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Yes, they used to work together. We both knew him and his wife and had them over to our house at least once, maybe more than that, I don't recall as it's been years ago. He went through a divorce and she was there to support him, going over to spend time with him and such. She invited him to our house for Thanksgiving and Christmas so he wouldn't be alone. Then when this started with us he was "there for her". Early on when I was doing all the other wrong stuff I also snooped and found some flirty messages between them, her talking about what she wanted to wear to bed and such. And she wasn't describing the ancient, ratty knee-length t-shirt she always wore in OUR bed, LOL! He didn't respond in kind, so I don't know if it stayed an EA or if it ever moved to a PA, and I quit snooping after reading DR.

She never, ever tells me when he's around, but the kids do. He's gone with W and the kids to look for a puppy, go horse-back riding, play minature golf, etc. etc. He's ever-present. We still talk now and then. As an example, he and W took the kids somewhere and W had to go elsewhere afterwards, so he was going to drive them back to my house. I offered to meet them somewhere so he wouldn't have to drive all the way back, so we met at a restaurant and had pizza. I paid. I harbor no ill will towards him, he is not the reason our M fell apart. That's why I rarely mention him, he's not the problem. He's a really nice guy, my attitude is if my kids are going to be around an OM I'd rather it be him than someone else.

I harbor no ill will towards him, he is not the reason our M fell apart. That's why I rarely mention him, he's not the problem. He's a really nice guy, my attitude is if my kids are going to be around an OM I'd rather it be him than someone else.


That's a great attitude! Good for you.

Yes I do and both her response and yours is absolute script, straight from the book.
Again she is in crisis and this comment is proving that you have no clue about it.
If you are moving on then file for divorce and be legally done before you start dating.
What you are doing is no different than what she has done.
Two wrongs dont make a right.

Although Cadet is very straightforward ;), he has a couple of good points. The expectation that your wife, even if she wants to try again, or changes her mind, has come along with you for the ride, is there.

So now, I think, the decision rests with you. Do you file and begin dating again or do you wait? Since my H is dating (ahem) and has GF, I have been vacillating between dating (H wants me to) and not, until my feelings are clearer than this.

I do, however, have a timeline, that I will re examine once it becomes due. Whether to move on completely, or continue the mindset I have now. It is not a bad place I am now, but it does put me in limbo as far as Rs go, not my own personal growth, but growth with a potential partner.

I guess the short version is everyone has a timeline. Once you say, I have done the best to my ability and I am done here, so be it. Personally, I think, your DBing has been awesome. I tell you though, you haven't resolved this fully yet, but again, you decide where to go from here.

Yes AS, I have read DR. And DB. And SSM as well as many other books.

I first read DB in 1998 and reconciled my M. I then read DB again in 2007, then DR and the others. I noticed differences and I have reread each book many times since then as one can always use a refresher in the lessons that are there. I have also reread my own threads to remember where and who I was and how far I have come and I reread others that I find helpful information in as well.

I have also read your threads and all of your posts to others, as I find it difficult to post to people without seeing their patterns, ideas, and experiences.

I don't simply SAY that I have read everything, I actually do it, so that if I choose to say something to someone, I know what I am talking about and know that it is fitting to where they are in their situation.

I also find it help me to understand why their S is acting and reacting in ways that they are.

I will tell you, and you can argue, or you can stop posting for a while because you will disagree with me, or you can tell me to stop posting to you (because that is your pattern), I understand where your W is coming from and as a woman, I can clearly see why she feels that way.

You can talk the talk and quote the book very well. However you definately don't walk the walk of a man who wants to reconcile his marriage.

You are seeking external validation from other women. Instead of being able to validate and like yourself.

You spout ideas that sound like you have read statistical information, however, if one actually researches the statistics, your generalizations are wrong in most instances.

You are completly ignoring the idea of "believe none of what they say and only half of what they do" and you take your W's words at face value if they fit in with an outcome that you really seem to want.

