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Well, helping more with my daughter is a 180
Doing more housework is a 180
Taking care of the pets more is a 180
Not "yelling" is a 180....but that was rare
spending money selfishly - haven't purchased anything since june and sold my car and paid off bills w the money.
In general being there and helping more.....and I have been doing all of that. She even told me to quit doing so much about a month ago. I figured because I was constantly pushing to resolve things, talk about things, being emotional, that I should quit doing that and give her space as a 180. I even suggested that we do counseling bi - weekly rather than weekly.
Whenever we talk about the relationship she says she doesn't know what she wants aand I get emotional then she says she would be better off alone so she isn't hurting anyone .

Occasionally I had asked her if I can do anything different be she says no. I ask how she is doing emotionally...she says the same.

I'm reading the book again but I haven't had bad behavior for a while other than breaking down and crying....and I have done that leaving the room and going somewhere else but she comes and says she can hear me and I need to stop.

She told me she doesn't love me anymore. ...should I still tell her I love her? I want to be loving but I don't want to force myself on her . I didn't think stiff like that was bad behavior but assumed if it pressured her I should stop. I'm confused

ok, i'm thinking too much again I guess....so I need some input. here is a list of things that I used to do but have stopped because it put pressure on her or annoyed her. Plus we were talking about a trial separation but we are trying to do it without actually moving out because that would be financially stressful for both, but more importantly would be devastating on my daughter (almost 3)

1. send a text when she gets up saying "good morning beautiful" and inquire how our daughter slept (she doesn't always sleep at night) and if my wife got rest. - just stopped doing this in the past couple weeks as to give her space when we started talking separation.

2. give her a quick kiss and tell her I love her and wish her a great day when she leaves for work - havent told her I loved her but only 2-3 times in the past 2 months - I quit initiating the kiss and she made no attempt. if I do initiate, she almost looks paranoid?

3. I used to buy her fresh flowers every sunday when grocery shopping - have been doing this since december - stopped the past two weeks.

4. give her kiss and tell her i love her every night before bed

5. hold her hand when driving or walking - she hasn't initiated it in at least a month



list of things that I felt were good 180's

1. made arrangements at work to leave early so i could get my daughter up and take her to day care so my wife could get to work earlier.

2. got up early (before wife and daughter gets home) to work out or do it before I go to bed so I'm not taking a couple hours in the evening (8-10 pm) in order to spend more time with family

3. putting my daughter to bed every other night rather than my wife doing it every night (includes brushing teeth, reading, hair, etc)

4. do dishes and clean more often without question

5. feed the cats and clean the litter boxes so my wife does not have to do it - i rarely did it before except when she was pregnant

6. quit spending money on stupid stuff (that was one original complaint) - I do not go on craigslist, ebay, or any other site. if I am going to purchase something more than $25 I get my wife's input/permission


I almost feel as if I should ask her about the affection displays that I miss (hug, kiss, love you's and holding hands) but feel like it will be pressured.

we have not had sex it more than two months. and the last time we did, she was not into it at all. I understand that isn't even on the table right now, just putting down what I can think of.

guess my question is, should I just ask her what she feels is comfortable with? should I just try implementing things and see note the reactions (as book suggests) and only use ones that work? even though sometimes there isn't much reaction from her period....

according to the 37 rules , I should NOT say " I love you" ? so as hard as it it going to be, i guess I got my answer on that one.

as for the kiss and holding hands, I would assume that falls under pursuing?

and I asking her what she is comfortable with is like seeking affirmation? ** this one strikes me .... because that is all i would need to feel better..... guess that's off limits too.

the acting "as if" is VERY hard for me. it's hard to be "happy" without her. i am trying to work on the "as if"

I feel as if I've pulled back and I'm trying to be patient but nothing has worked ....... ugh


just ranting and typing thoughts. better to do it here .

as for the comment above about typing a text but not sending it..... i actually have done something similar to that. i will open up a WORD document and type everything I want to say as if I was going to send an email. but eventually, i would just read it over a few times and then delete it.

i would NOT do it on a text to her and just delete it because my dumb a$$ would probably somehow accidentally send it. hahaha that's why I won't even do a draft email.

"and I asking her what she is comfortable with is like seeking affirmation? ** this one strikes me .... because that is all i would need to feel better..... guess that's off limits too."

Dying, I think the point is, is that your supposed to make yourself feel better and not rely on the thoughts/actions/feelings/ of someone else to make you happy. Not that I'm any kind of expert at it, but that's the general idea, anyway.

thanks for the reply. I understand that and I couldn't edit it because the time was up before I realized that I should have put that "that is all I was seeking in the beginning"

don't get me wrong, I would love to have her say things are on the right track, but I'm not actually expecting it....but doesn't mean i'm not hoping for it. i am trying to make myself feel better, but it's hard because i don't know for sure I guess? we are still living together and that is the gift of time, and I'm trying to use it to my advantage. She hasn't actually left yet.

my mood just changes so much over the course of the day/night .

That's MUCH better.

"1. send a text when she gets up saying "good morning beautiful" and inquire how our daughter slept (she doesn't always sleep at night) and if my wife got rest. - just stopped doing this in the past couple weeks as to give her space when we started talking separation."

