JTB-I believe you are correct on that. Smugness or pride is not good. Coming to terms with reality is, but being kind and not condescending.
The fishing trip was not the chiller I had hoped. Weather really messed up the success, and we came home 2 days early.
I had left my car at a repair facility with a list of items to work on and asked them to start last Monday, so it would for sure be ready. They did not start on it till friday and discovered the clutch was bad, and at 4pm on Friday afternoon there was no clutch to be found in town. This was in Phx, 200 miles away from my house mind you. I got a ride to my folks house where I spent the night.
That evening my W calls to let me know she is also in the Phx area helping our daughter, and I asked her if I could get a ride back up home. She mentioned that she was planning on staying through Monday to get in on some shopping sales and I told her that would be ok with me.
As I knew it would, she changed her mind about staying with me that long and mentioned she'd just go home that Sat, if I still wanted to go, which I replied that would be fine, cuz 200 miles was further then I could walk in one weekend anyway.
We had a pleasent enough drive home, although I was fighting the urge to jump out of the car and hitchike. Despite my determination to not get her anything for valentines day, we stopped halfway home for her to use the restroom, and there were some flowers and other Vday items, so I bought her some. I did NOT want her to think I was upset in any way that she had thrown out an invite to spend 2 days with just her & I and then retracted it (although there was steam coming out my ears) I played it cool, laughing and singing all the way home. Of course I would have jumped at the chance to spend a few days alone, but I could not have her thinking she would not get anything for Vday because we did did not do that. I kept the power and my sanity by not showing any anger during this experience.
She helps me bring things into the house as we arrive home, and then just stands here and asks the dog if they should go home or stay here with me. I told her she was welcome to stay if she wanted, and we moved into the bedroom. Then it hit me-I could not do this anymore. At least not without some groundrules/boundaries.
I let her know that there was nothing more I wanted then- to be intimate with her that evening, but this part time M was not working for her, for me or for us and our M. I wanted it different, and did not want her going to bed with me because she felt it was the payback for withdrawing her former offer, or for the flowers or anything else. I wanted it to be because she wanted to 100%, so there were no regrets from either of us, and most importantly, it was time to move forward in life, for both our sakes. She nodded to a few of the comments, balked at some and started the speech of how she had tried on the last go around, but it just didn't work. I acknowledged she had done alot. I also acknowledged that always going back to past failures in the marriage was perhaps not the best way to judge what needed to be done in the present. I again reiterated that I would like to invite her to work on the M, but it was her choice but the way it is right now is not going to work for us, and it was time to move it forward, rather them being stuck and making no progress in life.
She thought about it for a few minutes, and them said she was going home to get her things, as she was all out of clean clothes, and she'd be back. I knew what that meant, and she never returned.
At least I now feel like my responding to her filing will not be a blindside to her. I calmly and nicely laid out my feelings, and what was not working and let her make her choice, even though she (as usual) did not have the courtesy or strength to tell me to my face what she was going to do. I see that as no integrity or honesty, let alone the open communication she claims she so desperately wants/needs.
I will be responding to her filing, and get clarification from the court on whether they go back to her or where. She filed it as her own attorney. I'm hoping it can be friendly, but I will also let her know she has a month to secure a forwarding address and to move her vehicle and health insurance into her name, along with making provisions to take care of her cell phone and other bills. She mentioned that hopefully March 7 she is switched to full time at her work and gets benefits, including health insurance.
I do have a question for those in the know-Right now our small const biz has almost been nonexistant for the last year, and not very profitable the year before that, although very profitable for the 5 years previous. How do the courts look at this situation where she has worked the last 3 years, and for the last 6 months has made almost as much $ as me, along with not much prospect out there for the const end of things in the forseeable future? I don't see an issue with splitting most of the assets 50/50, but I also have our 27 yr old son who with his mental illness may never be able to hold down a job, and I will have to continue to take care of him? Just curious on what I am in for there?
Although this experience was a continued part of the train wreck of our M, it was neither suprising, or a complete melt down for me. In fact it continued to give clarity on what must be done. Thanks all!
