to LRT. I'm under the impression she thinks I'm gone. I know right now she is as well but at least this states quite clearly that there is still an opportunity to make amends.

But like GB says, it may not convince her of anything.

Can I just add. GB if you are still around. There is also the embarrassment factor. What about my family and her having to reconnect with them? I think this is a big issue for her.

NDY,

I am not sure if I agree with GB's approach.

I would respond to W's email in a single paragraph using KISS and STFU principles with a dash of validation. There have been people who have D'd and reconciled later on. As Cadet says, only YOU can get to decide this.

Post your draft here and we'll support you through this. I am curious. Have you ever said anything to W about the 'no OM' boundary?


W's Original Email

Hi

I don’t feel that things are great in the house right now and it is probably going to get worse before it gets better. We need to have a chat around our next steps regarding the house.

Can you please confirm that you are still of a mind of not accepting a settlement so that you can go and buy somewhere of your own? If this is the case, then we need to discuss selling the house and speaking to S9 about this. I would rather do this soon so that we can start making the necessary arrangements.

I don’t think it is healthy for any of us to continue as we are with no agreed way forward or timeline. If you could have a think of what you feel is the best way forward for S9 and also for us, to try and ensure we have a continuing productive relationship in the future. Please let me know your thoughts on this when you get a chance.

Funny choice of words.

HOW YOU FEEL!

Perhaps your feelings are lying to you as well.

Perhaps your feelings aren't truth either.

In time you may discover all this time you are spending on trying to save your wife was wasted energy. That your wife really wasn't capable of repentance and has a become a person your really shouldn't be around or want to ever be with again. In time you may discover a better life without her in it and find a new relationship or even marriage that enriches your life beyond your wildest dreams and to a point you'll actually appreciate the freedom your selfish almost narcissistic wayward then ex-wife gave you at the end of this ordeal.

"Feelings" aren't truth. The way you and your wife feel today will not be how either of you feel a year from now, let alone 10 years from now.

What is truth?

Without getting religious on you....why does the truth matter here. Because the truth in your relationship is that you took vows to one another to love each other in sickness and health and in good times and bad. Your vows aren't dependent on what she does or doesn't do for you. They just are...a truth. You and your wife should live up to those vows despite your feelings because it's the right thing to do and it would be the best thing for your son, statistically speaking for his longterm emotional, financial, and educational success. By fighting for you marriage and family you are modeling for your son what "doing right" and "living up to your commitments/vows" mean and how far you're willing to go to save your wife from making the mistake of her life.

Truth: There is always hope.

Truth: People are not disposable. Your wife is lost and being incredibly hurtful but she remains worth fighting for because unlike the behavior she is modeling, people aren't to be thrown away just so you can be happy. Happy is not as important as truth, living up to your commitments and doing what is right.

Truth: When someone casts you aside....go. Once she divorces you and free you from your covenants you are under no obligation to maintain a workable relationship with her. You model for your son that you don't have to put up with people that abuse you for the sake of everyone else's happiness. YOU matter.

Another truth. You don't deserve this. Nobody does. But you will be OK how ever this ends up.

Hi wonka

Yes, I did but she just rode right over that one. She doesn't care.

I know what you mean about KISS and STFU but this hasn't worked at all for the last few months. I'm trying to get across here that LRT is pushing her away further. This latest email was in the making. I was expecting it because she is right, things at home are pretty bad.

I feel that at least with GB's approach she will know my stance. Right now all that is happening is dragging this out and if I'm honest we are both suffocating.

I get how the distancing and detaching thing is supposed to work. I truly do but I also know my W. She's not going to deviate from this path so I need to let her know there is an alternative option available to her.

Thanks GB. Nicely put. I think using the words "how I feel" was a Freaudian slip. Just goes to show you think you are detaching then you realise not so much.

In what ways did you think she rode over "that one"...can you please give us some more detail as this is a bit vague.



I am wondering if you're confusing LRT with being cold/jerk or brusque with W. Have you done something like this with W in the past? Many times I've seen posters seethe with anger and it comes out as being short, abrupt, and cold to the WAS.



How bad is "bad"?? What do you mean by this? Can you do a brief recap of this comment?



I've seen the "no OM" boundary speech work effectively if paired with quiet strength that takes no chit from the wayward wife. Have you read up on Sandi's threads about the WAW for LBHs? There's a ton of gold right in there.



