Ok thanks. I do IC and am revisiting all my books.
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
I think I forgot to mention what my H said the other day when we got in an argument when his ow was mentioned. This makes sense to me now when Job said the excited and thrill is gone now that ow soon to be ex knows and the rest of our friend. He say he doesn't care what anyone thinks about him. I know that's wrong. Anyway, he said I dont talk to OW as much, used to talk text about 5x a day. He also said you don't know how long it will last or start going out with someone else. I'm not sure that the for my benefit or it is getting strenuous or boring being a long distance relationship? Time will tell. He too, like most MLC thinks the whole world will be Rosie once we are divorced. Haha I swear this guy wrote or reads a MLC manual.
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
My H thinks o don't want to be with him anymore. I no longer tell him I want to work it out. Not sure if this is a good thing but it has been how I have felt for a while now. I don't know why, but yesterday I woke up and wanted to revisit this site and plan??? Nothing between us sparked this except I have been having dreams about him.
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
That seems normal to me. That you would revisit and have dreams. Dreams seem to be unresolved issues that are getting your attention. Coming back here is one way to start to deal with it.
They do leave like their a** is on fire and their head is catching! Seems to them that its life or death. In some ways, it is for them to make drastic changes to try and address whatever they are wrestling with. I know mine did (it's not just men). Left everything and remarried a few months after the divorce was final.
Do they regret it? Who knows? I do know that when acting like you describe you can't stop it, change it, or fix it.
It's not about you. His actions are not about you.
In short, you aren't perfect, but you don't need to put up with that behavior. Job gives good advice how to handle it.
Just understand he has to work through it on his own. His feelings are his, and there's no telling what they will be from moment to moment.
Keep a healthy distance
AJ
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK Put the glass down... "Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
IoWas wondering if someone could give me advise on co-parenting? this is a little tricky for me because I tend to be motherly to my H. I want to know about keeping him in the loop of kids activities. This week was the first time I gave him an agenda because lots going on. I didn't give times just days. I guess what I wanna know is should I now update him on time or let him figure it out for himself. Or He ca call me and ask if you want? I just want to know how much I should be updating him on the kids. Or maybe not at all? I want stop doing things, suggesting, and or reminding him thing. This is very hard for me and I get angry with myself when I do it because I want desperately to stop. You need to know do it for himself and take the responsible for himself. I just feel like doing it a lot because of the kids. I guess I need to just let him figure the kids at himself? And not make it my problem? Am I wrong?
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
IoWas wondering if someone could give me advise on co-parenting? this is a little tricky for me because I tend to be motherly to my H. Is that how HE would say it? You are older than he is, so is it possible he no longer wants a "mother"? And or, does he see it as "controlling"? And in a way, isn't it? I want to know about keeping him in the loop of kids activities. This week was the first time I gave him an agenda because lots going on. I didn't give times just days. Okay first of all, though I don't know why you only gave him days and not times, it's not vital that you do this.
He's a grown up man. He is the father of these kids. You gave him the reminders and days. If he wants more info, HE can and HE SHOULD get it. Yes he may miss a few events at the start, & he may take it out on you, but that's the price of HIM LEARNING to do this himself. It will eventually lead you to having fewer worries too.
It's also a way he can begin to see all of what you do...do not enable him so much to rely on YOU for HIS duties, which include showing up for your kids...(and his).
I went back and read your old thread and this one as well. Yikes... Okay one thing up front, STOP challenging his choices. The more you do that, the more you force him to defend those choices. If he feels he has a "mission" elsewhere, you may have to release him to his task and let him discover that the grass is greener, where it gets the most water...
You are both repeating patterns. You sep before, but seem to have implemented no changes. You still lack conflict resolution skills.
I think, but I'm not positive, that you both have huge chips on your shoulders and react defensively to many of the comments the other makes. For sure your fights are not improving. The divorce word is tossed out too often and it always wounds. Do either of you apologize? What does the other person do or say when they hear the apology? And may I ask, how was forgiveness modeled in your childhood? And in his? I happen to believe it is a learned skill...
Too bad your earlier separations did not result in much personal growth on either end, or the gaining of New TOOLS for conflict resolution and basic communication. You are still doing a whole lotta the same...again. Make this count. it's a painful ordeal but there CAN be an upside...if you do the work. Regardless of whether he does his, YOU do yours, and you improve as a woman, and that's a big deal. That personal growth, the becoming our best selves, is the one guaranteed "payoff" of this whole DB experience...and it's a worthy goal.
I know that sounds harsh but it's really just direct, b/c i think b/c you are not used to someone speaking clearly to you about you or your m.
Even the way you write here, your statements are often phrased as questions...so are they statements or questions? Do you understand what I'm asking? I think it's revealing. DIG DEEP. Notice your "speech" pattern here. Lots of self doubt and repetitive questions that you have gotten answers to, before. Plus you say you read the DB book "five times"...but you have to implement the tools to have it work.
I guess what I wanna know is should I now update him on time or let him figure it out for himself. Let him man up and be a father. Don't do his job for him. Let him step up to the plate and let him feel good about that. IF you do it all for him, he never gets to earn the right to feel pride in himself as a father.
