Last post here at this time, not sure if you will respond or if you will simply leave the board.
First, I did the math so, you were about 33 when your X2 came back into your life, give or take.
I get that suggesting you were MLC is harsh. So tell us. Do you really feel that you were not MLC? You mention that you had not been engaged with X1 by the end of the M1. That you'd buried yourself in work. That you didn't love X1 THAT way. That X2 just HAPPENED to come back into your life. That you realized the two of you were soul mates. That everything just seemed to be amazing for you for four years. That by the 5th year, you were getting "bogged down" again, stressed (depressed) and that you went onto meds (I'm guessing ADs). And that ultimately... you became like her X1, that you disengaged from her. Basically, for her, it was the same thing... all over again...
And... you mention that X2... "gave up on you"... by the end of M2. As though somehow, it was up to her to kick you in the butt. That she was the one that needed to enlighten you... that she... somehow is to blame for D2...
So I'm just putting that out there, as harsh as it might feel for you. And...
You now mention how you are so engaged in life again, now. That everything is wonderful and you're becoming this great guy now.
And you ask if I don't believe what you are saying?
It sounds like your personal betterment and new engagement in life...
Leave the board? Why in the heck would I do that? I came here for a reason. My intention is to stay here until this entire thing in worked out, either way. Then my intention is to stay here and see if I can help others....I am posting responses to your first two replies, then I will read your last.
Kaffe, first, THANK YOU for taking some of your energy and time and using it to help me. Second, yes, at times I can be very straight forward, perhaps blunt is another way to describe it. I will never be rude, or at least that will never be my intent. I am here for one reason – at least at this point – to analyze, with the help of you and others, what the h*ll happened, why it happened, and what options and potentials I may have moving forward.
Ok, here goes:
< you, my friend, had a MLC 6 years ago.> Perhaps, I have not seen it that way but I have not really analyzed it either.
< You still appear to feel entitled to answers and as though nothing else seems to matter to you, except for your own gratification.> Not sure how this was extrapolated from what I have put down thus far. Yes, I am here to share my story, get answers, and, if I can, help others. If coming here to get answers and being straight forward about it is me getting my own gratification, well, touche’.
< You left your first wife because you "did not love her [b]THAT[/i] way?!!" Are you kidding me? In what way DO you need to love someone to make a decision to marry them in the first place?> I can’t answer this question – I assume it is rhetorical, but even if not I am not sure what reply is warranted. I loved my first wife, I still love her. Are there different kinds of love? Are there different levels of love? Are there different stages of love? IS there such a thing as “loving” but not being “in love”? From my perspective, yes, a resounding yes, to all four questions. Now, if we are talking about the “right” thing to do, if we are talking about the “moral” thing to do, that’s a whole different ball game.
<reeks> definition: a strong or disagreeable fume or odor As I said, I am here for honest, straight forward feedback and help. What I am not here for is to be insulted or judged. Offering feedback, insight, opinions and experience can all be done without judgement.
< he wanted to relive their past> This is a possibility. But can people never go back and reincorporate past history into their current life without it being negative? I don’t think so.
< Or was your 2nd W already in the picture, before the first D's ink was dried.> My 2nd wife came into the picture before I was legally divorced. Where I was living there was a mandated 1 year waiting period. That said, we were living apart, did not have a life “together” any longer, and these decisions were made before my 2nd wife came into the picture.
I am not asking for permission from anyone to do anything. I am asking for guidance. I am asking for support. I am asking for feedback and objective reasoning because, frankly, the emotions I have are getting in the way of logic, and I know that, and I have no false assumptions that I can or should do this on my own.
What do I want from X2? What do I want from X2…..mmmm. I don’t know that I want anything from X2 – I do want something with X2 – or is that just splitting hairs? As I stated, I still love her, I am still in love with her. What do I want? I want to gain as much as I can from this experience. I want to continue on this roller coaster of life changes and realizations. I want to know if it is those who have gone through this feel I am, for lack of a better word, silly for wondering if at some point it is possible to reconcile with X2. And if it is possible, I want support from anyone I can get it from to determine the best life choices to make to at least make reconciliation a possibility.
<I get that suggesting you were MLC is harsh. So tell us. Do you really feel that you were not MLC?> Yes, it was a bit harsh, but I’m a big boy.
< That you realized the two of you were soul mates.> I didn’t “realize” that then. I had known that since I was a kid. I know there are many opinions on this matter but I do, I do believe in soul mates.
