Well the irony is that it's usually when the LBS totally gives up on the R that the WAS finally decides to consider returning.
You make a good point. Although it might not bring them back it will force them to think over what they really want. I don't mean to wait indefinitely, but I do struggle with knowing if my wish to drop the rope is real. Always when I get to that state of mind something happens which throws me off balance again.
Today was one of those days actually, I will update my thread on it, you're welcome to stop by.
I guess I'm just afraid that if I drop the rope I will regret it.
I mean how do you really know when the time is right? M Maybe it never feels quite right and you just have to go for it at some point?
I believe the only time to drop the rope is when you truly are ready to give up and prepared to move on, because like you say, you may regret it.
If you're only doing it as a tactic to win her back, she'll likely see right through it. Especially if you "flipped the switch" from standing to dropping the rope. It could be seen as a tit for tat game, ("If you won't love me, I''ll show you!) I don't believe games and tactics are a good way to build a lasting relationship.
Deciding when to give up should be a gradual process, and in most cases your spouse should first start seeing signs that while you're waiting for them, you don't intend to wait forever.
Truly dropping the rope seems like a last ditch maneuverer to me, and one that you can't take back without losing credibility if it doesn't cause the walk away spouse to reconsider.
M: A really long time. Crisis: 5 years. She's still worth it.
Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
This week is W's week to have the kids. They come to my house after school and she is supposed to pick them up around 6. As the weeks and months since separation wear on, her pickups keep getting later and later. Like most everything else, she had an idealized vision of how this would work and it wasn't realistic. She often has to work late and frequently there's bad traffic and wrecks on her drive home. She just can't control the sitch like she thought she could.
Last night S9 had a scout meeting, so I got him ready for it so they could go straight there. It started at 6:30. That came and went with no W, but I didn't call because it's her issue to deal with! She finally showed up after 7:00 clearly stressed. She had her puppy in the car (in a cage), so I offered to watch her while they were at scouts and she gladly accepted. So they got to an hour-long meeting 45 minutes late. When they came back I asked if she was doing OK and she said she was stressed earlier but feeling better. I told her if it happens again that she should just call me and I can take him (this is one of my 180's, before BD I would always gripe about having to shuttle the kids at the last minute when W was supposed to, now I encourage W to take advantage of that).
Back to the first paragraph, basically on my weeks I have the kids all evening. On W's weeks, the kids come to my house, I get home around 4:45 and have them until around 7 (it's supposed to be 6, but W rarely makes it before 7). So then W picks them up, rushes them to her house, they eat and do homework and it's bed time. I asked D16 how much "quality time" she spends with W and she did say "none during the week" which is what I suspected.
Only reason I mention this is I've read a lot of stories here where WAS's actually think that after S they will magically be able to spend MORE time with their kids! I think my W thought that too, and clearly it's not working out for her.
Originally Posted By: theUF
You make a good point. Although it might not bring them back it will force them to think over what they really want.
Hopefully I was clear that I'm not condoning dropping the rope as a way of getting the WAS to return, I really think dropping the rope has to be done specifically because it's what the LBS wants. It can bring the WAS back, but that's not the reason to do it.
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I don't mean to wait indefinitely, but I do struggle with knowing if my wish to drop the rope is real. Always when I get to that state of mind something happens which throws me off balance again.
I know exactly what you mean. I really do feel like letting go, but I think it's mainly a self-defense mechanism. I think at some level I just want closure, and if W doesn't bring it then I feel like I need to.
The thing is, if I 100% knew that W would want to reconcile some day, I think I could stand indefinitely. But I'm 51 and frankly I just can't afford to wait for her for years if in the end it's not going to work out anyway.
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I guess I'm just afraid that if I drop the rope I will regret it.
I don't have any regrets in life, the things I did wrong taught me valuable lessons and made me into the person I am today more than the things I did right. Some of these decisions are extremely difficult, but once I make them I don't ever look back and I don't have regrets.
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I mean how do you really know when the time is right? Maybe it never feels quite right and you just have to go for it at some point?
