Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers WAW says she wants to come back

I'll bet a ten spot she is telling the other man,

"she will absolutely give up kartman and her marriage IF he commits to marrying her"

and he isn't.

BINGO.


Puppy

just a 10 spot?

Bro, you're good for more than that ;-)

lol. the girls went makeup shopping last night. a 10 and a small double double was all they brought me back.

in seriousness, i think in many situations that is the reason "letting them go" to be with the OM is better than exposure. When reality sets in and this other guy realizes this woman, he knows barely anything about, wants to pick up with him where she left off with her husband (with kids and debt), I'd be scared too.

I can understand the "wanting to fight for me" thing and am not insulting it, but if my wife wanted me to fight for her, I would rather it be saving her from some ornery chick in a mud wrestling match then from some guy she is lying to me about to go see.

Yes, I got more or less the same question again when she came over to talk this evening. First I should say I would have put the kabosh on her coming over altogether but regrettably at times I have a soft spot when she says she misses my daughter. Depending on the night, I feel I am fairly alert to when its ok for her to come over and see my daughter when she misses her and when its not, in other words there are times I know it will confuse my daughter and other times I don't think it does. Regardless, I am really struggling to find consistency on that matter, because I try to put myself in her place missing a child. I suppose that's a microcosm of the reason I posted on here to begin with, what's the right thing to do for my daughter?

Anyway, I told her that never have you made it clear to OM that you will give him up, written him a letter, or anything like that and THEN told me you have done so. It's as if you feel like you probably SHOULD, but you don't WANT to. Big difference. She claims she is afraid that if she does that, then I still will need a lot more from her and it may not be enough. I told her, of course not, that's just the beginning. I would still have trust issues. More importantly, so what if she was willing to re-open her phone records and banking statements, etc. I don't want to treat the person I am with like a child, like I am their parent. That's no way to live for either of us....exhausting for me and, though one would certainly say she deserves it, that is ongoing humiliation for her which I am sure she would eventually revolt against. On top of all that, I don't like how I feel when I dish out any anger over the things I know she has done with OM. Makes her feel like a zero and doesn't show any forgiveness...I try extremely hard not to but there are too many triggers out there. I couldn't even say, let's get this movie from the store or something without wondering, ok, has she seen it already with OM? That has happened already and it's a terrible feeling.

So why do I still wonder if I am doing the right thing, since she still has the ball back in my court? I would think my daughter would benefit from seeing a respectable, cordial divorced adult relationship between her mother and I, not one where we're together but it's filled with suspicion and where she has to report everything to me, and all the while there is the occassional barb being tossed back her way over the triggers that come up. I guess that's why these things are so difficult, you pretty much know what the right thing is but yet you can't fully be sure, especially when you're child is involved.

You were told exactly what to say,
but you can't do it for some reason,
something to do with the "soft spot" you have for her in your heart.

I get it, that's how you feel and you are letting that feeling dictate how you should act in this situation.

I just want to point out something,
you are afraid to lose something (your wife) that you have already lost.

The minute she went with the OM, you lost her.
You still feel like she is with you in some small way,
and giving her the required speech that Gucci outlined above would somehow make her lost to you forever.

She is gone, that was her decision.
The minute you give her the speech about how it's going to be and really mean it because you finally GET IT, that's when it will be your decision and that's when things will change in your situation.

When I say change, I mean that you will finally have figured out the value of your life and how much you've been shortchanging yourself by allowing her crap behavior to continue for so long.

You have the answers to your situation,
you've been given the solution to your problem,
you are too afraid to do what must be done and we can't fix that remotely unfortunately, it requires you to grow some balls, be a man and stop letting people (in this case your wife) treat you so poorly.

You said it yourself, she admitted that she's afraid to tell the OM that it's over, just proves to me she likes have multiple options available to her, you've been the backup plan up until now, do you like being someone's 2nd choice, 2nd pick? I don't know about you but I wouldn't settle for being anything less than someone's first pick, if you aren't your wife's first pick, there is something seriously wrong with this picture, it's possible it's time for you to find someone who would make you their first pick.

Life is too short to settle for anything less and it's definitely too short to live in fear.

I am still going ahead with the dissolution...why is it so difficult to stop second-guessing myself is what I wonder? I couldn't agree more with everything robx said. Why the second thoughts? I know in DR it is very pro-marriage, so maybe I still have this illusion that there is an answer to the problem that I just don't see. Then I tell myself, yeah, the first part of that answer is for her to give up OM. And not just because I told her too, because she wants to because working on things is more important. Obviously, that is not the case here. It's hard not to think though there is some solution. Furthermore, since OM will have a presence in my daughter's life, this voice in my head keeps challenging me: "Dude, are you really gonna roll over and let this happen-are you really gonna just let him get into the picture, or remain in the picture really, that easily?"

