Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers Zelda - reflecting and grieving

GAH! Our first text argument:

H: Z, I can't file the quitclaim, I'd be liable for half the house, you file for D first.

z: You are not on the mortgage. It gives up your interest only.

H: Forgive me if I don't trust you. I'll gladly file QC after D is filed.

Z: If we file D first, there is no recourse for me to get you off that deed.

H: I'll affirm it, I have no interest in anything that isn't mine.

Z: Same. Get the QC filed and prove it. I won't ask you for anything afterward.

H:That house is yours, you wanted it, you pushed for it, I don't want anything to do with it.

Z:So get it filed.

H: Z, please reread my first text today. I'll have to pay docstamps and that isn't fair. DOn't make me do this. I will set up paperwork for you to review.

Z: It is fair. You didn't want to be in this M, you couldn't even tell me I could feel safe. I pushed for us, and you never wanted us, the dog, the house. You used me, H. You sabotaged everything so it timed with your settlement. You're free to go see other people now, so do it. Finish it.

H: I don't see it the same way.

Z:I wasn't even worth an apology for what you dod to me that night.

H: Z, please stay on the topic of paperwork.

Z: I will not do the paperwork or pay one dollar toward it. You wanted this, you can be responsible. I kept my vows and even begged you to address your temper. You had no interest. So you handle it. You can tell eveyone tht you D me. For years you were happy enough to go along with what I wanted, so now I'll return the favor.

H:You agreed we'd go our separate ways and leave with what we came in with. I'll take dog if she's too much for you though.

Z. You will not. She was mine before M, our agreement stands. You handle it though.

H: Ok.

What an asshat.

I can't believe I'm going to type this.......

BUT.....

I kind of agree with your H (in some sense).

I think you do need to stay on the topic of paperwork. Arguing your point or view is just more of the same, or a cheese-less tunnel. And pointing out all of the ways you believe he sabotaged the marriage isn't going to make him wake up and go, "gee, I was an ass to Z, let me take care of the paperwork for her."

It may come down to you having to do the paperwork to get what you want. Otherwise, it may just go round and round and round.

Why is it so important for you to have him off the deed to the house? In case he changes his mind and wants equity during the D?

We can be divorced and without him signing the QC, he still has a 50/50 right to it after the D and I have no leverage of he wants equity, etc., even down the road it event of sale, he'd have to agree to sale and sign it then or split proceeds.

It's important bc I'm tired of him playing the 'do you know why she did it?' Game with our old friends. He's never once taken care of anything for us or paid for any of it. He wants a D, he can handle it. Doc stamps? After the settlement he got? C'mon.

Today is our anniversary.

I am feeling good about my decision to let H handle D. It will give him as much time to think about things as he wants and I will never have to look back and wonde of I killed our M when he still had hope. It will be the first and last thing in our R he will have ever seen to taking care of and will not be able to claim victim status. I can feel good about this.

A friend told me she ran into him and he said 'we were working in things' - probably just the polite answer.

I am good with my larger decision - to D this man if he believes this is how I should be treated. If he changes his mind and wishes to look at his temper and bullying, take responsibility for his life, find his independence and all, if he wishes to CONSISTENTLY want in this M, willing to work for it - I will do my part to continue DR.

Otherwise. Happy anniversary to me, it was the happiest day of my life and no one can take that away. I have my self-respect and I know I'll be ok.

Z

Please separate the Fins from emotion.

If you have to do more of the lifting, one to Tango. Bite the bullet and do it.

In several years time what will matter is your fin security. Cards to your chest, do what needs to be done.

At the end you can laugh until you pee yourself. You will have a house, the one you wanted, free and clear. For you and any children you have (your own, fostered or adopted).

Go for it gf. Focus on the end result and concentrate on the goal of fin security. Your H is only thinking short term fin, you have a longer perspective.

Text to H:

H I apologise I lost my rag, back in control, let's press on with this. Z

V

Glad to hear you are so confident on your anniversary. Mine was 2 days ago, on Easter while I was with all W's family. The anniversary just did not exist for me that day.

Regarding you legal issues: You could easily go to a lawyer and get a "Letter of intent" from H that he will file that after you filed. There for sure is a legal way around that. Just get informed.
I am more on your side on this tho, why would YOU file for D? But Calibri is right too, the way you positioned yourself in that discussion etc. I don't see any benefits from it.Always try to think of the outcome and the benefits and don't just defend your position, that is not going to get you anywhere. Be solution oriented. Be the strong and mature one.

