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Hi RegretfulLA,
Ouch! OM??? I had tried to put that away but it is plausible and probably likely. What would she be testing me on? It seems pretty clear it is beyond test with the legal, custody and financial battles she has waged. Not sure if one pleasantry is warming up. If there is an OM in the wings, why would she come back sooner than I think?
If your husband stepped up to the plate, why did you stray again though? This kinda justifies his anxiety and mine, or anyone else’s that has had this happen. You need to tell him you love him if you really do.
I would love nothing more than my W to rejoin our bed. It has been 7 months in separate bedrooms. The kids tell me they are unhappy about that and also unhappy about our separate Christmas plans. They tell me but afraid to tell their mother.

Anyone else have a thought on our sitch too? Think an OM at play?

Sorry FM. I am just coming from my own experience. Based on what you described of her behavior, she was all lovey-dovey with you and then flipped. That sounds like she really, underneath it all, might still love you. When you DB you become much more attractive. If you were to "become the better option" maybe OM or potential OM wouldn't look so good. Just a hunch. Does that make sense?

My H did step up to the plate initially but a few years later he got very mean and angry. Threatened to D me about once a month. One time got so insulted when I asked him for help that he packed a bag, walked out of the house and texted a "massage therapist" for an 11 pm appt. Told me routinely how broken and screwed up I was. Etc. This was all against the backdrop of a horrible work situation so I felt like I had no comfort zone. I wasn't remotely interested in OM2, honestly I just needed the validation. Not a pretty story.

My H does not want to hear that I love him. What my H wants to hear is that I'm so horribly sorry. My H would like to see a real sacrifice to "prove" my love, but he doesn't want to take any responsibility for what's happened. It's tiresome and honestly I'm becoming less and less motivated to try. I guess this is all par for the DB course.

It does make sense and I am a competitive person, but some things are or shouldn’t be competed for. If OM is better option than her family and kids and I together, then it must be worth it to her. If she were always looking for better options, then I would always be looking over my shoulder, or hers. That is not healthy.
She did flip for sure. Funny thing is, in early April we were driving after a therapy session and she was bringing up plans for later in the year and she mentioned Christmas. I said “Do you think we will make it to Christmas? “(a dumb, needy thing to say, I know). She replied with an emphatic “I know we’ll be together at Christmas! We are going to be together at Christmas!”. It was so passionate and sure. 4 weeks later she gave up. We have separate Christmas plans with the kids now.
I think the weight of a couple times after the A I threatened the D too, and the last time I did was end of Feb. I was so confused and stressed over her behaviour, and I also laid guilt on her about the A in late April/early May. I was so frustrated with her not dealing with trust and being open.
I never did get that deep sincere apology, and true remorse. It would have meant a world of difference. I apologized so much for my parts I cried. She did think that was weak. I would be thrilled for her to say ‘I love you’ instead of ‘I hate you ‘or ‘I don’t care about you at all’.
She will be back tomorrow from business trip. Apparently last night and tonight she asked the kids on the phone if I was home. Where else would I be? I may GAL, but I look after my kids first and foremost. That is a good life to me. Too boring for her? Not enough mystery?
You need to tell your H how sorry you are, and be there for him. Yes, he has his BS but he is hurting. That is the anger. You are all hurting.

FM, I just started to read the Five Languages of Apology. I am hoping it will help me be able to apologize in the way he wants to hear it ("I'm sorry" doesn't work).

Funny that you tell that story about your W saying you'd be together at Xmas for sure and now you are not. My dad told H "We'll all be together at the holidays" over the summer and my H said no way. Well, we're doing Hanukkah on Saturday at my dad's.



All of this sounds familiar to me - my H playing your part and me playing your W's part. I was not fully on board with H after my first EA. I did feel he was freaking out a lot but I gave him reason not to trust - I invited OM1 to a party we had and H did not know who OM was at the time. (OM did not come btw). I've intellectualized all of it but I am having trouble empathizing at the level he wants me to.

My second A was "sexting." Completely naughty. It's funny though, I was listening to Dr Laura today and someone called her and said "My H is having phone sex." Dr. Laura said, "don't waste a good 30 year M on something silly. Have phone sex with him yourself." She said it all so casually. My H completely freaked out when he found out about what I was doing, so hearing Dr. L's point of view on this in contrast to my H made H seem a little wacko. I get that he's not happy but he's been punishing me for 6 months and he refuses to work with me to allow me to make restitution in the way he wants it made.

Anyway, not to hijack your thread with my stuff.

