Our grand daughter was born. This did seem to draw us closer, but, I still had my guard up.
FF also told my W that he was trying to put things back together with his W, and part of their agreement was that my W had to agree to leave the business. Which after a very public outburst about taking her business away from her, my W decided it was time to leave, but, she would only do so with him agreeing to the verbal agreement about if one member of the business left, they took what they brought with them.
Shortly thereafter, our truck got repossessed. W was quite furious about this, but, I told her I expected it. After she calmed down I explained to her that her old restaurant was making money and she had an income that contributed to our bills – she did most of the bills during this time, but, seemed to have forgotten this. Further, I explained that since she started the new restaurant and had no income, our bills exceeded my income by about $1,000 per month! Something I tried to explain to her several times, but, she refused to listen. I was able to get our truck back by selling some accrued leave time back to my employer, but, I think she got the message about the income issues.
Also in August, I finally began receiving the settlement money from my 2009 auto collision. It felt good to pay off bills. Instead of being in the hole by $1,000 per month, we had about $875 for gas & groceries, plus we were able to bank some of my settlement. Then she spent $5,000 on our granddaughter…
Labor Day weekend, we moved all of her equipment out of the restaurant. The only verbal agreement FF lived up to during this entire endeavor –probably only because there were too many people who knew who the equipment really belonged to.
This month also marked a new era in our relationship status. W tried to dive back into our marriage like nothing had ever happened. I tried several times to talk to her about stuff, but, she denied there ever were issues, where just a few months ago there were too many to count.
I found this VERY puzzling as I didn’t think there was any way possible the 180’s I’d done could’ve worked that fast. I didn’t believe for a second that there was any way everything that made her unhappy could’ve been resolved that quickly.
Now, don’t get me wrong, certain aspects of this were a pleasant change from the last year, but, I thought it was WAY too soon to be acting like newlyweds. What had me worried was the fact that she couldn’t remember anything, she wasn’t sleeping, was having hot flashes, was depressed, etc… I thought she was in perimenopause or something. I was still very confused as to what was going on. She talked about needing to get a job, but, made no effort to do so.
So, in October, I planned a weekend for us to go ghost hunting at the haunted jail in St. Augustine (she likes that stuff) and a few of the tours. We had a blast.
Both of our birthdays are in the first week of November – and we both celebrated by getting sick... I tried to organize a little party including some of her friends, but, none could break away to come over for a few hours, so, I settled on getting her a few things for her birthday. She got me nothing – not even a card – for mine. That was additional fuel to my suspicions that something wasn’t quite right.
W basically moved out of the bedroom and started sleeping on the couch. She said she couldn’t sleep and didn’t want to watch TV in our room since it might wake me up. I never bought this excuse, but, I decided long ago to pick my battles; this one wasn’t worth it.
Things were quiet until I asked her a question on December 21st. We didn’t fight; I simply asked her what was going on. She responded by asking me if I knew why she wanted to get a job. I told her I suspected it was so she could get her own place, and she said yes.
During this conversation she told me this: I don’t know what’s wrong with me, I can’t think, can’t concentrate, and can’t sleep. She claims to have even asked one of her friends WTF was wrong with her since she has everything a woman could want – nice house, great kids, a husband who will do anything for her – yet can’t get happy; and she’s tired of acting happy when she’s not. I guess this is Bomb Drop #2…?
I told her that I never expected – or wanted – her to act happy; I wanted her to BE happy and if that took a separation or divorce, then so be it. I also told her that only she knows for sure how and what she feels, and I have to respect what she’s telling me even if I don’t fully understand or agree with it.
She looked very surprised by these comments. I simply told her that, after everything that’s happened over the last year, I’m at a place where I can move on if I have to or need to, and left the conversation at that.
This was in the evening after I had already ordered Divorce Busting, Divorce Remedy, How to Change Your Life…, and Relationship Rescue (by Dr. Phil) earlier in this same day. I had said ILY sparsely from mid-November, but, since this day I haven’t said it once – only later to find out that’s the right thing to do…
Some back story might be in order here: She had been ‘looking’ for a job since September, but, never really seriously looked for anything. She wouldn’t even update her resume, which left my confused and frustrated.
During the holidays, I read, read and read some more. And I learned a ton, some of what I learned reinforced suspicions I had developed, and some hit me like a ton of bricks. I also watched her actions even closer than before. At no time during this period did she make any effort to look for a job or work on her resume.
She would occasionally leave the house to go for a drive and would be gone for 2 – 3 hours at a time. I would send an occasional text to make sure she was alright, but, that was it; and I eventually stopped doing that. If I didn’t ask what she did or where she went, she would end up telling me. If I did ask, I usually got no response at all, so I stopped asking.