I think that's it exactly. There will never come a time when it seems like the 100% correct thing to do. It's never going to feel totally "right".
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You seem like a well-balanced individual, and it's quite sobering reading your thread.
Thank you! I've always had a pretty solid keel in the water but this experience really threw me off course for quite a while! It's still a diversion, but I feel like I'm back on track regardless of how it plays out.
Originally Posted By: ForeverYoung
I believe the only time to drop the rope is when you truly are ready to give up and prepared to move on, because like you say, you may regret it.
I agree completely. It's not about getting the spouse back at that point, it's about doing what's right for you. I hope I didn't confuse anyone when I said it sometimes does bring the spouse back, it does, but that's not the reason to do it.
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If you're only doing it as a tactic to win her back, she'll likely see right through it. Especially if you "flipped the switch" from standing to dropping the rope.
Not sure if you're making a general comment or if that's addressed to me, but if it's to me then I assure you I am not talking about dropping the rope as any kind of trick or tactic. It is for me.
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Truly dropping the rope seems like a last ditch maneuverer to me, and one that you can't take back without losing credibility if it doesn't cause the walk away spouse to reconsider.
I don't see it as a maneuver at all, I see it as the LBS ending it. As Cadet says, it's not over until the LBS says it is. There may be S or even D, but as long as the LBS wants to hold onto hope then it's not over. But when the LBS drops the rope, then it is over as far as they're concerned. No more standing or waiting, it's over and the LBS is moving on with life w/o their spouse. Different people have different opinions on the definition of "dropping the rope", but that's what it is to me FWIW.
Hopefully I was clear that I'm not condoning dropping the rope as a way of getting the WAS to return, I really think dropping the rope has to be done specifically because it's what the LBS wants. It can bring the WAS back, but that's not the reason to do it.
Originally Posted By: ForeverYoung
I believe the only time to drop the rope is when you truly are ready to give up and prepared to move on, because like you say, you may regret it.
I agree completely. It's not about getting the spouse back at that point, it's about doing what's right for you. I hope I didn't confuse anyone when I said it sometimes does bring the spouse back, it does, but that's not the reason to do it.
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If you're only doing it as a tactic to win her back, she'll likely see right through it. Especially if you "flipped the switch" from standing to dropping the rope.
Not sure if you're making a general comment or if that's addressed to me, but if it's to me then I assure you I am not talking about dropping the rope as any kind of trick or tactic. It is for me.
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Truly dropping the rope seems like a last ditch maneuverer to me, and one that you can't take back without losing credibility if it doesn't cause the walk away spouse to reconsider.
I don't see it as a maneuver at all, I see it as the LBS ending it. As Cadet says, it's not over until the LBS says it is. There may be S or even D, but as long as the LBS wants to hold onto hope then it's not over. But when the LBS drops the rope, then it is over as far as they're concerned. No more standing or waiting, it's over and the LBS is moving on with life w/o their spouse. Different people have different opinions on the definition of "dropping the rope", but that's what it is to me FWIW.
My comments were in reply to UF and and the forum in general, not to you specically, AS.
I agree with your interpretation of DTR. While it may not be a maneuver to win back your spuse for you, many others here seem to think otherwise. I say this because I have seen it recommnended as a course of action to others many times, (not always with the DTR words) early on in a sitch, when the LBS clearly had no intention of giving up.
I don't recommend the LBS dropping the rope unless they clearly have given up on the M, because it very well may back fire on them, and there's no taking it back without losing credibility.
If you're not ready to throw in the towel, DTR is either a game playing tactic, or a uniformed mistake.
M: A really long time. Crisis: 5 years. She's still worth it.
Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
While it may not be a maneuver to win back your spuse for you, many others here seem to think otherwise. I say this because I have seen it recommnended as a course of action to others many times, (not always with the DTR words) early on in a sitch, when the LBS clearly had no intention of giving up.
