Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Infidelity/Extramarital Affairs/Jealousy Are you getting good marital advice?

What I find interesting is the diversity of opinions. If I were to discuss this on the MLC forums about a spouse who is having a midlife crisis -- that includes MLCers who are in EAs or PAs -- they would be giving almost the exact opposite advice.

* Be patient; a person in an MLC can take years to come out of it
* Do research on MLCs and how people behave so you know how to handle the mood swings and behavior
* Do not put any pressure on them, give them their space

What I think Lotus means about "free advice being worth what you pay for it" is that most everyone who posts on these forums are psuedonymous. You know exactly what I choose to tell you about my life, my situation, and my experiences and knowledge.

I want to see people restore their marriages. I also believe in erring on the side of compassion and understanding when it comes to handling a wayward spouse. WAS's and cheaters are certainly capable of lies and manipulation, but it's not hard to put a bad light on throwing their stuff out on the front lawn, changing the locks, etc. You have to live with the consequences of your decisions; not me, not Lotus, not AllenA, not anyone else on these forums.

(Speaking on changing locks and the like: every state has different laws regarding things like recording conversations, snooping in email, changing locks on jointly owned property, etc. Just because I can record a phone conversation legally in Oregon as long as one party knows that it is happening does not mean that it is legal to do so in your jurisdiction. You could land yourself in serious hot water if you don't do your own research or consult your own attorney. Which brings us back to caveat emptor.)

I don't have my copy of The Divorce Remedy handy, but the general advice that she gives regarding infidelity is to outshine the OP. What needs are the wayward spouse getting from the OP that they're not getting from you?

The only problem with that is you cannot pursue your WAS when they are in the midst of the A. It does not work in most cases. You should be aware of what qualities have attracted your S to the OP and be prepared to shine when the time is right.

In the MLC section MWD also suggests you allow your partner to experiment with other women.

I am sorry but I just found that part offensive.

I love the text, but some things in it just don't work for affairs...

I don't doubt she has dealt with infidelity in her line of work, but its not her specialty...

There are family therapits out there who have specifically researched this subject and offer a LOT of GOOD advice and have the statistics to prove their claims...

Shirley Glass has over twenty years of research to back up her book Not Just Friends... an excellent book specifically written on the subject of infidelity. The only weak area of that text is its limited treatment on how to combat the infidelity. She discusses at length how it happens and how to handle the aftermath and reconcilliation, but she doens't do much to address spouses who refuse to end their affair after the intervention phase.

This seems to be the large part of the content of many of the threads on the infidelity forum is AFTER the confrontation and before reconcilliation.

Michele only offers as was mentioned a small bite of info.. putting spyware on the PC, etc but certainly an entire book can and has been written on the topic. Penny Tuppy and one of her mentors - Harley - have written extensively about combatting affairs in the household.

Outshinging an opponent doesn't work all that well in practice from what I am reading here... in most cases the abandoned souse is fortunate if their wayward spouse even glances at them once or twice a week.

Affairs are addictions, and should be dealt with that way. Most addictions are dealt with throgh confrontation, exposure, intervention, and ultimately protection if they refuse to end their destructive behaviuor.

This is very much contrary to MWD's small piece on infidelity. Indeed MWD has not commented on infidelity as an addiction at all. She may not even consider it to BE an addictiion at all.

There are many FT's who DO, which is counter to MWD's apparent thoughts on the subject.

This is the key point in this whole thread of import - there ARE other ways to combat an affair othr than MWD and the DR process - are those alternate ways of combatting affairs welcome in this forum?

Given Michele advocates the "Do What Works" and the 180.. these imply researching anything that may end the affair and bring your spouse back home.

To refuse outside research on the subject would be counter to the MWD method in fact. MWD at one point in MWD does point out "read as much as you can on the subject"

I think that's more or less what is being done here.. sharing findings and helping visitors apply them.

I don't know, Lotus. Allen's posts are not the ones that lately I find to be argumentative and insulting. I thought it was actually a pretty civil, and certainly THOROUGH, point-by-point response to your ad hominem attack. You must have a different definition of "browbeating" than I do.

I love MWD's teachings. Her Sex-Starved Marriage saved my sanity, and eventually, my marriage. And for that I am forever in her debt, and since she is our gracious hostess here, out of respect for her I try to avoid any out-and-out disagreements with her approach. Her approach to infidelity is, however and in my opinion, not in line with the best consensus research that is out there. While one can certainly incorporate "GAL," "180s" "Act As If" and the like into an overall infidelity-busting philosophy, they will not be effective unless the affair itself is attacked as the ADDICTION that it is, and the ATTACK ON THE FAMILY that it most certainly is.

I base my advice on the teaching of Michele Weiner-Davis, Harley, Glass, Eggerichs, Smalley and John Gray, mostly. Plus my four years' worth of experience studying literally thousands of affairs, approaches taken, and what works and what doesn't. No, I don't charge for it, but I'd like to think it has some value, and I think a lot of folks here would say that it did, for them. At least I hope so.

For the record, I practice what I preach, we busted my wife's affair inside of 3 months, and we've been married for 25 years next month, and are currently enjoying the birth of our first grandchild. My wife not only ended her affair very quickly, but she THANKED me for taking a strong stance, and fighting for her and for our marriage, and she said "I was pissed, sure, but I really RESPECTED you for it."

Her words, not mine.

Puppy

To use your method, Allen,



You are misinterpreting. When I said I meant that I would assume that the un-named posters I was referring to, must have tried their own methods at home. Did the methods work for them? If the methods are so good that others should use them, wouldn't they work for the person making the recommendation?

I was not saying that I am superior or more knowledgeable than others. I was just saying that I have tried my own method and found it to useful. That is the reason that I recommend my approach to marital rebuilding, which I will call the "catch more flies with honey" approach.



My advice is not based on nothing. If you had read my posts, you would know that I follow the teachings of the Retrouvaille program. The program is not based on theory, psychology, or books. It is a program developed and led by people who have figured out a method that works, and they help couples by leading them through a process that has worked for thousands of people around the world. Though I am not a trained leader, I have been through the program just as many other people on this board have. The program is led by people who have been through times of trouble and have solved their problems without the theories that you are so fond of.

As for my advice to weigh carefully any advice given before using it because the individual will live with the consequences. I stand by that advice. I have seen posts where you have advocated that one spouse take the children away without telling the other spouse where, throw the spouses things out on the lawn, change the locks on a jointly owned home, and other similarly illegal things that could cause trouble in the long run. Good advice should first do no harm. Before people rush off and take advice that could land them in hot water, they should take the time to think things through.

But Allens point is also that the WS is addicted...these are not just troubled M's, they are troubled M's w/ a 3rd party involved...either covertly or out in the wide open...

Remember there was a post not too long ago comparing an A in a M to a tree falling through a house- you cannot rebuild the hhouse w/ the tree still lodged w/in it...you need to remove the tree first.

This is apples and oranges

Jasper, that's the thing. In my own case, I confronted and I told the children (who were old enough to have relationships of their own). My method for removing the offensive tree through the roof was to allow my S22 to call OW and speak his mind. She faded into the background quickly after that. But I don't advocate continuing to punish the spouse after the affair-ectomy.

Yet in your marriage you have withheld Trust. And rebuilt upon silence. Do the children know only of your husbands affair ? Or do they know both ?

My children know of both. They knew about mine first.