< that she... somehow is to blame for D2> Did I ever say this? I hope that I didn’t because I don’t for one moment believe it.
< That she was the one that needed to enlighten you> Did I say this? I don’t think so.
Yes, I was “awoken” if you will. But just because she chose to D does not mean that it was her job to awaken me, it’s just what happened to awake me. Many people never get awoken. And that’s because it is very hard to do thus it usually takes a huge life even to do it. A death in the family, a medical illness, a D…
Escaping…mmm…let me think about that one. Does everything in life really need to be a lie based on something else? Can I do nothing that changes my life without thinking that it is a lie? That I am running away from something? I hope not. Basically, to put it in a nutshell, I think my problem is that I tend to disengage. What I am doing now is trying to re-engage. I have epilepsy and have stayed on the same meds for 20 yrs. I have a weight problem (6 ft tall, 135lbs – I should be 145lb at least) that I have not tried to change in forever. I don’t have a lot of friends – again, the engaging thing. I have been disconnected from family members. I am now taking new, up to date meds that are helping me so much more. I have gained 14lbs in the last 4 months. I have made 3 new friends, one of them is like a brother to me. And I am much closer to my sister now, we talk about life stuff all the time. Is there something wrong with these changes? If am running away from something while making these changes – what am I running away from? Again, can nothing I do or change in my life for the “better” really be for the better? Does it all have to be a fake based on a lie?
BTW Kaffe, thanks for putting your energy into this. I can see by the questions you are asking that you are putting effort into it. Effort takes time, takes energy, and don't think I don't see it or appreciate it.
<That everything is wonderful and you're becoming this great guy now> I don't want to go back and re-read everything I've posted but did I really say this? I recall saying that the changes were great or that I loved them but everything is not wonderful - I just got D, how can it be wonderful? "Great guy" - I know I didn't say that. Please, this is hard as it is, and, to be honest, when I see things written like "I am a great guy and everything is wonderful" when I didn't write it my feelings get bruised a little. As I said, I am a big boy and can take it, but I only want to have to "take" stuff that is true. Thx
If I am judging, that's my issue. If you feel judged, that is your issue...
THAT... is splitting hairs...
Others may come along as Cadet and I have and support you along your journey. Eventually, you may also move to the newbies forum and start a thread there.
Your very first post here is almost the "perfect" post. It states all the "right" things. And that's great. You've been reading. You've been trying to figure things out. You are moving in the right direction based on that first post.
The devil... though... is in the details...
Do you know what SBT is? That is the process of DB. What ever the goal, SBT is a great tool.
Even while DB is a method of SBT, this board, and sometimes even the coaches, will do a little regression therapy, as context is very important.
Having said that, I really think that there is a very close correlation between your D1 and your D2.
As you indicate that you want to analyze (which you certainly are doing with your counsellor, I'm sure), then can you tell us what went wrong with your first M?
Why did you M her?
Why did you stop being engaged with X1?
How was the love for your X1 when you M her different than when the two of you D? Or was it?
Do you feel you emotionally mourned the loss of M1?
Why did I marry my first X. Because she was fun, because we had a lot in common, because before I loved her I really liked her. Because I connected with her. I can tell you exactly when it happened. We were all in college at the time and me and a couple of friends headed over to another college town basically to party. One of those friends was my X1's brother and we were crashing at here place (she went to the university in that town and invited us up). I really didn't know her at all, just met a couple times while hanging out with my friend (her brother). Anyway, that night she and her brother got into a fight, he was really harsh, she ended up crying and I was naturally drawn to consoling her. After that we were a item, had a long distance relationship until college was done and the rest is history.
<How was the love for your X1 when you M her different than when the two of you D? Or was it?> Well, I think it was different in all the normal ways. We had been together like a decade so in the beginning it had all the new love feelings etc. After 10yrs, graduating, making careers, buying a house, etc, it was like many marriages - I guess the spark was gone, I wasn't engaged, etc.
<Do you feel you emotionally mourned the loss of M1?> No, I don't think so.
I don't think me being engaged had anything to do with X1 or X2. That is my issue and I want to own it. Also, I didn't stop being engaged with X1 (or X2 for that matter), I stopped being engaged in life.
I'm interested to get your comments on my responses to your questions. Especially the Escaping vs. Engaging thing...can I or can I not engage in things that I have wanted to for a long time without it being an escape?