During the first week of January, I suggested that she go out and have some fun. In fact, I strongly encouraged her to schedule a ‘girls night’ so she could get out of the house, which she did. During her night out, I didn’t call or text her. The next morning I made it a point to NOT ask her anything about her night other than if she had a good time. After about 20 minutes of watching me go about my business, she started talking about the night out and pretty much told me everything that happened. In fact, that’s become a habit now, even with text message conversations she’s having with friends. If I don’t show an interest, she tells me everything that’s going on.
Also during the first week of January, she mentioned a couple times that we needed to look at her resume. Over the next few days, I mentioned it a few times, but, she never really seemed to want to break away from the TV or whatever she was doing, to do this. Try as I might, I couldn’t figure out how to meet her request without it seeming like I was pressuring her to do something. So, I decided I’d work on it myself – always remembering that SHE was the one who said she needed to find a job so she could get out on her own. Even though I do NOT want a S or a D, I’m helping her to potentially achieve that goal. Is doing this considered a 180? But the fact is, right now we could use the extra income.
On January 8th, I sat down and created a resume and cover letter for her. Also, I printed out some jobs for her to look into. W walked into the room and asked what I was doing, and I simply said ‘research.’ She said she needed to go to the store, and would be back in about 20 minutes. I asked her to pick up a Gainesville newspaper for me while she was out. When she got back, she asked me what I was doing and I told her that I had a rough draft of her resume and asked her to look it over. After a few corrections, she was happy with it.
Next, I pulled out the help wanted section and gave it to her, along with the print outs I made and suggested that she look at the jobs and see if any were of interest to her. She found a few and we submitted her resume and cover letter.
On January 13th, she committed us to a $5,000 event for our youngest daughter, based on a job she didn’t even have yet. I was dumbfounded once more, though I didn’t yell, scream, or throw a fit. This has had a MASSIVE impact on my income for the next few months as we were barely surviving. In fact, she hadn’t brought home ANY money since February 2012 (again, she never drew a single penny of income from her last restaurant).
During the rest of January, nothing much happened, except us being friendly toward each other. Occasionally while watching TV, she’ll look over at me to see my reaction to something before she reacts, which I do find puzzling.
Basically, though, I spent the month acting ‘As-If’ about the relationship and the house. Any improvement I’m considering, I get her opinion on; any issues with the cars, I discuss with her. Any issues with the kids still living at home, she’s included in it. She has moved into the spare bedroom, but, isn’t always there. There’s been no further discussion about ‘us’ and it’s been mostly happy and upbeat.
Many times during this month, I have elected to give her space in the evenings by leaving the living room and going back to my room to work on hobbies or watch something different on TV. Every time, within 15 minutes, she has come back to my room to see what I’m doing. When she does, I’ll usually go back out to the living room for a bit, but, not always.
There have been several issues come up about the former restaurant partnership, which she usually discusses with a friend or two (whom I know quite well). I did ask her why she doesn’t feel like she can discuss them with me. She told me that there are things that I do not know about, and that if I did know I’d probably end up in jail. I just responded with ‘fair enough’ and didn’t discuss it further. This really caught her off guard, since before my 180’s I would have pursued this MUCH harder.
Oh, and before closing this month out, she DID get a few interviews out of the resume and cover letter!!!
D#1 and granddaughter came up for a two week visit. D#1 was curious why W would leave occasionally. I asked her if she asked her mom, and she said no. I just told her that her mom is going thru something right now and needs some alone time. She didn’t seem to buy that reason, so, I found the 6 phases of an MLC here and emailed it to her, and asked two things:
1. Keep this a complete secret as I’m not 100% it applies to her mom 2. Read and compare to her mom over the recent history and see if it applies
I also told her she didn’t even have to reply to me, but, regardless of what your mom is going thru, she still your mom and you still need to be patient and respect her.
While D#1 was in town, we were all having a conversation in the living room about weird things we all did. W came up with one I hadn’t considered until that moment. She always had to have a copy of the car keys – sometimes both sets – when we’d go shopping. When she said that I flashed back to right after we found out she was pregnant with D#1. She was sitting on my lap by the campfire, started to cry a little and asked me if I was ever going to leave her like her father did. I was stunned, but, my answer then as it is now, was ‘no’ (as mentioned in my first post).
She got a job!! Which is a major plus. She seems to enjoy this job, and seems to enjoy not being completely responsible for everything involved in running the business.
Last week she got a call from the Florida Dept. of Revenue warning her that a tax warrant was going to be issued on her. She thought we made a mistake on our filing when we closed her restaurant in February of 2012. I went to the Tax Collector’s office to find out, since I was listed on that business as well. Turns out it wasn’t that one, but, her partnership with FF – he hadn’t paid one of the necessary taxes since June of 2012. This set her off like a stick of dynamite.