I've noticed that as well, some seem to think it's another step in the process- if detaching alone doesn't work then go dim, if going dim doesn't work then go dark, if going dark doesn't work then drop the rope. I completely agree with you that it's not that at all. At least, not by my definition.
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I don't recommend the LBS dropping the rope unless they clearly have given up on the M, because it very well may back fire on them, and there's no taking it back without losing credibility.
Yes, everyone seems to have their own definition. For me, and I think it probably comes from AlAnon, it means simply not engaging in the tug-of-war. You aren't necessarily off the playing field, you're just not taking part in the conflict, engagement, interaction.
Completely detached.
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
After the Thanksgiving thing (where I told W I thought we shouldn't spend it together) and W's subsequent reveal that she's still confused and not sure what she wants, we agreed to do S9's birthday and Christmas together. She sent me an email earlier suggesting we all go to an ice sculpture exhibit on S9's bday. I told her it looked like a lot of fun and that it was a great idea (this is another 180 I've been doing since BD, I always found a reason to complain about her ideas before- too far away, too expensive, etc.) We're also working out the details on his party the following weekend which will be at my house. He wants it to be a Nerf gun party, so I'm going to go buy a bunch of Nerf guns. A house full of 9 and 10 year olds with Nerf guns, I'll be finding darts behind furniture and on top of stuff for weeks I'm sure
I also spoke with D16 and let her know that W was taking her comments seriously. D16 has been talking to W about the sitch and expressing her concerns. I wanted D16 to know that W isn't blowing her off, she is taking her comments to heart and thinking about them. I mentioned to D16 that W thinks S9 and D18 doesn't care about the sitch. I have tried to talk to D18 but she doesn't want to, but I knew she was taking it hard. D16 confirmed that she's taking it really hard, worse than D16 in fact. D18 is in finals week and then will be staying with me during Christmas break, I'm going to try and talk with her again. I know it's tough on her but I don't want her keeping all that bottled up inside.
Originally Posted By: labug
Yes, everyone seems to have their own definition. For me, and I think it probably comes from AlAnon, it means simply not engaging in the tug-of-war. You aren't necessarily off the playing field, you're just not taking part in the conflict, engagement, interaction.
Yeah, I've heard that version described around here as well. I'm sure if Michele knew we'd be using some of these terms so much she would have tried to define them a little more clearly, but I think the whole DB'ing thing has become much bigger than she ever expected
Yeah, I've heard that version described around here as well. I'm sure if Michele knew we'd be using some of these terms so much she would have tried to define them a little more clearly, but I think the whole DB'ing thing has become much bigger than she ever expected
I think she can handle it....
Dropping the rope has many interpretations...
The one that I have seen here the most, is when it is used as easily as it is said...
No more tug-of-war...
No more trying to pull, persuade, control, manipulate another person toward what the LBS wants. It's when it is more of a way of life, rather than a decision.
It is when the LBS recognizes that they can only control the person that they are, and not force their will on another Human.
It doesn't mean you give up the war....just the fight.
Couple questions for you ?
The above, where you are talking with your Daughters about their conversations with their Mother....
Why are you in the middle of that ?
Your role isn't to fix their relationship, your only role, is to not damage their relationship....
It's okay to talk with them, just be sure to only present things from your perspective. Cause I'm sure you don't fully comprehend your spouse's side of things.
There are two sides to every story. Yours and theirs, and usually, somewhere in the middle is where the real truth lies...
I am certain that your version of the truth is very different of what her version is....
And it doesn't make hers any more right than yours is to you...
It's okay to have different truths, the key is...how well does one validate the other person's truth ?
Just to be clear...
What were your wife's complaints about you ????
I dunno AS, maybe it is me.....
It seems as if you have planned this whole thing out on how it should work, and end.
I see a superiority in your words when you type about her, and how your choices are waaaaay better than hers.
And that she should be begging you, to come back.
I see a pattern of trying to fix HER problems, with YOUR solutions.
And that makes her opinions pretty small, if that is the case.
Am I wrong here ?
Where is the sympathy for what SHE might be going through ?
Where is the validation for her side of the truth ?
