Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers Saving my family - Part 12

Great post Eric ^^^^

Scorp - Again, your last post is full of justifications for why you are doing what you are doing. In addition, you completely contradict yourself in all your posts. In one breath you say that your W is keeping the kids from you and in the next you say that you see them all the time and that jumping to 50/50 is no big deal. Just reading along, I have no idea what the real story is.

You have a TON of people giving you advice and you have not once even considered what we are telling you. You just automatically respond and tell us why we are all wrong.

Absolutely. There are many here who have basically shared time and their feedback is great.

When I say 50/50, it's not that I am opposed to 60/40 or something slightly less than 50/50. Working up to 50/50 gradually would be ok as well if it made sense for the kids. I don't see that in my case it would make sense but I would be open to discussing it with my W if she was willing to consider something other than what she's been saying up to now.

Am I missing something? I am thinking of my kids first and trying not to worry too much about my W's reaction. If I thought my kids would not do well with them moving to a 50/50 arrangement right away I would not be doing this. The big reason I did not just drive my kids home and keep them there was I didn't want to put them through changing schools yet again as well as everything else that would involve. I'm trying to make the transition to shared time as easy as it can be for them. It will be a bit of an adjustment, way less of an adjustment than what they were put through back in October, to say the least.

I still have not heard back from my W. If she was interested in openly talking about the situation with me I would think I would hear from her soon. My kids are expecting me to be with them from Friday afternoon (I am helping out in D6's class for the afternoon) to Monday evening when I take my D's to gymnastics class. My oldest D has been asking when I would be moving to their area or when she could come home to stay for months now. I've told her all along that I will be coming soon so she has been expecting this for some time. My W has been very well aware of my intentions as well so this really shouldn't be a surprise at all. I've told her I am moving, told her about my job situation, living arrangements etc.

What really is of issue here is 3 days. My kids would already be with me for almost all of Monday anyway. My W works from 7:30am to 5:30pm each of those days so she barely sees the kids. She does not work on Friday which is the day our kids would come back to her. My kids would then be with their Mom for the next 7 days when I would pick them up for the weekend as usual except in the new arrangement it would be for 3 more days.

Scorp - We understand that you think that it is in the best interest of your kids to have 50/50 custody. Lets not debate that any further.

Let looks at this practically. After months of doing nothing, you have now been demanding 50/50 custody. Your W is ignoring you. You just sent another email to your W telling her that you are taking the kids for a week. Based upon your comments that you were worried about her response, the likely response is going to be no.

So you can continue to try and talk to her and hope that her position on custody changes. But I think that you would be better off just banging your head against the wall.

Or, you can approach this in a different manner. Add a day at a time. You may not have seven days in a row, but maybe you get four instead of three. Still more than you have now.

Scorp


That is great. Only issue I see….is much like everyone that is posting here…the therapist only sees YOUR side of the story. Has the therapist spoken to the kids? Your W?


I actually think you have covered all of this in your post. You seem to think that YOUR sitch is SOOOOO different that everyone else. It’s really not.


OWN your choices – stop defending them. Your W ran the show because YOU allowed it and you did so for a very long time. Now you want changes and you want them now.


YOU sat on the options for a while. Now that more time has past you cannot expect to use the same approach. One question….

Ever wonder why your L suggest NOT to file the temporary orders? I wonder if it is because she knows it is an uphill battle.


Base on your signature…they are 6,4 and 2 years old. Do you really expect them to understand what is going on? Do you expect them to understand the logistics of 50/50?



Because according to YOUR post…..


This ^^^^ was not happening. So as 3BZ asked..which is it?

I stand by what I posted earlier…..

Ok, first off, I'm saying my opinion. Everyone has theirs, I'm saying mine. If I'm acting and don't think I'm justified with what I'm doing then there really would be a problem. Am I wrong? I very well could be, it's happened before. That's why I'm here to try to learn from those that have been through their own situations. If I come across as defensive it's not my intention, I'm just giving reasons for my actions. If my approach is a bad one then I will consider all of your advice and change things up.

