Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Midlife Crisis My Wifes MLC

Steve,
I am wondering...whereabouts are you? No need to get too specific, I'm just wondering because you and I seem to post around the same time of day, but it's actually the middle of the night where I am (I have sleep issues, long story), and usually the only other people posting at this time of day are in England/Europe or Australia!

So, to address your comments:

Again, don't press the issue of marital counseling. It can be incredibly counterproductive when the WAS is in MLC, for a variety of reasons. Get counseling for yourself, though, but make sure the C is right for your needs.


MLCers lie, even to themselves. You are also discovering that they have a little trick that we call "revising history," which means that they only remember the bad stuff about your life together, and even manage somehow to remember good stuff as bad, or somehow totally discount it in their mind. Thus, everything for years and years was ALL bad...so why wouldn't they want out?! Don't bother to argue with her about this; you will just make her mad and push her farther away because she will become even more convinced that her view is the way it really was and you are all wrong about it. Don't let her bait you into trying to defend yourself or what you had together that was good.

Listen and validate.

Listen and validate.

Listen and validate.

Understand? Do not bring up R. Do not confront, argue, counter-accuse, get mad, or do anything other than stay calm and neutral. If you can't do that, politely excuse yourself and get away from her to somewhere you can safely express your emotions in a healthy way.

I do want to clarify that if you feel that she has a legitimate complaint or two about you, buried in the garbage she will be spewing, you need to acknowledge it without being defensive, apologize honestly, and do what you can to repair it. It's tough, but you have to own the part you played in the breakdown of the M/R, even if you feel that your spouse did a lot more to trash the M than you did. Acknowledge where you went wrong. Fix what you can. Avoid any "Well, what about what YOU did?" type of comments; this will not help your cause in the least.

Remember that you should only make changes in yourself if you feel that they are changes you want to keep up for the rest of your life, regardless of whether she even notices. And don't TELL her you are changing...SHOW her. And stick with it, even though it may take a very long time for her to believe it is real. This is why it is so important to make sure the changes you make are things that you can keep up forever.


Of course it is upsetting, and you have every right to be upset at the total violation, but unfortunately this is something you are going to have to learn to live with for now. See above for discussion of "MLCers lie, even to themselves."

Don't waste your time worrying about what other people are going to think. The truth will come out sooner or later, I guarantee it, regardless of how hard the MLCer tries to torch the reputation of the LBS. If you are living YOUR highest truth, that is all you need to do. Never lie about this, but it is very important to talk to other people about it as little as possible, except for professionals (therapists, ministers, etc.) and _maybe_ one friend you can trust. It will come back to bite you later if you talk about it beyond that.

I hate to tell you this, but it WILL get worse. Those who have no experience with MLC think it's a joke (I know I did), but actually there are jokes about it because it is too horrible to deal with head-on in public.

Remember, this is a marathon, not a sprint, and you are only in the first mile or two. Just when you think they can't get any crazier...somehow they do. The good news is that if you trust that we know what we are talking about, you can prepare yourself for when it happens, so that your boat just rocks but doesn't tip over.

It is truly a waking nightmare, to deal with the aliens that they become. We talk about the Mother Ship loading up on MLCer brains every day. They operate like animals that have had their brains disconnected sometimes when they are in MLC, although sometimes you will see a glimpse of the person they were before. But don't be thrown off balance by those little flashes of sanity. Many people compare it to Jekyll and Hyde, although some MLCers seem to have killed off Jekyll and are all Hyde.

Take care of yourself and your kids. Work on yourself. Let her spin, and try to detach from it as best you can.

Peace,
Dawn

Even after all that, I forgot to respond to this earlier post.
Keep reading. Everything we have told you to read. It will help.


If you really want the best advice on how to handle this, then RUN, do not walk, to make arrangements for at LEAST one DB coaching session. I guarantee that afterward you will believe it is some of the best money you have ever spent. It will transform how your confidence levels and you feel about the situation like you wouldn't believe (and no, they don't pay me for endorsements!).