No 10lb bass, but several a little over 5lbs. Hey-it wasn't all bad.
Just read this thread I am new here but desperately need to talk to you and any of your wise friends here. You can read my story in newcomers "New and here's the Sitch" topic. I don't know how to cut and paste the link here yet.
My W has PTSD from child sexual abuse. Only know that it involved her sister and started at a very young age. Sister definitely has deep problems is Borderline which makes me think she was most likely abused too by whom I do not know and probably never will oh "THE SOUND AND THE FURY."! I am separated and W is in a PA which started before I left in Dec 09. I am suspect of a lot of the situations she has relayed to me and some stuff her friend has told me that she has done. Her friend was at the time and is a very serious alcoholic and is now in rehab so I don't know who to believe my wife denies it all. It is 2nd M for both of us and no kids. She has a problem with alcohol too.
She is 38 and up until recently was a model and very successful but since we have been married is just a mess. No more modeling because of her age. She has gotten a DUI and has been arrested for battery at a night club all since we been married the past 2.5 years.
I am like you in that I don't choose the easy road. My integrity won't allow it which is why Im here trying to get my marriage back on track.
I need help!!!! I don't know what to do she is seeing a dr. and on medication but Im afraid there has been no progress that I can tell and she may have borderline personality disorder not just PTSD. We want to have kids but Im reading your story and its me in 2 years? 5 years? 10 years? I don't know its a ticking time bomb.
What can I do? The posts are right this is not simple DB stuff. She has a disease and I can't help her. I am so sad. I went dark yesterday bc she is still having the A but she calls me when she feels depressed. Can't have it anymore she's eating cake.
Please help.
Truegritter
My goal is to some day be the person my dog thinks I am
In my mind there is no stronger way for a man to express his feelings than turning down intimacy. For you I think it was a boundary well set.
On the divorce issues....no help here. I would talk with your lawyer....it might even be that she pays you support, but with your son being 27 things are a little different.
TG-I will look at your sitch and see what insight I can give you. I have found that sexual abuse in adolescents changes everything-especially if they do not get professional help. It ties your hands in so many ways. True unconditional love seems to be the answer, but that is sometimes misunderstood.
God gives us unconditional love, which at times is putting someone or something in our path to help us, AFTER we have done all we can do. problem is, HE knows when that is and what is really best for us, but he leaves us our agency to choose what path to follow.
Our challenge is that we don't understand like HE does, and sometimes we get in the way of progress by doing too much for the person we wish to help, which slows their growth. There are times that with where they are at mentally, they may have indeed done all they can, or know how to do (we fit in that boat also). Trying to figure out when and how to be involved with helping them is the tough part, and then knowing when you have to save YOU, regardless if they continue to make bad decisions.
As they say-"There is no easy way!". I've decided that for me to be ok with the guy in the mirror when the smoke all clears, I'll error on the side of mercy, and not justice. That's what I'd like for me when I meet my maker. At the same time, just like God, letting them make their mistakes and figuring it out is really unconditional love too. Just like God does with each of us, and the way we do with our kids if we are wise. There does come a time each of us is accountable for our choices. I'm still trying to make good ones, and the right ones in all of this. We all might screw it up on some days and other days we do it just right. I'm right there myself, just still trying to figure out what the "best" thing for me to do each day is in the situation I'm in. I've found that some days it is different. Staying close to God helps me figure it out better at times.
Doing just the opposite of what you think you should do some days is right, and other days it might not be. If you find yourself in a funk (don't we all) you may just need to completely pull back and take care of you the way it's described on these boards.
Good luck to each of us that are struggling to know what might make a difference. For me it seems that when I do the things that help me deal with life on a more clear consistent basis, I am doing something right. Hope that helps.
I understand. I struggle with the unconditional love thing too. But I keep this little piece of wisdom that I have found along the way.
This is from "Conversations with God"
"It is not in the action of another, but in your re-action that your salvation will be found ...