3BM, my wife has kept my kids from me, or if you like, I allowed her to keep them from me by not taking further action. She has also eased up on that some and the kids have been with me more over the past few months. Saying I have not considered the advice here doesn't seem to go along with several posters telling me I haven't done enough, not stood up for myself etc. Now that I am taking actions I'm not doing it correctly. The advice I think I've been given, unless I took it the wrong way, was to take action for what I think is best for my kids and stop worrying about how my W may respond. I've done that I think, maybe I didn't do it as well as I could have.

Eric, your input is great, I appreciate all the time you've taken responding to my posts. One of your posts from my last thread jumped out at me:

"When you stop being afraid of your W, the answers will come clearer to you. You are still paralyzed by fear and guilt in my opinion.

Do I tell her?

What is she gonna say or do?

What if she says no?

What if...what if..what if....

First, stop thinking and trying to coparent with her! I know it sounds harsh. Here is the thing...are you co parenting or are you just doing what SHE wants. A difference buddy. A big difference.

Co parenting takes TWO people. Yes, there are two people involved but who is the one that keeps making all of the changes? Hmmm....

To answer your question more directly....

I would email her and let her know....

"I will pick up the kids on X date. I will drop them off to you on X date and time."

The big one is the last line on the message to send to my W about my kids. Simple, to the point. No anger, no emotion, no bullying, just facts. The last example message you gave was good too. Somewhat different than the previous example. I think both are good and I went more along the lines of your first example.

You also had another good point. Are my W and I co parenting or was I just doing what my W wanted. I think I was just going along with my W in most cases. I would tell her my objections, I didn't act on them. Although, I'd say filing for D was a pretty big action. Anyway, I'm not trying to be a bully and I'm not angry. Hurt and frustrated for sure, you bet, no anger. I still love my W, I don't think she's doing what she's doing to intentionally hurt me, she's doing pretty much what I've started to do now. Has she come across as a bully and a dictator in her actions at times? Yeah, I think so. Am I now doing that? I think it could come across that way to her which stinks.

Again, you hit the nail on the head and it's the advice I'd been given by many on here for a long time. I was doing a lot of talking to my wife (technically emailing), I wasn't taking action. I am taking action now, doing it in a way that doesn't put my W's possible reaction ahead of what I feel needs to be done. The problem I see might be the same that you all are seeing too. Now that my W and I are BOTH taking action and NOT AGREEING we are setting up a war. Not what I want at all and not in the best interests of the kids.

Am I willing to talk to her and come to a compromise? Absolutely. Will she be willing to do that? Who knows. I'm working on the "have no expectations" idea so I took action without worrying to much about what my W's response may be.

I could send her another message telling her that if she has any questions or concerns that I'd like to hear from her. My message did could come across to her that I'm not willing to talk or discuss anything. I would hope she would simply just respond soon and let me know her concerns. If she does, perhaps that is where we could look to doing a gradual transition to more time with me.

Scorp - I am honestly not trying to argue that you are wrong or right, because this is not about who is right/wrong. I think that this situation is so difficult and it is hard to find a good path for everyone involved. I am just recommending that you try to find a compromise in between you doing absolutely nothing and demanding immediate 50/50 custody. I honestly believe that there is an in-between, for right now, that may be good for everyone involved.



I guess that this is where my advice is coming from right here ^^^. You admit here that your W has eased up and your kids have been with you more often over the past few months. That is GOOD. Keep up this trend, keeping increasing time. You have asked what is the best way to go about getting your kids more often and not having your W say no and withhold your kids. And I really believe that it is worth a shot to try this if your W says no to the seven days. Really, the only other option is to go to court and fight over it.

Great advice by 3boyz and Eric up there.

Scorp. I want you to know I understand the feeling when some on the board tell you to do something, and then you feel like you did that, and then you get 2x4d. And then when you try to explain they tell you you're being defensive and should see a shrink about that. (Oops, am I venting about my own issues? LOL.) It's not that fun. I do want you to realize that you have a lot of really wise people here commenting on your thread, which means there are a lot of people who are rooting for your kids and your family.