For me, I scored high on Make Restitution and Request Forgiveness(I just did the quiz now). Neither of which I really received from W. I have no idea what hers would be. I would love to also know her 5 Love languages. She read the book in January but she would not share with me her on-line results as I shared mine (Words and Touch). She just would say she was surprised at her results and did not want to share. She did like the book and referred it to some friends at the time and she did start to speak my languages. However, the anxiety of the A, her seemingly lack of remorse and seemingly lack of effort to build trust was too overwhelming. Just sweeping it away was not right. It’s like sweeping away 17 years of M and almost 20 years together. I think she thought I was punishing her and likely from her perception I was, but I did not look at that way. Our therapist #2 said we both feel insecure about the R and I think she was bang on. Neither of us wanted to come out on the short end of the stick. It looks like the kids and I are though in the end.
Sandi2, AnotherStander, Cadet….or anyone else too….any thoughts or advice on my sitch is hugely appreciated.

Right at this point in time, you believe you would love nothing more than for her to return to your bed. The problem I read from so many is that once she came back.....then you would start to do like Regretful's H. You feel so desperate right now b/c you are scared of losing her, but if she decided to stay.....you would feel safe.



And she was showing you your LL? Yet you felt like you did. It is those very things that eat away at the LBH.

I remember my H telling me that I had not even apologized for having the EA. I looked at him and all I saw was a self-righteous person looking down at me. I thought he should apologize to me for his part in the breakdown of the M. But instead, he told me he had done no wrong. It took a long time before I truly felt remorse.

So, if she can decide to end an A and stay in the M, be glad! It may take her time seeing that you can love her and not hold the OM/A over her head and punish her...before she can express remorse to your satisfaction.

I'm not saying she shouldn't apologize and show deep regret for what she's done.....I'm just saying that it may not happen like you want...or in the time you think it should be.

You have to find a way that you can move on and stop being like this, b/c she isn't going to work at doing her part if all she sees is a man like she's seeing now.

Thanks Sandi2,
You have good, direct points too. I know it all sounds defensive, but the building blocks were there, we were guided, doing well and came to a point when both therapists said it was time to deal with the A last Christmas and build trust. This was at the 5 month mark and we dealt with so many things to get to that point. I apologized and cried about things I had no idea they bothering her. I could not be any more sorry and I wept openly about that. But, when came time for things that bothered me in the dynamics of the M, it was way off base for her. The A aside, the negative dynamic was both ways 50/50 and I hurt too but took to other outlets to fill the void, not an A. I was open about everything. She feels the A was the only thing that was wrong she did. It is not about punishing, it is about the hurt and the breach of a trust that we both agreed was sacred. She hated her sister for 2 years because she did that to her husband. Now she did it. She feels like she is in a prison, but she has been free to go whenever she wants and does. Common etiquettes and courtesies should be on her for that. I have changed a million things; the anxiety was new once A opened up. Just seems like a double standard. But I guess I am in the position of trying to save it so I must leave no stone unturned. Eat more crow, feel guilty for her A. We went down that path last year. She never came to deal with it upon professional advice, not just my anxiety. She did start to show LL for a could months, but it was mixed with some shutdowns. Apologies can mean a lot and maybe then you’ll see the change on your H’s. It should world both ways. A little give and take but when one is stuck it is all give. That’s the program I guess. I think I can get to a point to not hold OM/A over her, I just want honesty, openness and truth. I don’t want her in a self-imagined prison. I want her happy, but yes, with some assurances to me. It is a big emotional investment.
She made a comment in March one night when she was crying, and said “I can never be the wife you want me to be”. I wish I absorbed that then. I was still confused to grasp.

I asked my 10 year old D what she wants for Christmas...she said " I want Christmas altogether as a family and you and mommy together." I just hugged her. Could not get words out. WE go for the tree on Sunday, first time ever without us together and we do it with my brotheer and his fammily. My wife started this tradition with them 19 years ago. She and my brothers wife were such close friends. They are not too happy with her over the custody battle. They know I have been a daddy that has been there above and beyond. Same with our friends. 14 year old wants the nonsense to end but she is quiet and says to me she is upset Christmas will be apart. Won't express to her mother.

This is EXACTLY what happened to me about 2 hours ago. And yes, I also feel like my H is punishing me.


This is also spot on as to how I feel. The punishing (whether intended or not) is enough to drive anyone away. She can't show you the remorse because she's not motivated because you're just driving her away. Or maybe she just doesn't know how to express it in a way that you can hear (as you said). Or both. See what I wrote to you yesterday, it echoes all this:



Hang in there. This is a rough road.