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What Truegritter said. Being friendly does not mean friendship. Friends don't cause the pain your H caused. I am glad you know that you will be alright no matter what. That's big. If your WAH ever brings up the idea of friendship, then let him know (if that's how you still feel) that you want a friendly co-parenting R, but friendship with someone who has caused you and your S pain and the loss of a stable family is out of the question. And rather unrealistic for him to hope for it.

Again, focus on yourself. Perhaps you don't have a lot to change, but there are things that you can do to get past this situation in your life. And, I think you have started doing them. If he is in MLC, no amount of changing will get him back. He has to get through the MLC himself and then one hopes he will return to the M and family. You will have to detach, protect yourself (and S4) emotionally and financially, and wait it out, if you are inclined to do so.

Pie,

Nice job putting him on camera duty!

It's not really acting as if it isn't a big deal (he know it is) it's being cilvil for your S4. If you can manage to be friendly (and you have) great.

I still vascillate whne it comes to feeling like a "fraud" not nearly as much as I used to though (we're talking once in a blue moon now).

I know how badly you want to show him how much he hurt you. Do you think he doesn't know? Did he not know you at all? He knows. You not putting it in his face just leaves the pressure off. Is that important? You decide. Is it more important for him to feel at ease enough to be around you and S4 or do you want him run from you and possibly S4.

Truly it would have been so much easier for me if I didn't see H (or at least rarely). In my case, I think he would have headed for the hills and probably seen D's less esp over time. Who knows though, maybe I'm selling him short. What I do know, is how I feel about myself and my actions.



Perfect sense. Do you define "in vain" as if he doesn't come back to you? Or could you define it as his being an active parent b/c he can have at least a civil R with you? I know it's really the former. I know you don't want to feel like a fool. All I can tell you, is that for me, I would feel like a fool if I let this mess get in the way of my D's having the best of both of us. Even together sometimes.

Only you can decide for you.



It's all progress. Whether it heads in the direction you want it to right now, that's what you have to be patient and wait for.

HUGS

Thank you everyone, I think what gets me is the having patience part, I'm not an overly patient person, if somethings not going as fast as I want it to go, I feel the need to get in there and speed it up a bit Which obviously I cant do I will be ordering the DR book this week - but its going to take 6 - 8 weeks to get here I think I have the gist of it, but any pointers in the meantime would be appreciated.

Yes, I DO want him back, but not the way things were. There would have to be changes. On his side and mine. I dont think we are incompatible, I havnt felt that for 12 years? And if he was feeling it he did a good job of hiding it

I think I should move onto the Newcomers forum section, as I'm not 100% sure this is MLC, although I was convinced to start - it might have been wishful thinking omn my part - I'm confused about it now becasue H seems happier now (3 months seperated), than hes been in 2 years I wish it was an act, but its a good one if it is.

I guess its natural to not like seeing someone so happy when you yourself feel hard done by

I want to be the bigger person in this, and for it to be water off a ducks back, but I'm a pisces, and a very emotional sensitive oneat that, I'm just not tough as nails, although thats what I'm portraying to H at the moment

Will copy and paste some of this into newcomers

Any thoughs and advice welcome

I know there is a natural tendency to try to link your sitch to a diagnosis of sorts -MLC or Not.

I would submit, it doesn't matter Pie.

Your approach to this is the same. I have already explained what I believe is the major difference in the advice you get here and (most) of the advice you get in Newcomers.

It is really tactics (newcomers) vs long term, sustained growth we talk about here.

The focus on YOU part is what I refer to.

Most MLCers do behave and react differently to the "tactics"

I can only share as it was described to me when I came here from newcomers.

This is the big leagues. Tactics may achieve short term results BUT unless there is REAL change and growth what have you really gained?

As Grace pointed out what is your definition of success?

To get your H to come back?

Or



????

That is the work we do here.

There are some great people posting over there(newcomers) Pie.

It has been my experience and is my opinion that you will find the best environment HERE if your goal is the latter of the two I have suggested above.

The focus on YOU is OUR focus.

If you see how long the people here have invested THEIR time to help complete strangers ????

There is a genuine desire to help people learn and grow.

Me? I have learned that once you grow and understand, you have no other choice than to help others get there.

It is THAT important to you when you know that truth.

Just sayin...

I hope you stay.

Hey Pie,



He didn't hide it, you were compatable. At some point it shifted and he may even have thought he was telling you in some way.



Sweetie, I'm not sure my H is MLC or not either. Never was. TG is right, it doesn't matter. We want a diagnosis so that we can feel like there is hope of a cure. There is always hope.

The tools you get and the prodding to be your best self is what matters. I still read all over the board and post here and there where I have something to offer or a question.

Emotional? He11, the joke at my house is that I cry at the drop of a kleenex. My D18 insisted on showing me a video of Pink's "I Don't Believe You" yesterday with my H standing there. I had to walk away and gather myself before coming back. You do the best you can and when you know better, you do better (mostly).

No, it isn't natural to see them "happy" without us. The thing is, you don't really know if he is or not. It could be he just feels the pressure is off.

That was beautiful Grace, and much nicer than the way I would have said it.

Pie,

The things you want, or want to be, come with TIME and effort.

DBing is a tactic to get your marriage back ONLY in so much that you CHANGE bad habits, become a better person and down the road your erstwhile spouse looks back and goes:"WHOA!" There is the person I missed or...better yet, there is a person I want to know, how could I be so stupid.

Nowhere in DBing, in, Newcomers, WAS, MLC...Thinking of leaving...no where is there a magic trick or way to control the spouse back to you. And each forum goes about it a little different. MLC IS different and we look for the VERY long Haul. That is not to say your H comes back in a LONG time...it is likely if he is in MLC, it is long haul for YOU and lasting changes tend to take time anyway.

3 months and your H seems happy.

Pie, look 3 months is really nothing...ohh it feels like f-ing forever, but it really isn't much time at all.

You WANT to e able to do this?

Stop counting time, past or ahead, live in today, and make it to tomorrow.

Don't believe anything they say.....
(I know you are hearing that it is over)



and believe half of what you see.

Know this, he may be seem happy on the outside but he is not.

If he was happy before he started acting like an alien he would not have started acting like an alien....right??? make sense???

So we know he was unhappy to begin with....right???

MLC, WAS, Alien, whatever you want to call them they are all doing the same thing and that is medicating the pain they are in.

Your H is truly unhappy, he is literally on drugs when you see him, he is medicated. Slowly, VERY SLOWLY the effectiveness of the drugs wears off and he is still unhappy. This is where you have to be PATIENT.

If you want to stop being confused, stop trying to get into his head, all you are going to find is more confusion.

Grit said it best.....The focus on YOU is our focus.

Make a list of things you want to change about YOU, or things YOU want to do for YOU, what kind of person do YOU want to become, are YOU starting to catch on here? This is about YOU.

We know there is pain and the journey is hard that is why we are here, to help YOU. YOU will find acceptance and understanding here as YOU walk this path.

YOU are not alone.

Hope you will stay also.