Welcome to the wonderful world of MLC, where reality becomes whatever the MLCer decides it is today, and the MLCer is the most important person ever born. All you can do here is to accept the sitch detach to the best of your ability, and plan for damage control. There is unfortunately nothing you can do to prevent any of this, although there are a few things you can do to minimize the fallout, such as with your kids.


Only you can decide these things for your own sitch. For me, the question is, "Did I mean it when I spoke those words...'for better or for worse...until death do us part'?" I say, "Yes...and I am bound to keep my given word." My faith tells me to not give up on my M as long as we are both alive. My faith also says that M is not a contract that a piece of paper can nullify...it is a covenant, blessed and sealed by God, and cannot be broken by either party's failure to carry out the promises of that covenant. There are many of us here like that. But I understand that not everyone has that same take on their M.

You aren't likely to find anyone on here who will tell you that it is time to thow in the towel; that's not why we are all here. Some people give up after a month of DBing. I know of one who has been at it for 7 years and is separated but still not D'd. There are always newbies, but most of us have been at this a few years. It's that marathon thing again.

Good on the taking care of yourself and your kids, and letting your W walk her own path. Good on learning from your mistakes. But I personally believe that if you are going to have a chance of M restoration, you have to totally commit yourself to your M. This doesn't mean that you focus all of your energy on your W--no, you still try to detach, and work on yourself, and all the rest of it--but you know in your heart that you are committed to finishing what you started when you got M. You are not indecisive about it; you have made your decision. Please keep in mind that this "totally committed" bit is my own opinion, and others here may disagree, and may even feel that it is contradictory to strategies like detaching and letting go. I don't think it is contradictory, but it is only my opinion, not necessarily DB-stamped teaching.


Good.


The first sentence is very true. I would guess that there is no one on these boards who hasn't spent more time in Hades than they thought they could live through.

The second...not so much. I don't believe you can avoid pain by being wishy-washy about your cmmitment, or by giving up. If you do either of those, then you have to wonder, and feel guilty, about whether you truly did everything in your power to restore M, and that has to make the hurt even worse, I suspect.


She cannot be stable and healthy right now. She _should_, we all know, but she _can't_. Would you give up on her if she got Alzheimers and treated you horribly? (I saw this happen with my in-laws, so it is not unheard of.) I don't know if MLC really is an illness or not, and it doesn't absolve her of her hurtful actions, but sometimes it helps to think of it as a mental illness.


Again, only you can make this choice. Just please remember that this decision is going to ripple down the years of the rest of your life, and echo to your children and their children, and radiate out into your extended family and friends. Don't act out of emotion. Act only from a place of calm and conviction and centered-ness.

Good grief, I must be tired, I'm missing proofreading errors! Must..rest...it's 5:30 a.m. and I've been awake all night.

Peace,
Dawn

Dawn - your help is greatly appreciated and your words are very wise.

I'm still struggling dealing with her atm - she is best described as an alien. This is the mother of my children and I do not know her.

We just had my daughters birthday party and she was good but then she said she is going out Thursday, Friday, Saturday nights but will be home to get ready for my daughters extended family party on Sunday.

She is now in her room doing the funny voice, laugh and good old "pet-pet" comments.

She says she wants a seperation which I think is a good idea - I'd like her to leave but she won't.

I'm really thinking all posters on here that keep putting up with this are amazing.

Someone wrote you feel like a doormat at times and thats how I feel. I mean what sane person puts up with what is going on and I bet it gets worse.

As for not talking to anyone I find that very hard. Its like I need to let it out.

She cannot be sane and I know what you are saying about being committed to marriage but my wife is not there atm.

Anyway got to go because she wants the computer. If I argue it just makes it worse (I think).