She was able to get it straightened out since he and the payroll processing company were the responsible parties, but, she sure was mad. In fact, she took a three hour trip to Walmart that night to buy new pants for her job.
I left her alone – no text messages or phone calls – but she sent me several text messages and called several times to let me know what she was doing.
Last night (2/13/13) she made a goofy comment that made no sense. Once she realized it, she said ‘don’t judge me’ and laughed. I told her not to worry, that I don’t judge. She looked at me and said ‘yes you do, you judged the hell out of me when all of those rumors were going around.’ I told her there was some truth in that, and that she did quite a bit of her own judging during that time as well. I also told her I’m not going to start the blame game, that we both made mistakes during this time. I looked her in the eyes and told her that, for my part in all of it, I was very sorry it all happened; this wasn’t the first time I’ve apologized for this. I also told her that I’m not the same person I was then and I wasn’t going to apologize about it forever as it isn't fair to hold it over my head.
She replied back by saying she knows there were other circumstances (I was still a basket case of withdrawal from the meds I had been on) and that I have changed, and that it’s no big deal.
One area where I KNOW she’s picked up on the 180 is the fact that in the past, I would never have let it drop there. I would've asked that if it wasn't a big deal, then why bring it up? Which, that act alone, would've started a fight since one of my chief complaints was always that she'd bring stuff up from the past that pissed her off, but, wouldn't deal with it then. She would keep things bottled up until something small made her blow up like Krakatoa and throw up a bunch of stuff from the past that I didn't even remember.
The only reason I even acknowledged the statement and apologized for it this time was because the only times we discussed it was during heated arguments, where the apology might have been lost or even taken as a token and not like I meant it. This was nothing of the sort; it was more of a joke that elicited a conversation about the past.
She then complained about her feet hurting from the shoes she had to wear at work all day, so I gave her a foot rub. Then she asked me to rub her calves, so I did. This actually put her to sleep. Once she was asleep, I went back to my room.
Now, I know that during an MLC, you’re supposed to not buy gifts, say ILY, etc… However, it being Valentine’s Day, it seemed wrong to not buy the woman I’ve been with for 25 years SOMETHING. So, I got her a card with a penguin on the front, offering a ‘Valentine’s Day Hug’, a small stuffed bear, some Ghirardelli Chocolate and Ferrero Rocher Chocolate. Nothing declaring how much I love her or anything like that was on any of these items. I placed all of these items on the dashboard of her car this morning.
I am happy to say that they were well received – yet I have NO expectation of anything. In text messages, she did thank me and said I wasn’t supposed to do anything since we are short on money. I told her I know, that she was welcome, and that it didn’t seem right to do nothing at all. She told me I sucked, with a winky smiley face.
Again, I have no expectations. I have days when it’s easy to detach and others when I just want to grab her and kiss her like we used to. It’s like walking a tightrope. Going back and reading the stages of MLC, if that’s is really what this is, I can’t really pinpoint what stage she’s in right now, but, I’m making very conscious efforts to not do anything to prolong it. I know there’s nothing I can do to help her out of it…
My W is a beautiful person - mind, body and spirit. I love her just as much now as the day we met. Where I fell down at was in knowing how to show it, communicate it and live it. There's no doubt that many of her complaints were legit, it would be disingenuous to try and minimize that.
If that wasn't enough, right after the car wreck (4 years ago this month), I was a mess. Back and neck injuries. Traumatic brain injury. I hurt all over, couldn't remember anything. Couldn't stand bright flashing lights or loud noises. Impulsive at everything. I have no doubt that made living with me even more difficult that already must have been, especially considering the normal communications barriers men and women already seem to have.
Yes, I have alluded to my feeling that she's in a MLC. I could very well be what drove her there. Yes, I have mentioned a few areas where I felt she made mistakes as well, and maybe I shouldn't have since I'm trying to forgive these issues and have no control over them. I know neither of us are perfect.
The last 14 months (really 4 years) have been pretty brutal. I've made a ton of mistakes - and since those are the only ones I had any control over, those are the only ones relevant to where I am today.
The big question is where am I today, and what am I ready to accept?
During the months from May 2012 thru August 2012, I did make many strides in becoming a better man. Do I still have flaws? Absolutely. Am I continuing to work on them? Absolutely. Will I ever be the perfect man? Not bloody well likely...
What it really boils down to is this: regardless of the changes I've made, I have to be willing to accept it may be too late. I will not stop DBing and improving the areas where I fell down.
Basically, I am at a point where I can look in the mirror and say I'm doing all I can and am willing to accept whatever is thrown at me. It's not easy, but, nothing worth having ever is.
Please understand that all this DETAILED rehashing is just that, a rehashing. It usually results not in progress but in getting upset again OR in telling needless detail to us.
