Here's the thing. Your H was far better off with you than with his parents. However, what they did to him was a form of abuse--keeping him too enmeshed with them, not allowing him to detach and grow on his own, making him dependent upon their approval, and, of course, making them his primary emotional attachment. What he's acting on now is all the guilt they heaped on him.
The thing is, underneath everything, he's angry at them ... and also at himself, for not having the guts to stand up to them, assert his own priorities, make his own choices, and become independent. You don't want to just wait for his mother to die--you want him to choose to PUT HIMSELF (AND HIS WIFE) FIRST before that happens, so you know your relationship has a chance.
In the meantime, make that apartment as homey as you can, make your life as full as you can, and keep up the good work of reflecting upon what you "got" out of the unhealthy dynamic you had, how you contributed to it, and how you wish to change. It's often hard not to get "riled up" about the past, but that's choosing to expend energy on something you can't change, and where neither of you was able to do anything differently because of your life experiences up to that point.
You can change your future, however. What would you like it to look like?
i've heard so much about responsibility. i've blamed my ILs for being horrible parents and raising their children to be dependent on them for life. but the children are also adults now shouldn't they be responsible for their own actions and decisions? so who is to blame here? the parents or the children (who eventually become our h or w)?
Yeah, I went through that. Blaming them. (Still am mad at them for being irresponsible parents). Blaming w. In the end, I agree with you that it is entirely the choice of the spouse to allow this to take place. My w did not have to invite them into our marriage, invite them to run her d, but blaming my w does not help me, my marriage, or anyone else. Instead, what I ended up doing is thinking about why w would choose her parents over me. What can I do to change myself so that I can outshine, outdo them in everything? For what part am I solely to blame? And what I can do about it today, next week, continue to do forever for myself or any good partner?
I clearly have an edge on affection and sex, but right now w has no interest in either of these. Affection is completely satisfied by nursing and cuddling with our son. Sex--her hormones are still in nursing mode and she has no interest in me (or anyone else). If she does, occasionally, the electrical version of me probably works just fine--it never complains
I can wait it out until her need for affection and sex returns, but I know that for my w, she must have an emotional connection first anyway. And that's what I'm working on.
I'm trying to show her in the few ways in which she is allowing me that I can meet her needs like no one else in the world. That her parents will not be willing to do what I'd do as a good husband. I often feel like I am directly competing against an extremely crafty, extremely smart, extremely responsive version of OM (embodied in MIL and FIL). Ex: I make some special herbed chicken for w and a few days later they do it too, trying to outdo me.
I can't "win" MIL and FIL over and that wouldn't be right of me to even try. But I can continue to treat them kindly, occasionally ask if they need anything I can pick up at the grocery store, talk to them, see the good in them. It's d*mn hard to do. I feel like I'm not being true to myself when I do this and would just want to scream at them and my w for being so very irresponsible and cavalier with our family! But that's not going to save my marriage, is it. That doesn't mean I can't be honest if I feel my w has done something to mistreat me. But it also mean because we're separated I have to choose the few battles wisely and sometimes drop things that I'd normally bring up in a "married" state.
yes, i believe that too. i believe that underneath, he is angry at them and himself for not being able to stand up for himself. but why take it out on me? what did i do wrong? i only made life better. oh wait. i know what i did. he owed his parents money and i helped him repay that debt. that debt symbolized a grasp his parents had on him. by getting rid of the debt, i got rid of the grasp on him. so that made me the evil woman who was coming between them. she must be destroyed with a d-bomb!
i think you are so right though. it is abuse. h will never realize how much better he was with me. by dropping the d-bomb, he obviously isn't going to put m first. i think the d-bomb was dropped at a time when his judgement was clouded with his parents nagging voices of what a witch i was. my ic says the m is so salvagable. but h has a lot of work to do. he has to establish boundaries between the m and his parents. this is where HE failed.
what would my future look like? i want to be happy again. i want a place to call my home. i want to buy the things i want to buy decorate my home the way i like i want to share my life with someone who loves me and appreciates me i want someone who wants to be with me, as much as i want to be with him. i want to travel to places and share experiences with him.
Sorry about my verbage, I wasnt trying to discourage you...I was involved in an EA...all I did was complain about my M...istead of approaching W and letting her know the issues, I found comfort and support in OW...
That fell apart..just before it did, W approached me and shared her truest feelings and disappointments reg the M...I could have cared less at the time- my E needs were being met elsewhere. The EA crashed and burned, I immediately wanted what I had found w/ OW in my M.
At that time W had an EA and she checked out just like I did...the chase has been on since then...my M is ruined unless something spectacular takes place.
My point is being checked out is not permanant, ESP if it's the man who's checked out...if you give him a sense of loss- I can assure you it may be the best way for results.
Doesn't work so much when the woman checks out...at least thats the way I understand it.
I am a good man, sure I was selfich and didn't communicate well, BUT when W checked out-I knew EXACTLY what I wanted...
Keep hope alive, I still do to a degree and my sitch may be beyond all hope
I am not very encouraging, I'm afraid, but realistic. Until he sees for himself what his parents are doing....he will not change. The best thing that could happen would be for the two of you to move as far away from them as possible. I realize that may sound terrible to anyone who has not experienced this sort of problem, but it does not get better. As they age they will grow more demanding upon his time & personal attention. If his father passes away first then his mother will consume him.
Your H sounds spoiled and immature so that is another stike against you. You certainly have my prayers.
You know, love has nothing to do with it. I loved my parents just as much as my H loved his, but I knew my place was to stand by my H and put him first in my life. I hurt so bad for so many years and then a long time down the road I did not show that honor first to him and had an EA with OM, and it nearly killed my H. Of course, everyone on the DB board thinks it's awful....and it is, I'm not saying it isn't,but maybe if I had had first place in my H's life perhaps things would have played out differently later in our M. I guess we will never know. There were other factors involved so it wasn't all due to that....but it was certainly grew from that seed....I will always believe that.