Read some more...I mean really read and understand this. This is something that you have NEVER experienced before. If you were starting a big project around the house....would you just jump in and make your decisions on the fly ? Or would you read about it and study it, and then have a plan BEFORE you start ?




I'm glad YOU know that, unfortunatly, that doesn't mean much right now....

Other than the children ARE NOT pawns in this.....YOU are the rational parent right now....PROTECT THEM !!!!




Don't think, even though it does hurt, that any of us would trade the lessons that we have learned for anything....




So you thought you were getting the RATIONAL MLC'er ?

Surprise !!!!!



Your decision....Not everyone is capable of being able to Cowboy Up and stay on this horse....

I just find it strange that in one paragraph you say you are Pro-Marriage, then in another, you are ready to just pack up and walk away..

I guess your vows were for better and pull the handle in the case of a MLC....

Not tryin to be difficult, I just want you to understand what you are dealing with before you pull the ripcord.

Let me ask you this....MLC is an inbalance of sorts....And it is easier to view it as an illness....

If your wife had cancer, would you love her through it ?

If she was disfigured in an accident, would you bail then ?

I'm thinkin no .....

Can you handle this ? Can you look in the mirror and accept that you have things to change and work on too ?

If you can't ? Then Good luck

If you can ?

There are some amazing people here, Most who have extended their hands to you already.....

understand YOUR plight before you decide.....

Steve, let me just say this - the confusion you are feeling is normal. The ups and downs and everything in between - all normal.

So, the first thing you have to decide is if you want to try to save your marriage. Only YOU can make that decision. And I assume that since you came to this site that you want to.

If I am wrong, let me know and we will still help you get through it, if you want us to.

Ok, so, your wife is going through a crisis. Doesnt excuse her actions, doesnt invalidate your feelings, its just what it is.

So, with you accepting that, you have to start to take the steps you need to get through this.

And they start with you. You have to step back and let her be. She needs to get through this in her own time, in her own way.

What you need to do is begin to look at the changes you need to make for you. And there are changes you to need to make.

Start by really looking at your marriage with a clear mind. I am sure there are things about it that you wish were different. What changes could you make that would help that?

See, dbing is about us. It's about us becoming the best person we can and sometimes, it saves marriages.

But I can promise you that if you take this journey, you will learn things about yourself that can change your life.

The people who have been to your thread are some of the wisest, kindest, most genuine people you will ever get to know.

And please know that they have the purest intent and that is to help.

So, what do YOU want to do? If its give this a try, then roll up your shirtsleeves and let's dig in.

Steve: I am on the Walk away Spouse page. Probably should have posted over here. Your situtation is exactly like mine. It was three months ago.

-Wife came home and didn't want to be married anymore.
-On facebook, reconnected with her old crew from her premarriage days. Going out all the time with them. Getting less frequent lately.
-Stopped wanting to go to Marriage counseling after 3 sessions
-Blames me for everything that has gone on in marriage.
-Mainly I was controlling. She wants to make her own decisions.
-I did everything you are not supposed to do in the last 3 months. Wrote prolific letters, tried to talk about relationship. Use the kids as guilt levers. Got family involved. Nothing has worked.
-I threw my changes in her face. Told her I am doing all the changing, she hasn't done anything but get a tattoo.
-Lost 10 pounds. Am 5'9, 150.(was 160lbs). I can't lose much more.
-Her family thinks she is crazy, her friends think she is crazy, my family thinks she is crazy.
-Nothing I have said or done has worked.
-So--After 3 months
--I workout every morning, I joined a boxing class also.
--I started cooking
--I bought some new casual clothes to go out in.
--I bought cologne--1st time in 15 years
--I have been going out more, doing more with the kids
--Always looking my best at home.