In all human relationships there is only one question... WHAT WOULD LOVE DO NOW?
No other question is relevent, no other question has any importance to your soul...
What you do for yourself you do for another for to do "what is right" by the other-to be quick to forgive, to show compassion, to continually look past certain problems and behaviors- you become resentful, angry, and mistrusting, even of God."
Obviously I have been coming back to this for guidance with my sitch but it is a daily struggle.
It almost kind of points to the advice they give to people involved with Alcoholics- to detach. You have to take care of yourself and only they can help themselves. We are dealing with addictions here. They are addicted to dealing with life with all the pain, chaos and dysfunction. My W uses alcohol. And now a relationship as her drugs. They are just avoiding and denying.
Unless I see some true commitment to heal and stop the self destruction I'm going to remain detached (not actually detached yet but working on that.)
Gritter
My goal is to some day be the person my dog thinks I am
TG-I think at some point you HAVE to detach to keep your sanity. When you find yourself going into a state of depression that keeps you from functioning somewhat normally, or you seem frozen from making a decision, that is when you have to realize you cannot help anyone unless you take proper care of yourself.
You will struggle with detaching, as many of us do. When you find that you are better able to handle the other parts of life better, you begin to realize that it is helping. You can stand back and make a more informed and better choice about the things going on around you. It will become a necessity to cope with life.
As far as what I consider unconditional love? My feelings come from my religion and study of the Saviors life. He loved people unconditionally no matter what they looked like, what they had, or even what they did. But he did NOT give them a free pass for bad choices. He understood that all of us have the agency to choose, it's what determines if we will get closer or further from God.
And since he knows the beginning from the end, unlike us, he gives a law with the expectation that we will do our best to keep it. If not, there is a consequence for not keeping that law. It may take a long time, but sooner or later we will have the consequence. Many of us (myself included) rationalize that we love our spouse so much we want to save them from their bad choice, when in reality they are the only ones who can do such. Even the Savior tells us his grace is sufficient AFTER all that we can DO.
Talking about it is good, but it's not the same as actually DOING it. Best of intentions get us nowhere, it's in the DOING that makes the difference.
At the same time, I believe we are judged against OUR capabilities. Not our neighbors, just our own, and that it will be fair. I am tempted at times to judge my wife (and in some instances we do have to make a judgment call about how we fit in and what we do) but judging her actions is something best left to God who knows her capabilities, where I may not. That's why most all of the DBing techniques are about us, and for us. We truly are the only ones we can change. We can influence others for good or bad, but ultimately, we are in charge of ourselves and need to spend most of the time we'd like to use to change our spouse, into bettering and changing ourselves.
I'm not sure that answered anything and isn't just a lot of rambling from a guy with 33 years of marriage under his belt, 6 kids and 13 grandkids, but through all of this unpleasentness and turmoil, that may sum up what I've learned so far in almost 55 years.
Helped my wife load up the trailer in her move back down to Phx 200 miles away. As hard as it might be, I think it may help move things forward. I wish her well in her journey to find herself and what she really wants. For her to be in this R w/o being willing to fight for it or really want it is a disservice to her and to me, so that will need to change.
I was not able to go with her as I spent the day with my sis and one brother who brought my Dad up to visit his old homestead and one of his remaining brothers. He is slipping away fast, and it hit me last night that we will never be able in this life to share another fishing or hunting trip together.
I also have realized that in the next few months I will need to relocate to facilitate employment as I put my business on the shelve and return to being an employee. I got halfway through an employment interview at Walmart a week ago, until they offered me $8.20 an hour. It's been over 30 years since I've been at that level. $200,000 a year just 3 years ago. Even with a job every other month, and having it take only 10 hours a week from me for a few weeks, I would make triple that. Ouch!
I'm guessing in the next 3-4 months things will peak in the "life's tough" catagory as I relocate, deal with how I'm going to help my mentally ill son move forward, watch my Dad go downhill and see my wife probably make some more poor choices before she makes good ones. I hear the bones in my back straining now under the load. I guess I'll just have to buck up!
