Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers Getting bad advice from "friends" . . . . .

Well, not sure what to think, but when she got home today, she mentioned she hadn't discussed us with her friend "if it makes you (me) feel better. She didn't say it sarcastically. I'll assume she didn't lie to me since that really hasn't been a problem in the past.

Mark, Yea I've looked around a bit, and that seems to be a fairly common issue/theme, and that really is a shame. I understand that "men and women are different" . . . but I'm sorry, job status is such a shallow bellwether for a loving relationship to revolve around. I consider it a serious character flaw if that is truly "THE" reason.

I hadn't considered it from this perspective before, and I'd MUCH rather think that the 'job issue' was just a convenient thing to place focus/blame on and there were really other issues, kind of like my first thoughts on why this is happening.

Frankly, if it really is "just the Job", I would lose a LOT of respect for her. That would be genuinely shallow and despicable, in my opinion.

One thing that I find a little puzzling is that my thoughts on 'transference of blame' seems to generate virtually NO consideration. Dang, I've seen this type of thing happen MANY times in other situations. It's a classic and very well documented phenomenon . . .yet it gets blown off and dismissed out-of-hand.

While my getting a job would by default take some of the pressure off from her folks, it wouldn't change anything as far as her relationship with her daughter.

I believe I pointed out that I had in fact read Michelle's first book, and I read it a lot. Even though I'd screwed up and given my ex a copy, I doubt she read very much of it, and I did see some evidence of the "counter-intuitive" thing working, though clearly, not as much as I would have liked.

But counterinuitive only carries so far, and I'm not a mental turnip either. I'm 49, and I've been dealing with both men and women all my life . .as have all of us. If "the right way" to do everything was "counterintuitive" . . . as a species we'd still be bumbling around, rubbing two sticks together to make a fire.

After reviewing many past posts today . . .I think many of ya'll take the counter-intuitive thing too far . . . just my opinion of course. I have to say that I'm a little disappointed that there doesn't seem to be more success here.

Like I also pointed out earlier, I used to post and get involved in many discussions on these boards during my unsuccessful attempts to save my first marriage. While I didn't do everything right, some things that were "supposed to work" simply did not, and didn't even come close.

This is why I questioned Kimmies "be mysterious" suggestion. I wasn't being ungrateful. I can understand that concept to a point, but the devil is in the details of the execution of a tactic (so-to-speak) of that type. Seems to me there is a LOT of room for something like that to backfire right in a guys (or gals) face. Maybe when the book gets here, that'll be clarified a bit more in depth, but I'll still use caution on that one.

What I guess I really want, is to hear specifically from people who have had to directly deal with the WAW having alleged friends cheering her on to walk away. I'd like to hear their experiences, with trying to intervene, with leaving it alone, and how they feel it worked or didn't.

On a different note, sadly, having already been there, and being at least a little familiar with Michelles general concept, I see some folks who by their very own words, think something is going well that I can see clear as a bell isn't . . .like someone stole a chapter right out of my own biography in my past attempt to save my first marriage.

I'm hesitant to offer my own experiences really, because I don't want to let my amateur assessment run them down a bad road. Unfortunately, a few folks here seem to have no problem feigning 'expertise' . . and after reading some of the past posts . . .they could actually use a dose of my hesitation, skepticism, and humility.

I realize that most folks really do want to help, but it might not hurt to find out a little more before jumping to some genuinely premature conclusions on some of the situations.

Anyway, I do appreciate the base intent, and if some of ya'll think I'm an ass who is unworthy of help, well . . .we're all entitled to our opinions.

Bummedout

Just to make sure this line of thinking doesn't go too far, what my thoughts are from my situation is that it's not so much "just the job".

Again, this is from my situation, so yours could be different. With my W, it was the bigger picture, but the job was a piece of that, and symptomatic of other things....provision, protection, trust, responsibility, "taken care of"....consider all these things from the point of view of the WAW and you'll see the angle that I'm coming from regarding the financial stuff. It kind of starts with a job, but it's more than just the job.

Again, this is from my situation.

BO,

Let me echo Glimmer here. The job is a part of it. It's not the whole enchilada. I know that my wife resents the censored out of my new job as a teacher. I'm no longer "the boss". I don't set meetings and agendas, I attend them. She didn't do well in school and thinks that teachers are a waste of oxygen. (I make much more money than previously though) She also lost her "glory job" a year ago and is applying for jobs at half the pay rate. We would be sunk without the pay from my new job. So yeah, it's about her job and mine, but it's also about waay more.

SpinFree

Yea, the peripheral "ripple effect" of not having a job, in essence, her desire for provision, protection, etc. is understandable. My question is, why can't she talk about it? Why wait until the feelings of resentment fester into wanting to just throw in the towel before bringing it up?

Not that I haven't noticed 'little things' and I've asked about them in the months leading up to this. I got "nothing." I just assumed my feeling were a bit of paranoia, since I myself am TOTALLY uncomfortable with not having a steady job right now.

One thing I learned in my past marriage was that I did have a tendency to "take things for granted . . .mainly, the idea that marriage vows actually mean something. Things are tough right nowHer problems I've always taken as "our problems" since we're supposed to be a 'team." And she did have problems when we first met, and I didn't even think twice about paying off some debt that wasn't mine.

Now it seems like me not being employed is MY problem, and MY problem is causing her problems, so it's MY fault SHE is having problems. Not very "teamlike." I'm not even sure how to deal with that. On the one hand, I love her very much. On the other hand, I find this "emotional one way street" relative to our problem (in my mind) to be rather despicable. Of course I told her this when we first had the "I'm done" conversation, likely considered "the wrong thing" to do . . . but how do ya deal with it? Rolling over seems like a VERY bad strategy, and I WILL trust my intuition on that, unless someone can in fair detail explain why.

Dang, I kinda went off topic again, considering the primary issue I would love a little help with is just how to deal with her "friend" giving bad advice.

Again, I'm 49, and I've seen too many times the cancer bad advice from friends is, and not just for marriage relationships.
In my past marriage, I didn't do anything about it, because . . .well . . .I didn't even know for sure it was happening (I did kinda think about it though) until a few months after the divorce had finalized, when a chance meeting with her former boss. He told me my Ex and her friends (co-workers) really dogged me, and he said it bothered him because most of what he heard about my 'transgressions' really didn't seem so bad to him. Of course he just "stayed out of it."

Anyway GM and SF, thanks for not ignoring me simply for not "doing whatever I'm told here" or questioning advice. I'd think asking questions bluntly and succinctly would be more productive in working toward understanding what many of us are clearly dealing with, but it doesn't seem to be the case. Bummer, for all of us, really.

I just read your stich about the freind thing my MIL is the one that pushed my WAW back to her old freinds and has bad talk parties about me this i found out from a mutal freind who needs enmies when you have inlaws.