Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Infidelity/Extramarital Affairs/Jealousy Marching forward with deal breakers in hand

Link to old thread:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2449504#Post2449504

So H and I are supposed to speak again about the R sometime tomorrow or this weekend. I will wait for him to initiate. Recently we spoke again about working on reconciling but did not come up with a real solid plan and commitment to that plan. I am planning to put my 'deal breakers' on the table and am mulling over my list. Here is it currently:

• Even while living separately, we agree to be faithful to each other.
• Absolutely no contact with the other woman. If there is any contact you agree to let me know immediately.
• Begin marriage counseling or marriage coaching and make plans to go to Retrouvaille.
• Full transparency: together we review your phone and computer and all communication applications on them as soon as possible. You provide me with passwords to any/all communication applications (email, txt apps, snapchat, anything else you may have). I have freedom to randomly check anything and/or ask questions (for reassurance) at any time without push back.


Additionally, folks have asked what I plan to do to help the M. Here is what I will commit to work on:
*Anger management - commit to taking a class
*Making him a priority, communication/talking more to improve emotional intamacy.

I must say, I have a pit in my stomach. I have a gut feel that he will balk at the transparency plan which obviously will be VERY telling. I know I need to hold strong. I speak with a DBing coach tomorrow and will get her feedback as well. I know I can't tolerate this ambiguous state much longer..and can't really tolerate the OW still being a factor (assuming she is, he insists she is not and I have no evidence but I think if it's really true he needs to willingly agree to the transparency I am requiring).

Agree -- if he balks at transparency, that will tell you all you need to know. You should then say to them "Then I can only assume you are in still in contact with her, or want to be able to. That doesn't work for me. Sounds like we both have some big decisions to make."

And end the convo.

The recidivism rate of infidelity even WITH good MCing, no-contact and transparency is fairly high. (25-50?) Without it? I'd put it more like 90%. Statistics aside, if this is something YOU need for your own anxiety and peace of mind, I wouldn't recommend you back off on it.


Starsky

Yup, it's coming down to my own anxiety and peace of mind for sure. I'm realizing I just can't be one of those people who hangs around waiting/hoping that somehow I can lure him back with her still on the scene. Probably mainly because I know I have NO chance. He had significant issues with me, there will be no way I can "win" as long as she is buzzing around in his head. Even withouth her in the picture it's going to be tough but at least there would be *some* chance..

Journaling...

Been reading a lot of prior posts and trying to find success stories. Interesting to see the various paths to success folks take. Some being hard nosed and others taking a much softer, patient approach. As I mentioned in my post above, I don't think that I am the type who can realistically go with a softer approach, I am just not patient and realistically, given our situation, I doubt I would 'win' in the end. Having said that, I do fear that I will live with regret and wonder if I had just been more patient things would have come around (because H started to believe some of my changes and/or things with the OW truly ended of their own accord).

I think there are a lot of factors to consider in any given situation. For instance, H tends to procrastinate in making big decisions. I've always been more of the driver/decision pusher in our R. I'm thinking this means that I probably should force his hand otherwise he will leave us in limbo indefinitely. Having said that, H does NOT respond well to threats/ultimatums or really confrontation in general (I mean who does?). So somehow I have to make sure I put things on the table in a 'this is what I need to move forward' way as opposed to 'do these things or else'. It's a fine line that he is VERY sensitve to.

Ugh, meanwhile, I'm assuming that he really will reach out to talk about R again as he said he wanted to. But maybe he won't and then I'll need to figure an alternate strategy. Probably go dark..

More journaling...

Just reflecting more on DBing and the finer points...particularly that I think I need to be careful to not assume one size fits all and to make sure I do what works in my particular sitch.

One interesting thing I have noted is often it is advised to stay UNemotional in all exchanges/discussions. I believe it's because it can really put pressure on the wayward spouse (but maybe there are other reasons?). In my H's case, I have found when I am emotional he is more inclinded to turn toward me and open up. Although when I say emotional I do have be careful WHAT I am being emotional about. For instance, if I get emotional about the kids he seems to move toward me, is very comforting and gets emotional too. Generally, although not always, similar if I get emotional about not wanting to divorce or wanting to try to save the M. But if I am desperate emotional like "please don't do this" or "how could you do this?" that's obviously bad. I suspect there's some nuiance here that I may not quite be getting. Thinking it all through..

I don't think there's anything wrong with occasionally showing one's emotions to a wayward spouse. I think the danger comes when either:

a) the betrayed spouse then makes major DECISIONS based on their emotions; or

b) the betrayed spouse looks to their betrayer -- the wayward spouse -- to SOOTHE them.


Starsky

^ This is where you work from. Whilst he is thinking about OW, yes, you have no chance. You'll see throughout the threads how OW is like a drug to his addiction, which is love and attention, something he wasn't getting from you and so sought from OW. Until he's over his withdrawals from that addiction, you sit tight. Once the addiction no longer controls him, you have a fighting chance. In the meantime, you're working on yourself and the "significant issues" he has with you.

You say you're not a patient person. Sounds like a good 180 to me.

I hope you took this on board too...

"I am just not patient and realistically, given our situation, I doubt I would 'win' in the end. Having said that, I do fear that I will live with regret and wonder if I had just been more patient things would have come around (because H started to believe some of my changes and/or things with the OW truly ended of their own accord). "

That does seem to be a big issue with you. If you KNOW that you don't have patience, then get some. You've seen what happens when you aren't patient. You go off.

"I think there are a lot of factors to consider in any given situation. For instance, H tends to procrastinate in making big decisions. I've always been more of the driver/decision pusher in our R."

You mean controller. Let it go. You can't keep trying to control him and your situation. He has to WANT to do things proactively rather than because you expect him to do it. Get rid of expectations of him. After all, you wouldn't want him to have expectations of how you should live your life right?

"I'm thinking this means that I probably should force his hand otherwise he will leave us in limbo indefinitely. Having said that, H does NOT respond well to threats/ultimatums or really confrontation in general (I mean who does?)."

But so far that's how you've been treating him.

"So somehow I have to make sure I put things on the table in a 'this is what I need to move forward' way as opposed to 'do these things or else'. It's a fine line that he is VERY sensitve to."

Let go of the control. Just talk about the things that impact YOU and don't base things off of his actions.