Truly, the level of detail provided Is simply NOT needed.
What I want to know is whether the affair is physical, and IF so, whether that is an absolute definite deal breaker for you,
and what SHE SAID your flaws are, which ones you agree with and want to work on
what SHE IS NOW SAYING she wants, and what YOUR 180s are.
That's it, and that's plenty for you to work on now.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
The only reason for the detail was it was already created in my personal journal. Maybe it's not a healthy thing to have?
I'll try not to go overboard with my responses...
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
What I want to know is whether the affair is physical, and IF so, whether that is an absolute definite deal breaker for you,
Short answer - To be completely honest - I do not know if it was a PA. As for a PA being a deal breaker? No, it's not.
Longer answer:
She claims pretty adamantly that it was not a PA, so I have to take it on her word it was not. Dealing with the aftermath of the personal and business issues regarding her former partner, she says there's things that I don't know and that if I did it would cause more trouble than he's worth. That's really the only thing I have trouble dealing with right now - basically, it seems like she's hiding something.
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
and what SHE SAID your flaws are, which ones you agree with and want to work on
Not helping around the house
She did mention once that she felt she had no privacy from me at all since I knew her email and Facebook passwords (not entirely true).
That when she's venting, that's all she wants is someone to listen. (I didn't understand this at first, but, after reading it's clear that I'm a 'fixer' who wants to solve everyone's problems)
She has mentioned to other people (I've heard it from them, but, never her) that I was not the same person I was before the car accident.
Claimed I was too lenient on D#2. (Some truth in this, especially since her own car accidents.)
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
what SHE IS NOW SAYING she wants,
The last time we discussed our M was right before Christmas when she said she wanted a S. She recently went back to work. When we talk about house repairs/updates I'm planning, she always talks like she's going to be here. However, she's not actually recanted on the S request.
And as I said in one of the long posts above, she also told me on this same day that she has everything a woman can want, but, still can find happiness and is constantly confused and just wants to be able to clear her head and focus.
Originally Posted By: 25yreasmlc
and what YOUR 180s are.
I've been committed to exercising and getting into shape since the summer of 2011. I've lost almost 80lbs since then. Though I'm far from a physical specimen, I'm more confidant than I have been in a long time, easier to get along with, do not react negatively to bad news and am more optimistic about the future.
I've taken over a lot of the household responsibilities so she has less to do when she's home and less to worry about at the end of her workday.
I listen more than I talk. I've learned to ask questions rather than give commentary on other peoples problems, unless they explicitly ask for my input. Also not getting involved in our D's squabbles (I identified this one myself) and letting them solve their own problems.
I've stopped asking her about who she's texting or talking to or what she's talking about. Giving her the privacy she asked for.
Holding D#2 more accountable.
Giving her space - and a lot of it. I don't hover over her or follow her everywhere. If she says she going somewhere, I don't question it or ask if I can go. If we're having a conversation, I'll sit with her while we're talking, but, when it's finished I'll excuse myself and go do other things, unless she asks me to stay and watch TV or whatever.
Was kind of a weird weekend. I had four days off, so, I did get to spend some ME time.
Friday I finished building a computer for a single mother my parents know (3 kids) who really needed one. W worked all day.
Spent some time helping my parents around their place on Saturday. Why I consider that ME time is I was hanging a gate - I enjoy doing things like that. W worked all day - crashed less than an hour after getting home.
Sunday I took the computer over to parent's friends house - was gone for maybe an hour. When I got home, W was not there. Asked D if she said anything before she left and D said no. I called W to see if she was upset about anything; she said no, and that she would be home shortly (she had to go somewhere there was cell signal to check her email). I told her no hurry, that D said she left without saying anything. Told her to enjoy some non-work time away from home. She was home less than 15 minutes later.
Monday W spent most of the day either sleeping or watching the 'Castle' marathon on TNT. We did some paperwork for our taxes this year, which look to be... interesting.
She seems to like her new job - which is good. She does talk quite a bit about it, and her co-workers.
It is weird, though, living in the same house, but, separate rooms. Nothing more has been said about the S since December 21st, but, I think the sleeping arrangements speak for the situation. Yet, she still tells people (guys who hit on her) that she is married and her husband wouldn't approve (at least that's the story she tells, me)...
I rarely comment on any of this stuff; I just listen and smile. I have noticed, though, she seems to get rather perturbed when people comment to her about the business she was involved with and her partner. That has happened recently since several former employees have contacted her regarding tax info, even though she left in September.
When this happens she usually gets in a really bad mood. I'll usually tell her if she wants to talk, she can find me (where ever I'm going to be) and I'll listen. Sometimes it's hard to just listen, but, I've gotten pretty good at it...
