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Have a meeting with the L tomorrow. I'm filing for separation. I really do not want to, but I have to protect myself. I don't have many options left.

My motivation is purely out of self-preservation, but I'm curious. Would this be considered a 180? It's a bit extreme IMHO. I'm wondering because nobody thinks that I will do this. Especially the W. It's going to come as a complete shock.

Doing a 180 means to completely reverse a negative behavior that your spouse finds objectionable.

You're doing this to protect yourself. Keep the two separate. You have to protect you first and foremost.

I completely understand that the two are separate. I just was curious if it could be considered one if there was a situation where one spouse was completely clingy and kept pursuing...and, no, I wasn't referring to me and my sitch.


I'm venting here....she came by tonight to braid my daughters hair for school tomorrow. She acts like nothing has ever happened and things are normal. It drives me insane. It's like the one time she actually told me that she has never done anything to hurt me. I guess affairs, blaming me for everything and moving out isn't supposed to hurt now.

venting over.

journaling...

It has been a rough week. I am being audited by the IRS and had my meeting Wednesday. It turns out that my accountant fudged some numbers and the IRS wants me to pay back $36,000. I am completely ignorant with taxes. It's greek to me. It's my fault, I should have reviewed the tax returns and asked questions. Live and learn I suppose.

So, I'm knee deep in bank statements, etc that I have to go through line by line and....let's just put it like this, it's a lot of work. Initially, I sent my W and email asking if she would help me out with all the statements,etc. She agreed. I started thinking about it and thought it would be best if I just went ahead a did it.

With all due respect to my W. I'm not sure she would really do what needs to be done. I'm having a hard time detaching and letting go. I find it's a lot easier if she's out of sight, out of mind. I figure she wants space and doing hours worth of tax stuff is not giving it to her. Plus, finances were a big issue with us. She liked to spend excessively and I liked to pay bills. She felt that, whenever I would talk to her about spending money, I was just pointing out all the negative aspects of her life. That, however, is a different story for another time. I don't want to have her relive all that stuff. Bottom line...I feel it's better to do it myself.

My youngest D's birthday was Wednesday. I saw her for an hour before I dropped her off at daycare. Her mom picked her up as it's her time to have the kids. It's so hard not being with my babies on their birthdays. My oldest D lost a tooth. The W sent me a picture of my D smiling...I thought that was thoughtful. I'm thankful she's at least keeping me in the loop with what is going on with the girls.

Speaking of being thankful. Thanksgiving is less than a week away. Of course, my D's fall break starts the day that my wife gets them. So, I'll be alone on Thanksgiving. I'm sure many of us here will be alone. I'm trying to get a hold of the rescue mission to volunteer for serving dinner, cleaning up afterward or whatever is available. I figure that: a.) I can give to someone else. b.) I will be able to keep busy. c.) It's part of GAL. Most importantly though, I feel bad that I'm alone for Thanksgiving...but, I feel worse for people who have so much less than me. My situation stinks, but it's so much better than so many others.

Oh yeah, I found out my W is having a birthday part for my D today. I heard about it from a neighbor. My W did call me today, but I did not answer. She did not leave a voicemail or a text, so I have no idea why she called. It stings a bit knowing that I was not invited. That's how life is now, so I'll just go with it. There could be a billion reasons why she didn't invite me, but I'm not giving it much thought. I'm not in the mind reading service.

ugh....W dropped off my youngest D. She's wearing a ring around her wedding finger today. It's not the wedding band, but she wore it when she was with the OW. My mind is racing...is the OW back in the picture again? Her dad came into town today for Thanksgiving. Maybe that's it. Does it really matter though? It's been a mere two weeks since she told me she has no desire to be with me. So, I guess I gotta suck it up and keep moving forward.


It seems like it's always something new every week. If I arrange to have my W drop the kids off at a neighbor's house (because I'm not home) she'll say okay. Then she won't respond to my neighbor's text messages. Or she'll text me and ask me if I'm at work. When I don't respond, she'll ask again. She will not drop the kids off until I'm home. What does it matter to her where I'm at?

Sometimes I feel like I'm being taunted.

David,

From what I have read so far it looks like you are in the LBS fog. The things you are worried about you have no control over. What do they really matter?

