I just read your whole thread and wanted you to know. The advice given to you is good advice for me to take as well!
I know how tough things are! I think you do great job at being honest and able to describe your sitch, painful as it is.
How did the meeting with your W go last night?
Me54/H47 '08 H is "done" March '12 H moved out Brink of D, December '12 2014 totally reconciled! ...... "I firmly believe in the...absolute possibility of marriage renewal." Jim Conway
Our meeting was uneventful (note to self, listen to snodderly!). I don't know what gave me that feeling of foreboding but she actually suggested that we go out to dinner since I hadn't made anything and she was hungry. Sometimes, the more normal the meeting, the stranger it seems. We had zero R talk and instead just chatted and ate. It is almost like getting into a time machine and going back to before all of this happened, only to have that shattered when she gets in her car and drives away (often with the dog as well).
We had couples therapy last night and both agreed that it wasn't particularly productive (felt like we got sidetracked) but I'm trying to trust the therapist and hope that she knows something I don't. In general, I'm trying to be more open and trusting that god won't give me more than I can handle and that I'll be okay regardless of whats happening right now. We are paying by the month (out of network = out of pocket = expensive!) and W paid her half for this month without even flinching, which is a pretty big change from when she said she wasn't sure she wanted to continue with therapy a month ago.
In some ways, it has felt like being on a rollercoaster with a drivers wheel. You can turn the wheel but in the end it doesn't change what the rollercoaster is doing. I think I was really worried about turning the drivers wheel up until a week or two ago. Every time, trying to find some correlation between turning the wheel and what the rollercoaster does. But now I've really let go of that drivers wheel. There is NOTHING I can do that will change her. I have to just let go and focus on me.
She wants to have dinner out again tonight to give me back the dog. I've been seriously getting a life - going to holiday parties, etc. I'm finding that it is incredibly helpful to have a platonic friend who knows what you are going through, especially in social situations. It feels good to get out but there is still that painful moment whenever I get the "where is _____?" question. I actually got fed up and answered "I have no idea" to someone last night and couldn't believe it came out of my mouth.
Things feel like they are calming down but I worry that she is trying to move our relationship into "friend mode". I just don't think I have the emotional fortitude to stay friends with her and watch her engage in other relationships. I guess right now the goal is to keep one of her feet in the door so that the marriage at least has a remote chance of surviving. ____________________________ Me:39 WAW:38, M:9 T:19, No Kids EA:9/24, S:9/24 EA on hold?, MC 9/30-now
In some ways, it has felt like being on a rollercoaster with a drivers wheel. You can turn the wheel but in the end it doesn't change what the rollercoaster is doing. I think I was really worried about turning the drivers wheel up until a week or two ago. Every time, trying to find some correlation between turning the wheel and what the rollercoaster does. But now I've really let go of that drivers wheel. There is NOTHING I can do that will change her. I have to just let go and focus on me.
Love this!!
Sounds like you are doing alright Greymeadow - good for you!
Me 46 H 56 M 22 yrs S22, D20, Twin Ss18
You teach people how to treat you by what you allow. What you stop. And what you reinforce. ~~~~~~~ A lack of boundaries invites a lack of respect.
Things feel like they are calming down but I worry that she is trying to move our relationship into "friend mode". I just don't think I have the emotional fortitude to stay friends with her and watch her engage in other relationships. I guess right now the goal is to keep one of her feet in the door so that the marriage at least has a remote chance of surviving.
I get what you're saying, but can I say I disagree with your action plan?
Sounds to me like she is trying to get to know you in a non-threatening way.
My advice? Take it at face value, and take it as it comes. Don't read ahead. It's not predictable and it's not worth it.
Your feelings are understandably raw right now. You won't be able to accurately predict anything about her for a long while. If for no other reason, she won't be predictable. Take that off your shoulders. It's not within your grasp and it's not reasonable to take that responsibility. Really.
Enjoy the time together. Everything else can go to the wayside and there will be time to deal with it later.
No matter what happens, don't have regrets about your choices. And know that you only control your choices.
Peace, AJ
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK Put the glass down... "Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
W continues to mystify. Ended up meeting her out for dinner and kept the conversation light until we stumbled upon her relationship with her parents who are emotionally distant and haven't been a support for her in all of this mess (they are on another planet and always have been). The day she walked out of our house I was shut off from her family - but she's really impacted by the fact that they don't reach out to her and are basically ignoring her emotional anguish, whereas my mother has been a rock for me during this. W talked about feeling isolated, not having friends to talk to, etc. (I didn't say this, but I was thinking - duh, I'm your best friend and you walked out of our life!)
The next day, after I offered via email to be someone who could listen - just an ear on the other end of the phone (she hasn't talked to me on the phone for 10 weeks, we used to speak daily). She sent me back an email saying that knowing that I'm in emotional pain hurts her more than anything. Not easy for me to reconcile that sentiment with her actions. Unfortunately, I told her as much in an email - basically saying that I had a hard time believing that she cares about me at all given that she knew that cheating and leaving would be devastating for me. No reply for 24 hrs. And then an email that hardly acknowledged what I'd said and was more about her feeling isolated and that she thought it was "kind of me to offer to listen to her". Whatever.