Posters often confuse being distant with detachment. It's not the case when DBing. Being distant and detaching is a dangerous mix. You want to be coridal, polite and BE detached...this is achieved through GALing which takes the focus off of your sitch.

If you are worried about when our family, parents and friends will think about it you and us reconciling I'd like to point out a few things. Initially, we would avoid them and spend a great deal of our time rebuilding OUR marriage and relationship before bothering with others outside of our immediate family. Then, if we've come to a place of forgiveness relationships with my family and our friends can develop and profess naturally out of that forgiveness or not. They wouldn't have the right to judge you or disrespect you for something that I have already forgiven you for. That doesn't mean we won't have difficult moments and issues now and then. It's family and that's how relationships ebb and flow but I guarantee I will stand by your side every step of the way.

It's like we tell our son, it's not what you did wrong that the biggest issue but how you conduct yourself afterwards that makes all the difference. Acknowledge, apologize, make amends.

Peter denied Jesus THREE times before the rooster crowed...Jesus still loved him. I am certainly no Jesus, but I'm trying and think our son is worth trying for too.

I'd like to point out that reconciliation don't happen in a vacuum. It's not like NDY is just gonna wait on a beach in Cancun in his rented tux and wait for his ex-wife to appear. At some point he's got to tell her that he cares about her and would like to reconcile. Sure some ex-wives might chase down their ex-betrayed husband's and beg them for another chance but there are some/many that are just too embarrassed or too convinced their ex-husband wouldn't want that to pursue it.

This might be MORE applicable in this case because he basically sent her a note when he moved back in saying "do whatever you want, I don't care".

I'd estimate he's much better off communicating that and being done with it now while he actually still honestly FEELS that way than later on when he won't FEEL that way at all.

There is nothing inherently "needy" about a man expressing his feelings. No begging. No pleading. Stick to the facts and convey how you FEEL today because actually your wife is the one that is truly running out of time here to turn her life around and discontinue making the biggest mistake of HER life.



OH...if she asks if you are calling her a bad parent.

Maybe answer: "Yes. Betraying and divorcing the father of your child is a huge disastrous parenting mistake. Our child is an awesome kid and he MAY be fine either way but the odds of him having a happy successful life will be significantly impacted by your choices. Children from divorced homes just don't do as well as kids from intact loving families. If you aren't sure, do your own research on the subject. Heck, why don't you ask him what he wants you to do. In fact, how about the 3 of us take a vote. You see this is all about YOU and what YOU want to do. If you really were a great parent and cared about what your kids wanted you'd ask him and take his vote into consideration, wouldn't you???"

Then shut up. Plant seeds and walk away as the she goes nuclear. You are detached. How she FEELS about your slight is just a feeling. The more poignant the more upset they get. Your job isn't to keep your wife from getting and being upset. You just live up to your vows. Keep calm. Don't engage in the fighting. Listen and validate. What she spews says more about her than anything about you, BUT she'll never be able to deny that you shared the truth with her. That it IS a horrible and disastrous parenting decision. If she ever wakes up from HER nightmare she may remember your words. Maybe not. Doesn't matter. No expectations. Feelings aren't truth. They just are. She's overwhelmed with inappropriate feelings. She can't hurt you anymore than she already has.

That's why the 180 approach I suggest is consistent with MWD's and db concepts.

1. It is polite for NDY to respond to his wife's email. He can be detached AND send her an honest polite email. Maybe tone down my rhetoric a bit but still.

2. Is it actually more cordial, gracious and friendly to be honest with her rather than hiding your feelings and intentions hoping to passive aggressively manipulate an attraction while being short, curt and evasive. I know I prefer my friends to be honest with me and to hold me accountable. Remember, IF and WHEN they recover, they'll be married a long time thereafter (presumably) so how he behaves now, as a man, will set the tone for how he is learning to behave the rest of their recovered marriage (or after a divorce with someone new). It isn't ungracious to share your feelings with persons you are in a relationship with.

3. We are our brothers keeper. That goes double for spouses. When someone wrongs us it is our job to let that person know that have offended us and then it becomes that persons choice to do or not do something about that. NDY's wife is oblivious about her behavior and it's effect upon NDY. Telling her is the socially responsible thing to do. Expecting her to do anything about it is where things go awry.