If she is asking him to court her (not sure what the R was like, did MWest gave her much attention during the R?), then I would just court her. It's romantic and it is endearing. As a result, do not call her at the last minute for a quick coffee. That is just a slap in the face. Be a gentleman about it, and ask her at the beginning of the week so she has time to prepare, AND you will get more of a romantic build-up, and it is far more courteous. MUCH more pleasurable for a woman
If my H did that to me (call me if I wanted a quick coffee there and then and we were trying to get the R back on track), I'd turn him down immediately.
A WAW will use sex to see if she still has that connection to him or over him, but it's not b/c she desires him....she immediately looses interest and leaves him standing in the cold.
I have to say that is WAY harsh. At one point I was a WAW, and yet I definately still desired my H, so we had sex. He too was someone who needed to strengthen his boundaries, but I actually did find sex with him extremely enjoyable and hot. So, it ain't always the case as you say Stasky.
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Nothing new, really. For centuries, women have used sex as a control tool to get what they want from men. Unfortunately, this is just one example.
I'm shaking my head and rolling my eyes. Yes, some women do do that - and all power to them.
When the world stops putting out sex driven adverts to sell everything (just one example), maybe we can ALL start to see and experience equality in the roles.
I didn't want to get into this type of discussion, but really this thread is sounding a bit too lopsided and jaded.
And, let me finally say this - some of the best manipulators I've known have been men - they do it in different ways to women, but believe you me, they do it well too.
In other words, manipulation and control happens regardless of the gender. I think it would be good to bear that in mind.
It's not about power or manipulation, it's about respect. Midwest says his W always had little respect for him and was always in charge. On top of that she became a WAW and left.
Midwest in her eyes is not valueable. Now this is speaking from personal experience but in my case I was too clingy, and rarely took charge. She saw these as displays of low value.
While the notion of getting courted does indeed sound very nice and flattering, based on what Midwest has written its only going to make things worse.
There are multiple cases of guys who pick the super nice road when DBing they usually get dragged on into limbo as there W's won't leave, but refuse to return to something they don't value.
If he is there all the time, or continously courting her all he is displaying is that no matter what she does he will always be there. Yes that sounds romanticly nice, but in practice it's misery for the guy, and an attraction killer for the woman.
This may sound crazy but I believe that if a guy is there too much, he looks desperate, weak, and like he has no options. If he tries to hard it'll be pursuing and she'll lose interest.
"oh you can't come, no problem, I'll see you later I need my caffeine fix", or any other way you can show you will go without her.
I like this much better - it's not as desperate sounding to me. But drop the "oh you can't come, no problem" bit Say 'Sure, I'll see you later, I need my caffeine fix'.
It sounds like she is making sure you are still available - for her own ego. Maybe it's best to remain aloof to her as she is feeling you out a bit - expecting you to say 'Oh there is ALWAYS room for you'. Don't bite that worm!
Originally Posted By: greenblue90
This may sound crazy but I believe that if a guy is there too much, he looks desperate, weak, and like he has no options. If he tries to hard it'll be pursuing and she'll lose interest.
YES! Don't be there too much or asking her out for coffee! Make her do it! I know it's in your plans to get the marriage back on track, but SHE needs to be doing the pursuing at this point.
Me& h + S M: 13 t: 14
H moved 2/12. Own apt 05/12, EAs, PAs, gfriends, oh my! I'm done. 12/12
"I get knocked down, but I get up again.. you're never gonna keep me down" Chumbawumba
Maybe Starsky will help refresh my memory. There's a term that we use to have around here, gas lighting or maybe it was "tag".
A WAW will use sex to see if she still has that connection to him or over him, but it's not b/c she desires him. All his well laid work could be shot down that first time he weakens to her flirtations or sexual advances. Once she sees that she can still get through that door, then she immediately looses interest and leaves him standing in the cold.
Yes, I believe he should have denied her sex the first time they met since she left the home. This woman needs to realize she gave him up and that she can't dart in & out of his life/heart whenever she decides. If this is the case here, it's cruel b/c it's just enough to keep him torn up and thinking she's ready to R.
Nothing new, really. For centuries, women have used sex as a control tool to get what they want from men. Unfortunately, this is just one example.
It isn't that simple. While it can FEEL that way, people are not cut and dry. They are always testing the waters with each other. People are very often hopeful for a change. Feelings are vulnerable.
My W had text me saying that she missed me and wanted to see if I'd be free for dinner last night (Sunday), as it's been two weeks since we'd seen one another. I agreed to get some dinner with her.
As she has the last two times we've seen each other in the 6 weeks since she moved out, I was greeted with a wonderful embrace. Conversation was generally light and playful (there was a lot of laughing). She brought up the M, and frankly, I think we discussed the relationship more than we should have.
There were many confusing messages I took out of this meeting. For instance, she admitted to lightly "stalking" me on social media (always wanting to see where I am, who I am with or what I am doing). She tells me several times she misses me so much and thinks about me every day. Hopes that we do work out.
Then she tells me she's just not sure what the next step is, that she's trying to figure out how she feels. Tells me she's thinking about going off the pill (to which I said "that tells me you have no interest in resuming a marriage with me right now.)
She also keeps talking about how she wants to see me again next weekend and how difficult it is to go home alone. I'm 99.99% sure there is not another man. I just can't see how that's even feasible right now. Oh, one other interesting discussion topic last night - the wedding ring. She's still wearing hers. I took mine off when she left. She feels hurt by this since I'm "putting it out there that we are separated." I said no, if I wanted to put it out there, I'd change my relationship status on Facebook. And that I am indeed legally married but am not in a marriage.
Through this dinner, we laughed a lot and had fun. There were touches, kisses and long gazes into each others eyes. There is chemistry though the the sex struggle has been a major, of not the major, issue in our M for the last year.
I see our MC tonight (alone). I'd like to get my W back in counseling but dont feel I should broach the subject. If there is one word that describes this entire situation to me it's "confusion." I am just so confused.
Say 'Sure, I'll see you later, I need my caffeine fix'.