In the end, I'm sure she can't reconcile her feelings right now either, because she is in MLC crazy land. The thing is - the more I detach, the less I seem to be able to choke back the inclination to say what I'm really feeling instead of acting "as if". I just don't know how people do this for an extended period of time.
Today is Emily Dickinson's birthday. I came across this which seemed fitting for this board:
To fight aloud is very brave, But gallanter, I know, Who charge within the bosom, The cavalry of woe. - Emily Dickinson ____________________________ Me:39 WAW:38, M:9 T:19, No Kids EA:9/24, S:9/24 EA on hold?, MC 9/30-now
Hi Greymeadow, Just keep on keeping on. I think you might like to see copies of the following letter’s I received from my then estranged wife (she left us 26th Jan 04) who was living with the OM when she wrote the following letters:
Fri 2nd April 04
Delboy, Thanks for the (audio) tapes, I shall enjoy listening to the Bradshaws (family comedy). The verse (called ‘Risk’) is very moving. I haven’t forgot that it is our 23rd wedding anniversary on Sunday. How could I. I am not going to say anything about the other things (this was to do with her abandonment of our kids). Hope that Dawn’s birthday went well, I’m sure it did. Regards Liz
Sat 10th April 04
Dear Delboy, I am writing this to say please don’t build your hopes up that I will be coming back, I want you to get on with your life, we have many memories and I will never forget. I will always be here if you need a friend. Regards Liz
This hopefully with give a little insight into the mind of a fully blown Mlcer’s. And to take their ideas of friendship like a pinch of salt!
I spent a long time looking for this. Then I decided to relax and lo and behold, it just came to my attention where it was to be found. Praise God.
The verse
‘Risk’
To laugh is to risk appearing the fool To weep is to risk appearing sentimental To reach out for another is to risk involvement To expose feelings is to risk exposing your true self To place your ideas, your dreams, before a crowd is to risk their loss To love is to risk not being loved in return To live is to risk dying To hope is to risk despair To try is to risk failure But risks must be taken, for the greater hazard is to risk nothing The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, and is nothing They made avoid suffering and sorrow But, they cannot learn, change, grow, love or live Chained by their attitude they are a slave, they have forfeited freedom Only a person who risks is free
So much of her recent communication seems to be her projecting onto me. It seems to correlate to when she can't clarify something. A few examples:
She said, "I feel like you have no friends." Meanwhile, I have a number of people I'm leaning on for support and she tells me the other night that she has nobody close to confide in and feels isolated.
She said, "you never go out for hikes." I responded that I'm certain I've done more hiking than she has since she left, and once again radio silence. I don't think its about me going for hikes, rather its about her comparing the reality of her life without me and her MLC fantasy life.
She has repeatedly said, "I've felt judged" in our relationship. When I asked for more clarity around that I got silence. Now I'm realizing that she probably feels judged because nobody is going to support the sort of decisions that she is making. Who would aside from the OM?
It seems like a lot of work for a LBS to pick apart what resonates as a true relationship flaw, what is MLC fantasy, what is projection, etc. This is particularly true when some of those things are hurtful and the initial reaction to them is knee jerk. Asking for "help understanding" what they are talking about seems to work well for both gaining a better understanding of where some of these things are coming from. ____________________________ Me:39 WAW:38, M:9 T:19, No Kids EA:9/24, S:9/24 EA on hold?, MC 9/30-now
MC last night was a disaster. She continues to rewrite history. Pretty soon she will have obliterated twenty great years of good memories.
What really stung was her saying that she hasn't felt we are "connected" even when we were doing things together that we both loved. I think this is code for her comparing our mature relationship with an affair, which is apples and oranges. In the end, it left me feeling pretty hurt - and I guess it made it obvious that this is still about her affair in her mind even though she isn't talking about that aspect with me. I recognize that it is really, fundamentally, about her and not the affair but it seems like she can't begin to address her own issues until the OM isn't in the picture.
She is apologetic for hurting me but those apologies are starting to ring really hollow. It is like someone beating you with a baseball bat and saying "sorry that this hurts you" after every blow. If you are sorry, then stop emotionally abusing me. I told her that I don't know how much more I can take.
I woke up in the middle of the night and sent her an email (never the best idea) and told her that I didn't know how we could move forward in our marriage until the OM was out of her life. I know ultimatums are supposed to be off the table but I am tired of being a punching bag. I guess its the old standing vs doormat question. It is honestly how I feel - if she is engaging in an affair with someone she works with 8 hours a day and sees me once a week in MC for an hour, then there really isn't enough communication to repair a relationship. It will always come back to an unfair comparison.
I definitely feel like I'm hitting an emotional wall. Maybe this is what it feels like to be done. ____________________________ Me:39 WAW:38, M:9 T:19, No Kids EA:9/24, S:9/24 EA on hold?, MC 9/30-now