What would solution oriented look like here? Solution to make a H that never really wanted to be here - want to be here, through DR?

Thank you, Complex. I'm sorry about your anniversary, it must have been tough being with your W' family, no?

What I said to my H in that text exchange...idk, I hadn't said any of it to him at all before then. Just nodded that we could go our separate ways when he was so smug after confrontation. I wanted him to know that I saw him, 'for real' this time without the mask. I wanted him to hear how I felt about it all. Not to steer an outcome, not because he cares particularly, but because I wanted to say it.

V, I think I am protected financially. We have no joint accounts and I doubt he really wants anything but to walk away. If in a few weeks time, maybe a couple months...perhaps I will feel like bringing us across the finish line. I don't know.

The letter of intent is a good idea. I suppose he could type, sign, have witnesses. I plan to see what he presents to me in terms of his stab at our D paperwork.

I have altered this slightly, but here is a letter he wrote me during our S when I asked him to tell me what he was so angry about. I thanked and validated. I read it now, and I don't know what to feel. I don't know what to make out of anything. I have put my current responses in parentheses. They are very far from the validated ones and very bitter.

:

"I feel anger about a lot of things. Going along in this relationship going on faith that you would be there for me. (Food, concerts, clothing, checking in with you 10x a day while I was at work, doing whatever you wanted to do and being a nurse for a year wasn't there for you?)

You would like spending time doing things I wanted to do, be interested in me. (I got you things you said you wanted for your hobbies that you never used, asked you to work on projects together you'd agree to, that I thought you'd like and you ignored me. Were you interested in you? As far as I could tell you liked to be entertained, distracted, or volunteering to help other people with their problems/creating drama.)

I am angry that all these things that we were dealing with my case/injury/accident never got the attention they deserved all along the way. (That is b.s. I took weeks off of work to run around hospitals and check rehab facilities out for you. You wouldn't even reach out to your lawyer or docs to resolve anything and I usually ended up making first contact. I researched hip replacements and knee replacements and all the latest surgeries bc you weren't interested and didn't want to look at it, just wanted to be angry that you were sure you were getting bottom of the barrel care. I took off work to be at every appointment until the day we got into a fight on the way over, you exploded disporportionately (bc of an unrelated comment I made) and you banned me from being part of anything last year.)

I am angry I am too far along now in my case to switch my lawyer and we seem to hate each other. (You switched your lawyer already because you hated/mistrusted that one, too. You have insulted him, assumed the worst, and refuse to do anything to mend the r even tho he has paid out of his own pocket for your psych care bc he is concerned.)

I am angry you weren't interested in me getting meds for depression when I first had the chance, two years ago. (I was wary, fine. I had no right to interject my opinion. But as far as I can tell your meds have made you crazier, which was what I was afraid of all along.)

I am angry all we seem to do is fight when all I wanted to do is not fight. (Seriously?! You escalate things and punch below the belt verbally, threaten our R at the drop of a hat, always have, and end up screaming and antagonizing and throwing things when I haven't even raised my voice.)

I am frustrated you are worried about emotionally cheating when you aren't able to listen to me. (Guilty as charged. I was not a great listener. And I did worry about all the POW you sought and the way you and your ex never let each other go and she was in the middle of us, always.)

I tried to support your decisions in whatever you wanted to do and I feel like I am on my own for so much. (You were incredibly supportive on the fluffy stuff, H, just not on anything I asked your help with around the house or that actually mattered to me.)

When I wanted to talk about my lwayer at 2am, I got an angry response. (I sleep 5 hours a night if I'm lucky and you woke me up to tell me that he's conspiring against you with the ins co. Yeah, not cool.)

I am angry in you just blowing up instead of us talking about stuff. (Actually, every time I tried to start a conversation about family, your plans for work in the future, finances - you blew up. You had to push me a lot before you saw 'screaming banshee')

I am mad that you weren't interested in my being finacially squeezed to the edge and that was fine but the second you get close to that it is all my fault for not making enough. (Are you delusional? I was intensely interested in you being able to not cover your bills because I was supporting you. How did you not see that connection?)

You reminding me how shitting I am for not contributing more to the 401k. The guilt I felt for not being able to buy you gifts for holidays. (Whatever. You could have thanked me for what I did. That would have meant something. You could have not made comments about 'but you LIKE work' when I was exhausted to the point of tears. You could have made me something, written out a card once in a while, that would have been fine. Anything.)