The first thing I would do, is learn how to braid your D’s hair. Would that be a 180?

You don’t need your wife to help you with your taxes. You are a smart independent man.

Look deep and find the things you don’t like about yourself.

I believe it was Mr. bond that said stay one step ahead of your W. Do just that and prepare for the worst.

Read what Starsky wrote you again, don’t ever ignore your W when it comes to the kids. Only show your best and let go of the rest.

I know this stuff seems hard at first and you are very unsure of what direction you should be going. Try something new and face those fears and just be the best man you can. Learning a few patience isn’t going to hurt one bit. All of this takes time but if you do it and actually live it you will open your eyes to so much more.

Seminolewind,

I read your response on your post in the MLC forum. Thank you. Those are some great ideas...and some I'm already implementing. I'm so used to doing the girl thing it's ridiculous. I'll let the daughters put makeup on me, I'll paint their nails, take them out on dates, makeovers...you name it. Honestly, it's some of the best times I've ever had.

I do agree that I'm in the LBS fog. I'm trying to feel my way out...I'm making progress...baby steps. I've noticed that the last couple weeks I have slipped a bit as far as my PMA around my kids. The whole thing with my wife dating threw me for a loop. Before I got the girls this week I vowed I would keep a PMA and have fun with them. So far, so good. We are celebrating Thanksgiving tomorrow (their mom has them Thursday). Probably get nails done and hit a movie and dinner. For some odd reason they do not want me cooking for them...smart girls. haha.

My W's father drove quite a ways to be here for Thanksgiving. I think it's very important that my kids see their grandparents. Even if they do hate me. My W has a very large family and they all get together on the holidays to celebrate. My W sent me a text message saying that we can split the girls on Thursday. I thought about it and decided it would be better for them to be around their family. It will distract them and keep their mind off of the D. Plus, I really want them to have quality time with their Grandpa.

My W text me back asking if I was sure and that she thought the kids would like that. I responded back to her explaining that I thought they should be with family. She dropped a text that said, "U should be with family too". I had no idea how what to say as it seemed like a vague, mixed message type of comment. I've learned that when in doubt, it's better not to say anything, rather than put your foot in your mouth. Sure enough, she text messaged me saying, " if u want u can come to my place." Again, I wasn't quite sure how to respond. I was at work anyway and didn't have time to respond anyway. Later, I had to text her to get an address of a friend who was going to take my daughter's to her house because I was going to be late picking them up from daycare. Later in the evening she text me asking about girl scouts tomorrow night. I asked her how important it was because we are having our Thanksgiving tomorrow. She responded with, "so, you don't want the girls then?" I explained again how I thought they needed to be around a lot of family and it will distract them. I also explained how it was her day to have the kids and I didn't want to take that away.

All of what I said was true. But honestly, I just can't be around her. I get too caught up in the emotions of it all. Plus, it would be awkward for me to be at her place around her family. Especially since she said that everyone she's talked to (her family) is happy she left me. None of them have actually had a conversation with me longer than five minutes, except one, and he likes me fine. Bottom line, I need space away from her. Obviously she needs it away from me too. She'll never know if she misses me if I'm always around.

She then asked me if I wanted to come to her house. I told her I appreciated the invite. Politely thanked her and told her that I was going to my bosses house for Thanksgiving. Which she responded with "cool".

What's the point in all of this? First, I'm spending a holiday at my bosses place. Something that I would never do. Especially with my boss...I had a boss complex. The funny thing is I WANT to go. Second, I turned down going to her house, which is completely opposite of what I would normally do. Third, I kept a PMA throughout the whole thing and was able to focus on my work and then later on my kids.

Now before everyone starts bashing me about not spending Thanksgiving with my kids, keep this in mind. We are celebrating Thanksgiving tomorrow. I know my kids and they will be better off with family distractions rather than at a stranger's house with no one to play with. Also, I told my W we were going to have separate holidays months ago. Don't forget that grandpa is in town as well and this is his only chance to see them. So put down your 2x4's. I'm a good dad. I'm not taking anything away from them. This is a difficult situation for us all and trust me, it will be better this way.