Here is what I see. You seem to be kind of like my H. He has two modes: doormat and [censored]. There is no in between. But, in between is exactly where you need to be. No, you don't let her call all the shots. But you don't just start demanding and bullying either. What you need to be is assertive. I thought that Eric's email above was terrific. Stop waiting for your W to respond to the email you sent this morning. If I had received that email, I would be on the horn with my L immediately and it certainly wouldn't get me in the mood to negotiate or compromise.

You could send another email to her and tell her you just reread what you sent, and realized it sounded a bit more aggressive than what you intended. You can apologize for that (and even explain that this is extremely hard on you, but that you are trying to keep your emotions out of it as that is best for the kids), and then maybe say some of the things Eric mentioned above. In a nice, cooperative, but firm manner.

Also, quit it with the "she works and only sees them for two hours each night" thing. So what? Lots of people work and only see their kids in the evenings. That doesn't mean that they don't deserve time with their kids, or that their kids don't deserve that time with them. I believe you said yourself that your Dad would be around to help you during the time the kids are with you - so it sounds to me like you are both busy people.

I know that frequent transitions are not necessarily good for kids, but let me tell you of my experience with my own kids. For the first 5 months of our S, my H had the kids overnight two nights a week. But he trained tae kwon do with us twice a week. My kids really were fine with that. Then my H quit TKD. Shortly after, we went to a new schedule where he has them MORE overnights, and guess what? They miss him terribly. To them, it was more the frequency of seeing Dad than the length of seeing Dad that matters. Going 5 days in a row with no Dad is torture for my little S8. Point being, (a) 7 days is probably too much esp. given the ages of your kids, and (b) the two hours they spend with your W on the days she works probably means a great deal more to them than you think.

P.S. PLEASE Stop yammering about all the LOADS of research about 50/50. First off, I could find just as much research that says the opposite. But more importantly, the people who wrote those articles do not know YOUR kids or YOUR situation. You are WAY too stuck on this 50/50 thing. You don't need to have them 50/50 to be a great Dad. Focus on being a great Dad, and giving the kids what they need, and being involved in their lives. The numbers don't matter. Your kids are not going to calculate a percentage to see who has how much time, they are going to remember whether you were there for them, if they can count on you, and if you modeled how to be a loving, happy, self confident person. Maybe it will work out to 50/50, and that would be great. Or maybe it will work out another way that will be even better. Be open to whatever you and your W can come up with to make sure that the kids are secure and happy.

Don't message your wife right now Scorp. Leave the ball in her court. When she responds, and she will, listen and validate. I understand why you've done what you've done. Others here did tell you to stand up for yourself and even told you to act without regard to your wife. I agree with Eric that you come off as a bully so you need to find that happy medium.

I also very strongly support the ladies who have commented on your thread. I understand that you are thinking about your kids and that is admirable. You need to put yourself in your kids shoes though. They may say they love you, they may say they miss you and they do. How do you think they will feel after 5-6 days without Mum when they haven't spent that long without her in nearly eight months? Forget about what roles your wife/MIL/FIL have in your kids lives and understand that it's her presence that comforts them.

Work towards 50/50. Don't just come in with all guns blazing saying "right lady, this is how it's going to be". There will be times that you need to say that. If she shoots down 50/50 ever, then yes, "this is how it's going to be (eventually)". If she shoots down 50/50 now, your response is "how can we get there?"

How do you think they will feel after 5-6 days without Mum when they haven't spent that long without her in nearly eight months?

My kids have been with me several times for a week or more over the past few months and they did very well. They did miss their Mom for sure. I told my W she could call anytime while they are with me but she has hardly called them the last while which is strange.

I'm considering sending her a message just asking if she's ok with the last message and also acknowledging that it may have been a bit harsh. I'd like to hear her thoughts and concerns so we can discuss them and come to an agreement together.