I was always frustrated you were never comfortable cuddling up together. (WHAT? So not true.)

I hate that you go thought my email and phone calls before and especially after we were married. (Nope, didn't happen after we married, I just saw the phone bill the day after you told me what would it look like to me if you found someone else.)

I was constantly giving in to the things you wanted because I had faith in our ability to handle it, even if we didn't have the ability to talk about it fully. I am sure we both never felt fully accepted with each other but to feel alone when we are together is just too much. (Then maybe you could have tried to communicate instead of acting like an angry sulking teenager, flipping me off when I went to you asking you to talk to me about what was bothering you. Instead you turned to your ex and any other POW that would listen to you tell them how your wife hated you.)

I am a lonely mess and cannot accurately tell you if the above stuff is even accurate. (You know this is twisted.)

I am sorry I couldn't convince you I found you beautiful. I am sorry I couldn't provide for you more financially. I am sorry I am not the leader you are looking for. I hope you understand how much more happiness there is out there for you. (Yet, as soon as you could provide, and had the opportunity to step up, make me feel loved - even after telling the counselors how loving I'd been since you returned - you raged at me for a comment I made about an errand you didn't do, ignored me, stole money out of my account and asked me, "well, what do YOU want to do about it?")

So - what is solution oriented at this point? What am I hoping for? The man I knew in 2009 to come back to me? To DR until I inspire that in him? My counselor told me I couldn't 'fix' him, I can't 'fix' our R if he's not interested. My friend at lunch today asked me if I honestly thought he was ever into our M? It might have been hurtful from anyone else, but the accident didn't start this - he was always on the fence about us, blaming me for everything. I guess, even from the outside, he looked like a man being dragged along. Maybe he loved me. Who knows.

Help me out with a good idea/bad idea/terrible idea question:

H wants to get his stuff this weekend.
I want to ask him to go to breakfast with me to discuss things.

Mostly I want to ask questions about why he did this, if he meant anything he said when he came back, why he handled things the way he did, if he meant to force my hand to the point where I couldn't go on trying to be M.
I want to see if we can figure out a letter of intent and draft it.

I just want answers. I don't want to have any of those convos at home.

Zelda,

I would let him come get his stuff and either while he's there have a conversation about a letter of intent. Or you can text him information about a letter of intent.

I would not ask him to go to breakfast to discuss things -- because honestly, I don't think that a)he has the answers and b)he has answers that would satisfy you.

Something I've learned in my life (but haven't been able to apply fully) is that you have to learn to accept the apology you're never going to get.

Let some time pass (months probably) and re-evaluate if you need to have these questions answered. You may find in time that the answers don't matter. And if they do? Enough time has passed where you two can approach it when you're not caught in the middle of it.

Calibri,

I know you're probably right. I know my friend was right when she said that questions - if answered - will only lead to more questions. That I get closure when I choose to get closure, it's not a gift he can give me.

Even I am trying to minimize his behavior in my head. Maybe it was just a broken phone and some dishes, maybe he was like TLEE, and actually wanted his M. Maybe to him, it's like I brought the hammer down and kicked him out of the house for the 2nd time. Maybe we'd still be piecing if I'd let it blow over, and it could have been addressed in counseling the next time. Maybe I was stressing him out in the final week before this happened and he gave up bc our M started to look too much like the one he left to begin with. He loved me intensely, once. Clearly, I'm in the bargaining stage of my grief today.

I am trying to remind myself of what you said earlier, about all the times H showed me how immature, tempermental, irresponsible and basically some core character holes of his. I have a list a mile long where he was NOT a good H.

Why am I struggling so hard with this then?

This is the root of my suffering, the detaching I can't seem to do. The wondering, I know I should stop, but it matters to me so much. I break down crying hearing my own questions:

"Why did you sit across the table holding my hand, telling me you were all-in, you couldn't wait to provide for us and be a good H to me? Only weeks before you did this?

"Why did you tell me the day before how lucky you were?"

"Did you plan this?"

"Why did I get the silent treatment from you after that?

Did you mean to force me into saying enough - the way you asked me on the couch, "well Z, what are you going to do about it?"

"When I was gone for work - is that when you decided you were unhappy again? I came back and you said you'd been arguing with me in your head."

"Have you started dating already? It is what you said you wanted."