My brain keeps wanting to figure out the reason why she's wearing the ring again and why she asked me twice to come over for Thanksgiving. The beautiful thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER! I can't control it. I've gone as far as I am going to go as far as pursuing my wife. I do have self-respect and pride. She knows I love her. She knows that I am here. I do not want her back if she doesn't WANT to be back. I don't want to rush this just to have her freak out and run away again. She needs to deal with whatever she needs to deal with. She needs to decide if she loves me or not. I'm not going to get in the way of that. I feel that she is sending me mixed messages, but that seems to be part of the script.

David,

I am not going to beat you up for your choices. Everyone makes choices and after we make those choices we determine if that was the best choice for us or not. Make your decisions based on what you want. I will make one point though don’t ever just give in to your W because she needs to respect you. If you just give in you lose any respect you had.

I would say for someone going dark you sure talk to your W more than I would suggest. Ignore everything unless it’s about the kids or finances and be slow on the finances. Just use good judgment.

How mysterious is telling her you are going to your bosses house for Thanksgiving? Why couldn’t you just said you already have plans? Heck they might have been with a super model yet you didn’t even make her a little curious. Be mysterious.

If my ex would ask me over for Thanksgiving so I could be around my youngest, I would say sorry I already have plans. She would then say oh going to your sisters? I would say no she has to work, I just have other plans and then I would let it die. We aren’t a family anymore why act like one? Think ahead and be mysterious.

My ex FIL is going on a hunting trip with me next week. He knows all I ever wanted to do was save my marriage. He has told me numerous times that he doesn’t want me to ever take his daughter back. Why do you think he tells me that? He told me last Christmas was the worst Christmas of his life. He was hurting just as bad as me and he still loves his daughter. You know what I figured out he just wanted me to live and live good. I can guarantee he knows divorce busting without ever reading the books. With age comes wisdom.

What does the ring really matter? This is her choice and you shouldn’t even concern yourself with what she does. Listen to yourself, IT DOES NOT MATTER! Detach, detach, detach!!!!!

You can do this!

She offered to spend Thanksgiving together. It was a nice gesture and you have to stop thinking of everything being about you and her. It's about your kids as well.

Think about it this way. When your kids are your age and start reminiscing about the holidays when they were growing up, they're just going to remember being with your W and that you chose to be with your boss.

You and your W are still a family. As long as you have children together, you will always be a family. Maybe not legally, but both of you have DNA in the kids. You are all family. If your W offered an olive branch for that, then IMO, you can do it and both of you give the kids a Thanksgiving they will enjoy with their mom and dad.

I'm not quite sure where I gave in to my W in this situation. I'm know I have numerous times in the past. I'm a work in progress. If you think I gave in to her please let me know.



We do seem to communicate a lot. I'm really working hard at detaching...I've stepped it up a notch. My biggest problem is that when we are around each other we get along great...just like old times. Honestly, I think we could be really good friends. Right now, I can't do it.



I don't know. Sometimes I feel like I'm playing a game with that. I see your point and I know I need to do better with this. Also, I was excited that I was going to my bosses house...and I actually wanted too. I know I'm not supposed to change for our wives, or flaunt it...but this is a huge 180 for me. If I said I just had plans she would think that those plans would be sitting at home by myself. That's what I used to do. I know, I know...who cares what she thinks? It just felt good saying that I was going over to someone else's house instead of going to hers. It's a huge change for me....and I like it.

I agree, but at some point I am going to have to do things with the kids and her. I think that is important....well, at least trying to make things as normal as possible. But, as I've stated before, I can't see her. If I'm going to detach she has to be out of sight, out of mind. Maybe this makes me sound weak, but if I'm going to be strong for my kids then I need some time away from the W to heal.



Going over to her place, right now, would make everything awkward rather than enjoyable.

Here is where I'm getting confused, and hopefully you can clear this up for me. In a previous post you said:



You also wrote:



This is where I get lost. I am trying to protect myself. It seems to me like you feel like I should do Thanksgiving at her place, yet, avoid her like the plague and protect myself. Could you clarify?

I understand 180's are about reversing a negative behavior, such as going to my bosses house for Thanksgiving. One of her issues is that I never went out with friends or did anything for myself. I did have the 180 confused with the LRT. I understand the difference now.

Honestly, I just feel like I can't win. No matter what I do I'm either not detaching enough, detaching too much or messing up something that involves the kids. Somewhere down the line I'm getting lost.