BTW, I'm reading SSM, which is really ironic since I'm the LD partner and consider myself a WAS initially (now I don't know what I am.) Anyway, it's very enlightening in regards to a man's perspective on sex. Way more emotionally-based than I would have ever thought. Assuming men would agree -- in truth and not in just another way to get some. If it is accurate, I have a better understanding of your difficulty.
Yes, I felt it was very accurate, although it's important to understand that the HD/LD dynamic can go in either direction. I have a friend who is HD and her husband is LD.
I can say that for me the SSM book really spoke to me, it articulated how I feel in a way that I could not, I really appreciate that my W read it. As my MC said, if men could take care of their sexual needs by themselves, they would!
Originally Posted By: Crazyville
OTOH, I don't think women were the ones to come up with the phrase, "Wham! Bam! Thank you, Ma'am!" so perhaps you can understand OUR confusion.
I know both men and women who act like that, though it usually stems from insecurity in my experience. If you want to take it up a notch, read "Passionate Marriage" -- that one will make you think!
Accuray
Married 18, Together 20, Now Divorced M: 48, W: 50, D: 18, S: 16, D: 12 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 7/13/11 Start Reconcile: 8/15/11 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 5/1/2014 (Divorced) In a New Relationship: 3/2015
BeingMe, I was only referring to not being with my son because of split custody. I've seen enough to know that's very hard.
My son would love to go skiing, but he's also one to chicken-out at the last minute. So I hesitate taking him, dropping all the money to do so, then being stuck in the cabin all week because he changed his mind.
Also... and I know this is MY problem, so feel free to chew on me endlessly for this. If I were to take my son, I would feel guilty that I deprived my H of sharing the experience with him. I wouldn't want him to do it to me, so it's hard for me to do it to him. Also, I know my son would want his dad there, just like he would want me there. So I'm the bad guy across the board just because I want to go skiing and actually be able to enjoy it myself, which means w/o H.
BTW, well done on the creative writing! I never had that talent/skill, but I'm an avid reader, so I'll help keep you employed.
oh and one more thing, then I have to go get my kids.
As I mentioned to you before, I had emotionally left the M many years ago, although in all fairness, I believe we both stopped committing to each other. Regardless.
My W finally decided to find her happy in the spring of 2010. She didn't leave the M, she just decided to go out and enjoy herself. To GAL.
It was when she confirmed that she was GALing IN SPITE OF ME that it really hurt me. I was otherwise happy for her in her happiness.
She changed herself, which changed the dynamic of the M, which forced me to change, and I asked to join her... and she said "NO! If you go with me, I am not going."
That might be something you want to consider for your sitch.
I believe it was you who earlier said something about "you get what you give." It also appears in the reverse, "we give what we get."
It is very possible that my W felt I was doing things, in spite of her.
Earlier, I had mentioned how it felt to be abandoned. The questions are very open intentionally in order to get an idea of how the person thinks. And you very specifically did not speak on feeling abandoned. We've all felt abandoned in some way, at some point in our lives. That empty whole was very telling, in my mind...
GALing IN SPITE OF is a form of abandonment. Is there a possibility that you are abandoning your H, because you feel he abandoned you. And so he is now getting what he gave...
Also... and I know this is MY problem, so feel free to chew on me endlessly for this. If I were to take my son, I would feel guilty that I deprived my H of sharing the experience with him. I wouldn't want him to do it to me, so it's hard for me to do it to him. Also, I know my son would want his dad there, just like he would want me there. So I'm the bad guy across the board just because I want to go skiing and actually be able to enjoy it myself, which means w/o H.
While that's going on in your head, you are torturing yourself and will hold H responsible, even though he doesn't know what's going on. You're only depriving H of time with S if H minds -- he may not. We're not talking about disappearing forever!