Stop with the "good morning beautiful" and the rest is fine to continue. I mean she still lives with you after all.

"1. made arrangements at work to leave early so i could get my daughter up and take her to day care so my wife could get to work earlier."

Good. But don't do it all the time.

"2. got up early (before wife and daughter gets home) to work out or do it before I go to bed so I'm not taking a couple hours in the evening (8-10 pm) in order to spend more time with family"

Did you work out before? How do you look physically?

"3. putting my daughter to bed every other night rather than my wife doing it every night (includes brushing teeth, reading, hair, etc)"

Why every other night? Are you and your W taking turns? There may be a few times where you can do it together.

"4. do dishes and clean more often without question"

Did you never clean before?

"5. feed the cats and clean the litter boxes so my wife does not have to do it - i rarely did it before except when she was pregnant"

This is a good one.

6. quit spending money on stupid stuff (that was one original complaint) - I do not go on craigslist, ebay, or any other site. if I am going to purchase something more than $25 I get my wife's input/permission

What were some of the "stupid" things you would buy?

"I almost feel as if I should ask her about the affection displays that I miss (hug, kiss, love you's and holding hands) but feel like it will be pressured."

Don't ask.

"That's MUCH better."

**thanks - just takes me a couple tries I guess - that's why I need to work on my communication. once something is said it can't be taken back**


"Stop with the "good morning beautiful" and the rest is fine to continue. I mean she still lives with you after all."

**i have called her beautiful since before we got married. I have always done the good morning beautiful if we were not together when we woke up, if we were together....i said it in person. that's why it bothers me so much to NOT do it. **


"Good. But don't do it all the time."

**i started with every day, now i'm doing it 4 days a week. working with my boss to slowly work it back to rarely - i enjoy doing this because I get to see my daughter first thing and I get to see her first smile and make her laugh to start her day. but I know It can't be permanent - one of her original complaintes was that I didn't help with my daughter enough and she felt like a single parent - so she might as well be one**


"Did you work out before? How do you look physically?"

**started working out in december - have lost 40+ lbs and am back in the shape i was (or better) then when my wife and I met. i was on a bad path with my health and decided to do something about it. especially after having fertility issues, i wanted to make sure I was healthy to improve our chances. although I actually started getting back into shape for my health, I also wanted to appeal to her more in a sexual way. she would make comments like "you were skinny when we met"...I'm 6'1" @ 200 lb, just competed in a 10 mile obstical course, 34" waist, 48" chest (just to give an idea?) - almost have 6-pack now. she has also lost 25 lbs and looks great, but she did her weight loss about the time of the OM / EA (which she denies) - for the past couple years we would not have sex often unless it was time to try for getting pregnant. even she made a comment earlier this year that its no fun when you HAVE to do it....??? **
**


"Why every other night? Are you and your W taking turns? There may be a few times where you can do it together."

**yes, we take turns. but depends if something is going on OR one of us is sick or not feeling well. there are times that one of us would do it more than one night in a row. same goes for giving baths - not sure how our daughter would handle both of us doing it....she gets pretty wound up and we have been setting the pattern of just one parent since she was a baby**


"Did you never clean before?"

** yes, but i not as much. I used to get upset because everything was cluttered and try to keep up but got tired of trying to do everything (work, remodeling, outside yard work, etc) and that is one thing that set off some of our problems - not realizing how much my wife actually contributed and feeling she should have been doing more - we got into some fights about that - neither of us appreciated what the other was actually doing**


"This is a good one."

**i'm not really a pet person, my wife LOVES animals. in the past, i would be taking care of them but get mad because I would think "why am i taking care of the pets, she is the one that wants them.....if she don't want to take care of them, she should get rid of them" again, these were THOUGHTS, i never said it but i'm sure she could tell that I didn't like doing it. I've finally realized that I need to support HER needs as well and her love for animals as they are like her "children" if you will**


"What were some of the "stupid" things you would buy?"

all kinds of things - always buying accessories for vehicles, electronics. i continuously would wheel and deal and make money, but rather than using all of the extra money, i would just buy more stuff. I did buy new furniture with some of the extra money, but was always looking for things to buy and re-sell. eventually started not reselling things and make excuses to keep it. I had a jeep and harley that were paid off and I traded them for a truck and corvette - that was after we bought the bigger house because we wanted to try for more kids. The corvette was sold and money was used to pay off bills - the wife admitted that was a big issue for her even though we talked about it prior to me buying and she didn't say no....**



"Don't ask."

** assumed as much - I'm assuming that means don't try to hold her hand, kiss or hug her either? let her initiate?? i'm not looking for sex (even though I miss that as well), just miss her so badly. **

I want to still be the loving husband that I should be, but it seems hard to do without appearing to try to do "too much".

just a quick note about me coming home early to help with my daughter......when I told my wife that my bos said it wasn't going to be indefinite, and asked what would work best for her if I had to negotiate, she acted disappointed and said that if I am only doing it 2-3 days a week it isn't much help .

I really don't get it when she makes comments like that. her job is technically PART TIME and she can adjust her hours accordingly if she needs to start later....at least that is what she told me originally when she started. as much as I want to help, I cannot jeopardize my job either or we will REALLY be screwed.