It's like there is the side of me that is doing the right thing for me, but there is either a moral, or intellectual, or prideful side to me that wants to go against that. I wish I could see this more clearly.

pursue full custody of your daughter

It's just a terrible mental block. I have not given in and am not on track to do so. But I WONDER and Second Guess all the time. Mostly because, if the letter she sent me below is sincere enough on her part, is it sensible for me to try to work on things instead of throwing in the towel? Is it close enough to try to keep OM out of my daughter's life?, which is a huge issue for me. It is like there is a fork in the road here, and I am taking the one that esnures my family is split and there is free reign for the OM to influence my daughter. I could pursue full custody-but I don't beleive that's the right thing to do for my daughter's sake. WAW and I get along remarkably well separated, and we have 50/50 custody. That would add a lot of problems to an amicable situation. My question really is, is she on the right track with this letter or is she still way out there? I maintain she's still way out there, but I have been bull headed and tunnel visioned before and don't want to make a big mistake if anyone can see something I don't. Names have of course been changed to protect the innocent.

Hi Grocerykartman,

"Maybe this is a better way to communicate anyway considering you feel more comfortable with written word and we are not drained from our hard days at work.....to allow us to both be more clear and level headed. I on the other hand do not feel as confident that I can get my points across in writing...but I will try.
First and foremost.....this is not me being scared of DUH-DUH-DUN....the (approaching day in court).
I have been praying a lot....even falling asleep while praying at night. I praying for forgiveness, guidance, and for our families well being. I have been trying to give all of my anxieties to God and trust in Him and HIS plan. I was growing wearying because I felt like I was not "hearing Him" ...until I thought recently that maybe I just have to listen with my heart. Isn't that where Jesus is supposed to live?? Just makes sense...
My heart tells me I belong with my family.....and not just my family...but YOU. I could not honestly say that 6 months ago. I know you don't understand why I couldn't realize that back then and make the appropriate changes....I just couldn't see it. I am sorry. You know how they say, you can't make a person loose weight or quit smoking until they are ready?? I guess it similar to that. I understand that in a relationship....it may be too late because in the time one takes in getting "ready"/or to the right place, it may have hurt the other beyond repair. That is another aspect that I see crystal clear now....how much I have hurt you. I honestly was so immersed in my own hurt, disappointment, and self hatred that I did not think I was doing anything wrong....or hurtful. Sounds crazy but it's true. It has been hitting me rather hard....how poorly and unfairly I have treated you. I see that now. I am sorry. It was not intentional...
I also do see that your 1-2-2-1 thing

[INTERJECTING HERE TO EXPLAIN, I told her basically, ok, so I did a lot of neglectful things in the marriage, and I'll take MORE of the blame than you for how bad things got, so that's act 1. You respond by essentially bringing a gun to a knife fight by getting involved with OM, so that's act 2. I need you to give up act 2 before I can start to fix what was wrong with act 1. She, though, has seemed to think I needed to show her something that would make her believe things would be different-in other words, fix act 1 before she would give up act 2. In short, I see it as Act 1 happened, act 2 happened, so act 2 needs to go away so I can fix act 1. She wants 1-2-1-2.]

(I know that is wrong...but I honestly never understood what you were saying...just heard 1's and 2's LOL....buy I get the jist of it) was right. I still think that you down play what I went through with you....please consider that. To me, my hurt and disappointment was a 2.....actually it felt/feels like a 10. I know you can't understand that but it is very much true. I think the sooner you can understand, believe, and feel that...the better we will be.
I guess the real question is....what do you want? I can only tell you what I want. I think it goes without saying that neither of us want things to go back to how they were. We BOTH have a lot of changes to make and things to work through. I blamed you for not wanting me but I gave you no reason to. I see and believe that. I will change that. I will do what ever it takes to make you want me. You know, one of the biggest issues that have plagued us from the very beginning is that I never felt like you choose me....I was just there. I fully realize now that if you we commit to making things work this time.....you will have chosen me! I can foresee myself being able to let that old thought go because of that.
Try not to think back on the times that we have failed miserably at connecting (like late last year). I was checked out by then....there was no hope at that time. I felt better saying I gave it one last chance ......but did I/we really?
You often said in the beginning of our problems that my actions spoke volumes to you about what/who I wanted. What do my actions speak to you now? I always want to be with you....even when I have D3. I want us to be a happy family and have siblings for D3. I thought maybe I didn't want to before, but that was because I was so unhappy with our relationship. I realize that is VERY important to me.
So here is where you won't be able to get the full range or emotion I am trying to express....I am crying so hard right now that I can't see the screen. I don't even care who sees me....
I know that none of this matters if you don't feel confident that I have given OM up. Grocerykartman, I have spoken with OM about this...he understands. I can and will give him up.....DONE. I could certainly be with him if I wanted to now. Again....goes back to my actions. IF this was all about him.....would I want to come back to a broken marriage that will require a lot of work? Wouldn't I just move on with him? This has been extremely hard on me because (despite what you think of him) he is a good person. I have hurt him too. When did I become such a monster....hurt everyone in my path??
So, is this enough to make you want to talk to me further? There is so much to say.....I have 100 thoughts rolling around in my head and I am finding it hard to put them down in an articulate format.
Please don't feel bad if you have to write me or tell me that you don't feel the same way....if you are done and want out...just tell me. I can and will be okay with that...at some point. We will work thru it just as we have been (I have been very proud of us in that respect).
I love you Grocerykartman.

If anyone would be so kind as to share their opinion on this, I would definitely appreciate it. Thank you.

One quick bit for you ~~~

DON'T ANSWER YET! There is a lot to process in that letter and I would advise you to take your time, gather input from folks here, and really sift through the salient points.

Greek