I do feel better about myself. I am only going on day 4 since my last relationship discussion. Where she proceeded to say she still wants a divorce. The next day she told me she didn't regret what she said, but she fired her therapist because she is leading her towards divorce. Then she invited me to a fundraiser for our anniversary on 8-27. She hasn't filed. I am not filing. I plan on giving it a year. It has only been 3 months. I am still hopeful that she will wake up one day and figure it out. For every story I hear where it hasn't worked out, I hear one that did. On this site, you see alot of people like me and you. Not many success stories. Why, I feel they have moved on. This is for people like us to talk through their issues. I have every hope that this will work out. As crazy and mean as my wife is, I still love her. We have been married 15 years. I have to give this every opportunity to work for us and our kids. Don't want to go through life saying what if.

-You will get your appettite back. You will sleep again. I actually had horrible insomina the year leading up to this. I firmly believe that I knew something was wrong the last year which is why I had the sleep issues. I kept wanting to kick it to be the person she wanted me to be. It just kept getting worse. Since this has happened, I haven't had insomnia. I still take a little ambien at night, but the real key is that I do sleep on the couch more. I get up in middle of night and go upstairs mostly. But I don't have to lay next to her before I go to sleep. Your mind will just whip up into a frenzy and you wont sleep.

Some days are good, some are real bad. Find a few friends you can talk to. I do go to therapy. I am also one session into a three session DB coaching session. I have read everybook on an MLC.

If you think there is value in your marriage, just keep telling yourself it is not how hard you hit, it is about when you keep getting knocked down and you are able to get up and keeping going. This process is week by week, day by day, hour by hour. Good luck and hang in there.

Good for you d1. That is exactly the right mindset to have going into this.

I just want to say thank you for everyones comments. This is the most horrendous time in my life and I admit I am having trouble dealing with it.

Its good hearing from d1 that his situation is very similiar to mine. I hate to hear anyone going through this but at least I can see that I'm not the only one. Also their behaivours appear remarkably similiar - it is in a way funny.

She has used the controlling line on me - like letting her control the finances even though I earn twice her income, letting her work full-time, letting her socialise with her friends & family over the course of the marriage. She wanted kids early and I said no worries. Letting her do whatever she wants basically. I think her idea of controlling is if we discuss anything she has to get her way completely.

I also feel I should try and get this to work even if the situation appears unrepairable.

As per everyones comments I think the best thing I can do is just accept the situation. Fighting it won't work.

I also like the idea about working on yourself. In a way that is what my wife is trying to do (unless she gets diagnosed with a mental illness which wouldn't surprise me).

I have counselling coming up in a week or two. It will be interesting what happens then & what the counsellor thinks. I know that I need some professional help for myself.

Dawn - I am in Australia. I think your idea of detaching is a real good one.

I am going to try and get the marriage to work however if it doesn't and I have to accept that I cannot control this how do you move on ? Are their classes / courses ? In the course of living your life when do you open up to the opportunity of choosing another partner ?

I think that the best way for me to deal with this is to look for what is next - this may help me get through the whole thing plus maybe my wife will come to her senses while I am working on myself and letting her go.

As a side point has everyone who has been through this feel they improved on themselves. I personally feel like this is going to change me significantly - even though it is hell I hope I can grow as a person.

Hi Steve - absolutely there are classes and courses. In the major capital cities and regional centres Relationships Australia have counselling for individuals and couples and they run courses on Surviving Separation and Divorce. I did one of their courses in Canberra a couple of years ago and it was fantastic. It was also a good way to meet others going through similar stuff.

There are also programs run by non-government organisations and churches on dealing with separation and marriage issues. I believe some of those are quite good too.

There was an Australian girl from Cairns who used to post here and she did some DB telephone counselling that she thought was A1 - so that's an option for you too.



My friend - you will be a different man on the other side of this - no matter the outcome. You make the decision as to if you'll be bitter and twisted or stronger and more resilient. You have the power to make that choice and it looks like to me you've already chosen.

This is a really tough time for you and as Mach said earlier sometimes it will feel like a rollercoaster - but it is also an opportunity for you to grow through the pain and be the man you respect and admire - the man you want to be ...