He may miss a few at the start and then, eventually, he'll learn to rely on himself and the kids will see him more. Then they'll know he's there b/c he wants to be...b/c he got himself there. You need to back WAY off....and work on yourself.
Make sense?
Or He ca call me and ask if you want? I just want to know how much I should be updating him on the kids. Or maybe not at all? Provide a calendar for him and leave it at that, OR refer him to the school's website and any other available sites with information about their schedule.
Stop providing it to him or it'll reek of you either 1) nagging him
AND OR
2) using the piece meal or insufficient information, as a way to force him to be in contact with you, so it's really a form of pursuit. You must stop that.
Instead, you can provide him a sheet with the relevant contact info and then, drop it. Besides, the kids can tell him when some important event in their life is taking place. It's not your job to father your children. It's exclusively, his.
I want stop doing things, suggesting, and or reminding him thing. This is very hard for me and I get angry with myself when I do it because I want desperately to stop. So.... STOP it. Seriously...what's the problem? You want to stop doing something you know does you no good, and actually harms the relationship. So stop it. This is not complicated. I won't claim it's easy, b/c evidently it is hard for you. But it's not complex.
You need some IC so you can gain tools for self control. I sense that you lack that, which is why you lose your temper and repeat behaviors you know are NOT healthy. That's not an insult b/c I had an IC and I saw a shrink and got some help b/c I needed it, my marriage and family needed me to get help, with some new tools. No shame in that. Far worse to keep repeating the same mistakes over and over....You have children...and you are modeling conflict resolution and communication and marriage and values and self respect for your kids.... or are you?
You need to know do it for himself and take the responsible for himself. I just feel like doing it a lot because of the kids. I guess I need to just let him figure the kids at himself? And not make it my problem? Am I wrong?
How could it be your problem? Worst case scenario is he misses a few events until he learns to assume responsibility for it OR ASKS YOU to remind him.
Do not accept any anger from him, if he does miss something, b/c he's an adult and they are his children.
He will learn b/c I assume he's educable. (Plus they can contact him if they worry he needs reminding. And with his hours, that's not impossible. So let them if they want..still it's not your job). I have a feeling that he does not "appreciate" your reminders or your mothering, or at least he won't unless/until he realizes that he needs it. He can't realize that when it's done for him constantly.
So Back way off. Use DB techniques. Why can't you implement the books techniques? If you need IC to do so, find one who is "solution based" (and to me, that means short term goals of change in your behavior, not years of staring at the past or childhood issues. They are worth study but for now the M is in crisis and you need to do what helps the m, period). What are your GAL activities? (Impossible to detach, without GAL so I hammer it, for a reason). I would like to hear a lot more about your GAL, and your 180s...
what are the things he complained of, which you want to work on? How is that work going?
Here are the "Newbie Rules" that sandi assembled, based on MWD's work.
Read these and please, implement them.
Reading great advice does you no good if you refuse to use it.
I highlighted the most important ones for me, and laminated a copy after I reduced it. That way I could carry a copy in my pocket, for daily (well, hourly on some days!) reminders, to learn new behaviors, and for calming down.
I also prayed a lot. I turned my marriage and my anger, over to God. I literally said it out loud dozens of times in the shower (so the kids didn't think I was nuts).
Thinking the words, "God, I turn my pain/anger/marriage over to You",
saying those words, and hearing myself say them, helped it all sink in.
And that really did alleviate a lot of my anxiety, which helped reduce tension and stress so when h called, I was calmer. Eventually I stopped being as angry at him, at least in front of him. He needed to feel more relaxed around me, which only happens when he's not getting his head bitten off by me whenever he talks or shows up.
Here are those rules, which are really guidelines, b/c not all the rules will apply. (Bear that in mind). RULES: 1.Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore! This turns the spouse completely off!
2. No frequent phone calls to spouse.......let him/her be the one to call you. Then don't try to hang on to your spouse through conversation.....instead, you say good-bye first.
3. Do not point out good points in marriage or try to get him/her to read marriage books, look at your M pictures, etc. Especially, do not get him/her to read the DB/DR book. That is for you only!
4. Do not follow your spouse around the house like a puppy dog trying to get his/her time and attention.
5. Do not encourage talk about the future. They don't want to think about a future with you at the moment, so stay clear of that subject. 6. Do not ask for help from family members or friends. Don't discuss private matters with them that would upset your spouse.
7. Do not ask for reassurances (That is showing neediness and being clingy.) Show self-respect and self confidence.
8. Do not buy gifts to make "brownie points". (Can't buy his/her love and affection.)
9. Do not schedule dates together at this point. (That is pursuing.) Save for later when the R is much better.
10. Do not spy on spouse by checking emails, phone bills, etc. (Not good for you and will make matters worse.)
11. Do not say "I Love You" (It is being "pushy" and trying to make your spouse say it back to you......he/she will despise you for it.) 12. Act "as if" you are moving on with your life with or without them and that you are going to be okay. Keep a good attitude. 13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive at all times! In other words, be the best you can be and look the best you can look at all times. Even when wearing jeans and T-shirt, wear good cologne/perfume, b/c it does cause the spouse to take notice.
