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I know you did not just ask that question!

You are suggesting he stoop to the OM's techniques, and expect to have an honorable M with his W? This is a wayward woman. If her H stoops to the things suggested in the above quote, how then can he believe she can respect him as the better man.......when he has behaved the same as OM?



Groundwork in place. What is the groundwork? Deceit and lies? It certainly won't be anything with high standards, integrity, honor, and the principles one hopes to build a M upon. How can she see him "saving" her when he imitated the actions of the OM?

All this would accomplish would be two men feeding her needs, instead of one. She would grow to lust after more excitement. She would not suffer consequences of her waywardness, but would be rewarded. Instead of her love being rekindled for her H, she would be on the lookout for OM #2. Nowhere in this type of scenario encourages a sense of remorse from her.

1. So, Sandi, if a criminal steals money from a bank and the bank tries to recover the money then the bank is stooping to the criminals level? I don't think so. She's HIS wife. HIS soulmate. To NOT seek the recovery of your God given spouse is neglect. In this case, she already thinks he neglected her so a proper 180 plan, I suggest, would involve doing the opposite.

2. He won't be mimicking OM's actions, just OM"s results of getting his wife to start relying on him emotionally again and stirring feelings for her husband again as he meets her needs in the manner she likes most as ONLY he can fill those needs. This isn't "lies and deceit" this is dating 101. It ain't the easy route. I did it and i've been recovered 100% for a decade. My wife and I help other couples now recover from infidelity in our real lives. If a husband doesn't value his wife enough to fight for her...who will?

3. There is absolutely no indication that this wayward wife is a serial cheater addicted to "more excitement" and multiple affairs with multiple men. Let's help this poster get rid of OM#1 before we worry about OM#2 or OM#3. Thinking more about this ~~~~if this wayward wife IS a serial cheater and addicted to being in affairs then this betrayed husband is better off knowing that sooner rather than "standing" back GAL'ing silently hoping for recovery for the next 2 years with a wayward wife incapable of a monogamous relationship.

4. How do you still relate affairs and the phrase "more excitement"??? I find that very odd. Affairs are soul and relationship destroying travesties. I kind of find it disturbing and hurtful to imply that this man's betrayed wife is having fun or the time of her life. Affairs aren't exciting they ARE quasi-suicidal behavior. His wife is lying on the floor of a crack house and needs her husband to save her. She's high on the drug of an affair so relating to her rationally is out the window so you have to be cunning to attract her away from the OM and to a safe place where you eventually sober her up and THEN work on healing your relationship with her.

5. Remorse happens when she's in love with the man that loved her enough to save her from herself.

6. Sandi, if your betrayed husband didn't do this for you, I am sorry.

Sandi, the question was more sarcastic then anything. I wouldn't or couldn't stoop to OM level. That's not me.

I did have a great weekend. Went to the fishing contest. Got to see a lot of old friends. And hang out with the BIL and SIL. Who by the way are not happy with the wife. And are just plan sick of her childish ways. Whole lot of hatred going on in there family, consering the wife right know. I just tried to stay out of there angry comments. And told them she is on a journey and maybe some day she will figure it all out. Hopefully it won't be to late with the kids. I did get a ton of compliments on how happy and how I'm taking the high road on everything. And how I'm such the perfect father for my kids. Now that's what I want to be known for in my legacy of life.

Speaking of the kids. They are not happy with there mom right now either. She could have taken them to the contest or let her family take them. But didn't. The oldest did get out there because he made all the arrangements. With no help from his mom. The little two were pretty upset about it. I'm just kind of sick of trying to save the day for them. Not like I don't want every waking moment with them. But some times their mom just has to see there anger. If I come in and save the day for them, she never will see it. Like, I guess on Sunday their mom planned a last minute birthday party for her family for the boys. And the oldest really let her have it. No cloths were washed. They where already running late. And he let her know that in some not so nice cuss words how he felt. Now I'm not the one to let any foul language happen in my house. Ex specially from the kids towards their mom and dad. But this was at her house and I was not present. So let it fly young man. Obviously he has lost all respect for his mom. He is not that kind of boy. I just hope it won't be to late for the wife and the kids will lose all respect for her.

Thanks
3kids

Just need to vent some anger.

So I found out why the kids didn't get to do anything or cloths weren't washed at her house. The wife was on the phone all weekend. Does the drama ever stop with the WAS? Do they ever stop and look at there kids? Do the kids ever come back into there life? I just feel so bad for my kids. The youngest two vented to me yesterday and it's still kind of got a hold on me. First complaint was that mom doesn't do anything with them. For example she bought a bunch of board games for them. So the kids where excited to play with mom. Nope they played by them selves all weekend. I thought that they where just starting to except that this was not their mom anymore. But maybe not. They both told me "I wonder what she would do if we broke that phone maybe then she would do stuff with us or listen to us". They even vented about money. That they have to hide there money. Apparently the boys got some money for gifts from family. And she took it right out of there hands and payed her mom with it for something. She told the kids she would pay them back. As the kids told me she has done this before and they have yet to see the money come back to them. Their resentment grows every day for their mom.

I guess I'm less concerned about her actions. And more concerned about my responses to there venting. Is there better responses then, I'm sorry, have you ever talked to her about this, show how you feel, you know I love you, I'm sorry I can't control what your mom does, or sometimes just hug them and suggest we move on to a happier subject.

Any help on this matter is greatly appreciated!

Thanks
3kids

Nope.