When it is the W who is too connected to her parents, it is just as bad except the man could pull up stakes and tell her they are moving. Living next door to in-laws is something I would not advise anyone on earth to do.....even if you have the greatest folks on earth...b/c that would spoil the R. Problem is that if the H put the W in the position of making a choice between him and her parents, I'm afraid she would chose her parents. Sounds crazy but I think she would. She has had the wedding, the children, and now she has all the services of her parents. Life is sweet.
I blame the parents for all of this. I'll tell you one thing that I made myself a vow and that was if I ever had a DIL that I would never treat her like I was treated. I have the sweetest DIL on earth and I have yet to say one ugly word about her and if my son ever says anything about her I always take up for her. I have never put demands on my son or made him feel that he had to choose between us. If anything, the lessons I learned in the past made me a good MIL when it became my turn....at least I hope so. Maybe I would not have been so good if my MIL had not been such a selfish and would have cut the apron strings.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
In the meantime, make that apartment as homey as you can, make your life as full as you can, and keep up the good work of reflecting upon what you "got" out of the unhealthy dynamic you had, how you contributed to it, and how you wish to change. It's often hard not to get "riled up" about the past, but that's choosing to expend energy on something you can't change, and where neither of you was able to do anything differently because of your life experiences up to that point.
This is good advice. Another thing I would tell you is to never bad mouth his parents.My mistake was trying to get my H to see his mother's scheming way and it just made me look bad and he would feel sorry for her. I guess he thought "she" was the victim! It is so hard not to try to point things out to him, but try not to say anything about them and just smile & wave to them and stay away as much as you can. If you have decided to fight for the M then your best shot is to be as sweet for him as you can and make life fun, romantic, and a bit mysterious (to keep him guessing) and you might check into Light His Fire tapes off of Amazon.
I know how you feel about the sex. It affected me so badly! But if that's what he is M to you for....then hey, use it to your advantage! Make coming home the most exciting part of his day. Maybe he will forget all about checking on Mamma. Mine had to drive straight from work and go spend two hours with mamma before he could go home to his family. Every day until she died. I resented it like you would not believe and told my son that he better never do his wife that way! Did my MIL love her son more than I love mine? H3ll no, but I want mine to have a normal M and be the H & daddy he is instead of a mammay's boy like I got out of the deal.
If I could have seen into a crystal ball to see how our future would have been, I'm not so sure I would have M into the family I did. You need to way your options and see what you can life with or without.....then lay some boudaries.But you better be prepared to back them p.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
My point is being checked out is not permanant, ESP if it's the man who's checked out...if you give him a sense of loss- I can assure you it may be the best way for results.
i hope this is true. h is pretty stubborn and people always say that once he's made up his mind, there's no changing it.
i was afraid that checking out was a permanent thing and that was it. over. done with.
give him a sense of loss? can you share your experience on this and why you think it will yield the best results?
This is good advice. Another thing I would tell you is to never bad mouth his parents.My mistake was trying to get my H to see his mother's scheming way and it just made me look bad and he would feel sorry for her. I guess he thought "she" was the victim! It is so hard not to try to point things out to him, but try not to say anything about them and just smile & wave to them and stay away as much as you can
unfortunately, i've already done that a few times.
Quote:
I know how you feel about the sex. It affected me so badly! But if that's what he is M to you for....then hey, use it to your advantage! Make coming home the most exciting part of his day.
this wouldn't work for me. h has already checked out. our sex life is non-existent now.
great. i'm back to being mad again. what an emotional rollercoaster.
Well, in my case- my EA fell apart- thank God and I suddenly knew what was missing in my M...the day W "checked out"- was the day everything changed...
It may be risky- but like everyone says on these boards...you have to become the WAS- make H the LBS...thats the nature of things...
In my sitch it really can't work...evern if OM wasnt in the picture...W worked 7 days a week and surrounded herslef w/ people I didn't know...
She complained to them constantly of me and told them how selfish I was w/ our budget, and the fact that I would play golf on the weekends while she was working truthfully, all I wanted was for her to take weekends off so we could be together.
My point is that if your H has assassinated your character to MIL and already surrounded himself w/ supports- it may be tricky...BUT- I did that as well...complaining to friends about how disconnected I was from W and how difficult our life was b/c of her business.
AGAIN- when she checked out- told me she was done, started dressing up all the time and going out w/o me...kept quiet and mysterious at home, moved into the other room, switched bathrooms, etc, etc...
I immediately wanted to work everything out...MC, pursuit- I KNEW WHAT I WAS LOSING- I KNEW OUR PROBLEMS WERE MANAGABLE
I guess that's my advice- and the odds are in your favor b/c you're a woman
i'm afraid of becoming the was. my fear is that it will backfire (or h will call my bluff) and make h think that i've moved on and it's okay to see other people now. when really, no! it's not okay to see other people. no! when it does backfire, then what?
i'm quite sure h has assassinated my character to his support team already. at least one friend is taking a neutral stand. this friend is smart enough to know that there are two sides to the story.
i did what your w did. i didn't check out but i gal. it sounds like your w started db-ing. dressing up, going out, being mysterious, moved into the other room, etc. i did all of those things too. so far, the response from h has been lukewarm.
i really need some ideas on how to create that sense of loss in him.
it doesn't feel like i have the advantage b/c i'm a woman. h is hell bent on d. i feel like i'm running up against a brick wall.
what do you do when h is trying to block all your attempts to db?