If you want peace with this, then you tell H you are going, and that he can come along if he would like, but either way you're going with S. If he *chooses* not to go, you're off the hook! If he chooses to come, well now you've got to treat the rest of the trip with the same attitude. I'm going to enjoy this -- you can enjoy this too or not, but either way I'm going to enjoy it.
I hear you about no skiing in MO -- I grew up in Chicago and had to go to Wilmot -- 300' of glory. I'm heading to VT this weekend with D13 and S11. W doesn't want to go, D7 is staying home with her. I offered, she declined, I'm free to go!
Accuray
Married 18, Together 20, Now Divorced M: 48, W: 50, D: 18, S: 16, D: 12 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 7/13/11 Start Reconcile: 8/15/11 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 5/1/2014 (Divorced) In a New Relationship: 3/2015
Is there a possibility that you are abandoning your H, because you feel he abandoned you. And so he is now getting what he gave...
Absolutely, sort of, I still have trouble with the word, maybe because I'm so independent? I don't know.
Anyway, I recognize that he's getting what he gave, but is that a bad thing? I see it simply as meeting him where he is. If someone doesn't want to leave the house and you do, and you make plans "for one," how is that being spiteful? And when that pattern has been going on for a very long time, why is it being spiteful of one simply to say, "Thanks, but I'm no longer interested in you doing this with me."
I have a real-life example. When we first married, H boated/camped, I gardened/biked. H would invite me to go boating/camping with him and I would go. In spite of it being one heck of a lot of work and consuming most weekends, I would do it with a good attitude and had fun doing so. For my part, I would invite H to garden with me, but he would consistently decline, claiming it wasn't his thing and it was too "girly." After years of this, I developed a true joy in gardening alone (not that tough since I'm an introvert.) I would read and study and became quite knowledgeable, even a source of info for some gardener friends.
Now almost 17 years later, H decides he was neglectful in our M and wants to garden with me. I honestly DO NOT WANT HIM TO. It's my quiet time to think and enjoy nature without having to force conversation. Plus, with him being completely ignorant of anything having to do with gardening, it's more of a chore for me than a blessing (the equivalent of someone who has never played baseball playing on a semi-pro team.) And it's not like he takes any of his free time to enlighten himself to bring us to a closer compatibility.
Are you suggesting that I'm doing this to be spiteful?
If you want peace with this, then you tell H you are going, and that he can come along if he would like, but either way you're going with S. If he *chooses* not to go, you're off the hook! If he chooses to come, well now you've got to treat the rest of the trip with the same attitude. I'm going to enjoy this -- you can enjoy this too or not, but either way I'm going to enjoy it.
I dislike his company too much to risk his saying that he would want to, plus I'm quite sure he would. He doesn't like to be left out of anything. I don't have what it takes yet to offset his "meanness," and it's a little more difficult to hop on a plan and come home from the mountains than it is to hop in a cab and come home from a restaurant. I like your suggestion, I'm just not there yet.
Like saying that your H goes out golfing, IN SPITE of you. That he wouldn't otherwise go golfing, if he knew it did NOT bother you.
Or like me saying that my W goes out and parties with her friends, specifically because she knows it bothers me that she isn't watching over the kids or that she isn't choosing to hang out with me.
In this case, no. I don't believe H is doing it because he thinks it bothers me. Instead, I feel like he's doing it with complete indifference to me.
If my BFF thinks it's been a while since we've gone out. She considers the options, weather, etc. and thinks of something we could do together, something we both would like. She invites me to go with her to a movie, and asks me if there's something I'd like to see. We both throw in, coordinate a time, meet up and all is good. This is the same way I treat my friends.
My H, OTOH, finds something that HE would like to do, completely without regard to my interests. He then asks me if I would like to do this activity with him. Since it's not my thing, I say no, so he simply finds someone else to do it with him. He doesn't have an interest in ME, he has an interest in an activity.
This makes me feel invisible, unimportant, worthless, unloved, boring, etc. (in OUR relationship only.) Perhaps it's what you're referring to with the word abandoned, but not what I would use.