She is confused. She is scared. She is afraid of your reaction to things.

So instead of being compassionate and understanding, you tell her you are going to date.

Funny how you complain that she didn't validate and compliment you and build up YOUR self esteem and show you love, but WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR HER?

Oh wait, you stood for a few months. Then you went looking for companionship elsewhere. And you are ready to do it again already (even though you are COMMITTED to working on the M). I'm sure to her that appears as contradictory as it does to me and I highly doubt it makes her feel special or loved or cherished.

Have you bothered to learn what a woman wants and needs in a relationship from a man?

Have you bothered to try to become someone who your W won't have to walk on eggshells around and showed that to her consistantly over a long period of time?

Have you learned to like what you see when you look in the mirror, because you like that person, NOT because someone else likes that person?

I see someone who has a long way to go.

Good luck AS.

You are going to need it.

A few questions Another....

1) What is standing to you?
2) How does it look...what were you expectiong to achieve?
3) Why are you standing?
4) What are you goals for the R and how were you planning to achieve them?
5) What are you looking for from your W and when are you looking for it? Yeah..yeah..I get you want to see "progress", well what does progress look like to YOU - not what the DB books says..nope..what and how does it look to YOU?
6) Someone that I have a ton of respect for once said to me and I paraphrase here..."chit or get off the pot" - "pick a path and walk it". In short, I was on the fence of "standing" - I too was dating. Bottom line, I came to realize that for ME...for what I wanted...no..for who I wanted to be, I needed to stand a bit longer. So my question is....do you really want to stand. Seriously, no bullchit, do you really want to get back with your W? Cause if so, I'm not sure I agree with some of your actions. FTR, I am not suggesting you sit around and "take it"...sit around and watch the "affair like a dog with a tail between his legs" - nope. I am suggesting that you be honest with YOU and HER as to what you really want in your life.

7) what does LOVE mean to you? How do you give it? How do you like to recieve it? WHat about your W....are you giving her love the way SHE wants it (once again, I am not suggesting that you sit around, eat popcorn and pat her on the back for HER transgressions)...my question is a little more probing then that..What is it that SHE REALLY WANTS...and do YOU LOVE HER ENOUGH to RESPECT it?


Forms of cancer IMO.....

a. selfishness
b. lack of compassion and understanding
c. sense of superiority (i.e. being a subtle "I'm better than you cause I've done the "work" mentaility")
d. lack of passion
e. lack of respect


These are just a few of the forms of cancer IMO, that will reap havok on a relationship.

I'll close with another piece of advice that has bode well for me..and provided by the same person....

"Understand why you are doing what you are doing - make sure that is alings with who YOU want to BE and not based on "feelings" or what others want or think you should be".

So Another....I believe that if you really look inside you will get to the answer that you are really searching for. Question will be...do you like what you see and are you strong enough to face it and deal with it...for YOU and for HER.

God Bless
Eric

hi AS,

thank you for all your support of so many on these boards. you have been so giving of your time and encouragement.

i hope you don't mind, but i was wondering if there is some fear and hurt under your thoughts now about your sitch? i recognize that in myself which is why i ask... i tackled my sitch at first with my logic and rational brain bc it is where i am most comfortable. i looked at it as something to figure out as a way to try and avoid some of the pain. i think it was necessary as i don't think i could have faced it all at once.

just a thought. hope you are okay.

First off, there can't be OM involved with W if you want this to succeed. And she has to understand this.

Second, if you still had OW in the wings, then you weren't totally committed to R either.

The two of you have to get rid of distractions and focus on each other. And I'm not talking about a week or two. R only works when two people look around for help and the only person they see is each other.

Patel de papas

Place left over empanadas filling on baking dish. Make 2 servings of hungry jack mash potatoes. Spread over the meat filling. Preheat oven at 350 degrees and bake for 30 minutes. Serve hot with some greens.

Sorry it should read "pastel de papas". Little mistake on my behalf small error. Forgive me. Perdon. I'm human imperfect.