You don't need to help her hang herself...she's doing a fine job on her own. Just be respectful and teach them to be respectful as well. No matter how they feel, she is still their mother. You be the man YOU want to be, which (I'm presuming) is a man who expects his children to be respectful, compassionate people no matter how anyone else acts. They should absolutely feel free and comfortable enough to vent their frustrations, but they may need to have the line of what is and what is not appropriate behavior enforced.

-PM

Not as long as they are wayward.



Not as long as they are wayward.



Not as long as they are wayward.

Not trying to be a smart-a$$, but the key word is WAW/WW. Nothing changes as long as they are in that state.



How can kids, 6-9&13, accept it when adults can't handle it?

One of my adult children has gone through the same thing as you are. It is so hard to STFU when the kids tell off on the wayward parent. About all you can do is tell your kids you are so sorry and you understand them. I wouldn't try to defend her, b/c those actions can't be defended without your children turning against you, too. I say let them vent to you and don't prevent them from expressing how they feel. You will know where to draw the line if they go too far. Don't say anything bad against her, but don't defend her, either.

You've already tried to explain how their mother is making poor choices, is not herself, etc. It doesn't really help very much. It's a tough spot for you. Just be careful not to say too much.

You asked if the kids ever come back into their life, and I assumed you meant the WW's. But here's the thing....by the time she gets her life straightened up, the kids may not want back in her life. Especially the oldest one. However, (depending on the children) they may have that need for a mother's love & attention so strongly, they will try to get whatever they can from her.

She is destroying her R with them and losing out on their childhood. She may even get them back into her life some day, but not their childhood......unless she does a super fast job of getting out of her waywardness.

Sorry, Georgia, just now see your post. I've tried to find your story, but I must have missed it somehow. Anyway, I will try to respond to your points.



No, the bank would not be stooping to the criminal's level, b/c the bank would not be stealing it back. The bank would not be doing what the thief did to get the money.

I am not debating about recovery, but I do not agree with your advice about "how" to get his wife back. Not if he is an upright person. He has three children watching their father, and what you are encouraging should go against his integrity. Sneaking around, encouraging her to keep secrets from the other guy, and acting as if they are doing something sinful, is not what a man of honor would do. He is the only parent left to lead those children in the right path of life.



Well maybe I misunderstood you, but this is part of what you said:



To me, that is pretty much saying to use the same methods that OM used.



Look again at what I said. The excitement of the A is addictive. If her H uses the same methods as OM, then if she's not completely turned off by H, she'll be turned on to the thrill of feeling like her and H are being like her and OM were. That will be the drive.....it is the addiction of the "high". It won't be b/c H is a better man that than the other guy.....not when he mirrors the same behavior/techniques. You think she's going home to be a good girl just to be with him? Without any remorse, no regret, no consequences, no lessons learned? Just out of sheer love for him? Wait.....she's still wayward, right?

I dare say that there would be more risk in her seeking another "high" than her sitting around being a wholesome wife/mother, waiting for the rest of those somewhat restored feelings to kick in. I never said she was a serial cheater now, however, the reasons I just gave is a clear way for her to become one.







Are we still talking about a wayward WAW who is a drug addict?



No need to be sorry for me. Really.

Thank you PM and Sandi. It's good to know that I'm on the right track with my kids. It's good to know that what I'm doing with them installs some of the right ethics and caring that was installed on me growing up. And I know that they have at least one parent to rely on.

PM I'm still reading my earl posts. I find it very difficult some days. And I have to stop. It brings up a lot of emotions. Some like, what was I doing, others very sad. I hope I'm learning from this hole ordeal. And I think i am. I can't express how much GALing helps to this board. It brings out the best, excepcialy when your in a funk.

For instance, last night I had a basketball game for the oldest. The wife did show up(shocker). After the game I was talking to some other parents and she approached me(she looked like she had been crying for days). We chit chated about kids stuff. I asked if she was ok and she responded with a shrug of the shoulders. I simply said if she needed to talk let me know. She declined but said thanks. Then I walked away and continued to talk to everyone else with a smile on my face. Afterwards I gave it a two second thought. And said to myself not my problem anymore. And continued with my night of GALing.

Then came just a little bit ago. She called me. Which is really odd. Because we are pretty much no contact right now. We talked about every thing from taxes to kids. Just securing up some loose ends. Again I asked if she was ok(you just know when something's up with them). This time I got I just am not good not bad. She brought up her job and how she wants to get her nursing degree and start a old folks home. But probably needs a business class or two. But suggested if we where together I could handle that(that's my major). Normally I would have jumped at that opening but I just said I think maybe that ship has sailed. Then next she started talking about how she can't find a place all to small or to much money. She joked how she could use our camper and live at a campsite with the kids. I told her you will find something, you always figure it out(not offering my place). She said she just has to stop putting it off and figure out her life. I told her what I have been telling the kids because they have been asking. Which was they will always have a place to stay with me and their mom can live with family and always pick them up until she finds a place. And not to worry. She was shocked that I told them that(like" you told them that"). Well you know the kids and I just wanted them not to worry about it. This was the first time we talked like that in two months instead of the one minute phone calls.

I'm proud of myself for two things. One I didn't seem available or offer my help. Second my PMA was off the charts and didn't show any emotions(control). The down part was I still think about saving her and not leaving the door open. I'm sure that will eventually go away(time). Even though right now I'm undecided if I want that door left open. With each day, week, month it gets harder to invision life with her anymore or how hard it would be to work though everything. I'm getting to a real happy place and the amount of work that it would take seems like a mountain.

Just keep working to better myself is what I'm left with.

Thanks
3kids

You sound great! Keep it up!

-PM