14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse to see what kind of mood he/she is in or what he/she is going to do or say – get busy, think of things to do. Go to church, go out with friends, etc. in order to get a life for yourself without waiting on your wife/husband.....but it is okay to invite them, just don't act as if it will change your plans if they do or don't go.
15. When at home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation---then don't, wait for him/her) then, be rather scarce or with your words, but don't sound rude or too short like you are mad. If your spouse asks what's wrong....just say "nothing" and have a pleasant expression on your face. Keep it short and simple. Don't get into an argument! Stay polite and don’ t act like you are pouting. Use poise and class. This does not mean to act like you aren’t speaking, but don’t be overly talkative.
16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK THEM NOTHING!! No matter what time he/she comes home! You are giving them space and asking no questions! You enjoy your time with your kids, friends, etc. Remember, you are getting a life, also. *****17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to move on with your life, with or without your spouse.**** IN YOUR CASE THIS IS ESPECIALLY CRUCIAL B/C YOU HAVE SEPARATED BEFORE. YOU MUST SHOW HIM THAT THIS TIME, YOU ARE DIFFERENT....and thus, the marriage can be different/better than before. Show him your changes. Not with words, but actions that are different. Including Reactions...
18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he/she will be missing. (But never ask him/her if he/she has noticed any changes!!) This is important! If you do, then you have blown it.
19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. This can confuse some of them b/c it is not what they expected. Show your spouse someone he/she would want to be around all the time, somebody that can be attractive and fun to be with. That somebody is you! Don't overkill in your attempts to outshine another person your spouse may be having an A with (if there is OP in the picture) to the point of looking like your attempts are "fake" b/c your spouse will see through all of that. 20. All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while) so this takes patience on your behalf.
21. Never lose your cool! Don't let your spouse trap you into a fight. Don't take her/his bait.....leave the room or the house for a while, if you have to, in order to avoid a fight.
22. Don't be overly enthusiastic, don't over-kill; in anything you do b/c it will come across as fake.
23. Do not argue about how your spouse feels about something (it only makes his/her feelings more negative.) Only they know how they feel!
24. Be patient......very, very patient. Give your spouse space and time. When you pull back, it will draw them towards you. It feels opposite of what you want to do, but it works!
25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you. Look them in the eyes when they talk to you. Do not interrupt them when they are speaking and stop what you may be working on to look at them when they talk. This shows them that you really care about what they are saying. 26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to speak out (or scream and yell). Sometimes the right thing to say is nothing.
27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil). This is for your health's sake.
28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly. Read self help books, inspirational books or listen to tapes. They are for you only.
29. Know that if you can do 180's, your smallest CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write.
30. Do not be openly show that you are "desperate" or "needy" even when you are hurting more than ever and truly feel desperate and needy. This is a large turn-off for your spouse.
31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse, instead, focus on them.
32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because he/she is hurting and scared.
33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.
34. Do not ask your spouse if he/she has noticed your changes. Those changes are for you and for the rest of your life...with or without your spouse. If it is just to get your spouse back...they won't last and the same problems will return.
35. Do not send several TM's or emails throughout the day unless absolutely necessary.
36. It is best to stay away from the bar scenes where other problems easily arise.
37. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes. 38. Know that in time, you really will be happy again, regardless of your spouse’s choices. Know this, believe it, and let it show.
39. Do not believe that showing your spouse your pain and misery proves your love for them. It just makes it harder to be around you.
40. Don’t worry about how the past is viewed. What matters is this day and “from this day forward.” Learn to let go of the past and what you cannot control. It’s a lot to let go of, but it is SO freeing.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Thank you so much!!! You are so spot on me! I have recently been to IC for w months. Seems a serious waste of time. I got way mord from you thank her. As far as why I didn't give a H times. I wasn't sure thing yet. He works sporadic days and I wanted to let him know what was going on we have county fair and 8th grade promotion. I wanted to make sure that he didn't schedule work on those days. I will no longer keep him up on their schedule. It will be up to him. As far as the mothering comment, I said that. That is just something I have thought out since reading. Thinking maybe he thought that I was mothering or controlling him? thank you again and I will be reading supposed to several times. And yes I am NOT good at implementing the tools. You were so spot on with so much of what you said and I appreciate everything word.
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
GAL I'vebeen spending a lot more time with friends. The kids and I have been doing activities together. Working part-time. Going to IC. I need to work a lot more on 180's!! the main reason I came back here to get A kick in the ass. For last month kind of just been floundering I appreciate ALL the input.
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
H said to me the other day. Forget about me, move on and leave me alone. That has been going around in my head since. I will from now on. I just have a hard time letting him fall on his face. I've spent 20 years constantly reminding him of things because he always forgets!! I pledge today to be a new day and quit!! This is like my alcohol addiction like his? the only real thing that I got out of my IC was I'm a expert on H..I need and I'll find something new to become an expert on.
M15 T19 D13 S13 BD Affair 9/13 S 11/13 D started 6/14.. dropped court date 10/14 H attorney can't get it together. Still with long distance ow. Still hates me.
