I think I could have handled it. Which reminds me, all this crazy talk brings to mind reverse babble and the mlc'er. Where is that old post? Is it on another site?
I'm so gonna try that now that I have nothing to lose.
Ok, I'll probably be sorry I asked, but.....
What IS "reverse babble"?
PATIENCE AND FORTITUDE CONQUER ALL THINGS. -Ralph Waldo Emerson
DBing and MLC take their toll....Please provide exact CHANGE. -Jimbo
We all know that MLCers "babble". Sometimes we try to challenge the babble, or try to prove the babble wrong, or whatever. This woman, Orchid (who could well have been separated from you at birth, Phoenix!) suggests countering the babble with what she calls "reverse babble".
Reverse Babble (RB) is to be undertaken ONLY when you feel detached and sure of yourself, and will not be emotional about it. This is NOT a tangle or an argument. Do not appear sarcastic. You want to appear as though you're listening, and... confuse them as much as they confuse you! The following is all in Orchid's own words, taken from several posts, so apologies if the paragraphs don't all logically follow each other. Some concrete samples of RB follow - some of them are an absolute hoot!
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"Part of reverse babble is to agree, then present something while the WS may be in a state of confusion or wonderment (shocked or confused at your being agreeable). Get in your point and them exit ASAP. Don't say too much. Sometimes I used to nod yes and say no or visa versa. Sounds silly? Well my H was sooo much in the fog, he would just shake his head and walk away. About 2 hours to 2 weeks later I would get a response.
I learned not to take his babble to heart. Eventually I learned to put back some of his responsibility on him."
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"Bottom line is to use it to make them think. Don't say too much, learn to look and at other times go 'hmmm.....', makes them wonder about you even when you are gone. In my case, it threw the OW into a frenzy of wonderment. I loved it!!! "
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"Remember that these [samples] are JUST SUGGESTIONS. They have to come off as casual and normal as possible. If you have a sarcastic tendancy, you may need to practice so that it comes off as more routine (non-emotional statements than sarcastic)."
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"Your H is bent on saying things to hurt you. Realize this and then prepare to respond in ways to show that you are not as hurt as you may initially feel. Eventually those hurtful statements will stop or you will become strong enough to even laugh at them. I did.
As much as possible, do not engage in conversations about the A or R. Don't show interest in it. He may be with an OW that pulls his needs out of his soul in order to fill her needs. He has to say some of these stupid things to convince himself that the OW is better than you. Conversations with him fuel that confidence.
I learned to stop telling the WS that I loved him as much during these times. I showed my hurt but I also reduced the A talk. Eventually even thinking about their antics made me laugh a few times I even laughed in his face. Just couldn't help it. It was a combination nervous laugh coupled with just plain silly laugh. It was also a stress reliever.
Remember these are JUST SUGGESTIONS. You need to make sure you are as casual as possible. Remember your intent is to confuse the A. I even asked the WS (at the time), "which OW is this? oh yea, the old one." LOL!!!"
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"Your H's comments totally ignores the content of your message. See that is why it is a waste of time to try to deal with them logically. R talking is like spitting in the wind. At least for now.
Your H feels he has to fight with you. So remove the war. Work on making yourself more attractive (physically but also emotionally and mentally). The OW has got some type of attraction (even though we dont see it). You on the other hand need to do the same. If not for his benefit at least yours.
So when he writes about not wanting to fight. Agree. I did. See I got that one-liner also (I swear there is a manual or school for all this WS talk!).
ex:
WS: I just do not think I can do this anymore. As much as it hurts me as well, I do not think I have it in me to fight.
BS: Me too. Just can't do this and losing the will to fight.
Then walk away. You just babbled back. No explanation. For a while my H did not want me to fix anything, he just wanted me to listen. Not sure if your H is like that but give it a trial run.
For the H's who are very dependent on the w's but don't want to admit it and may be conflict avoiders themselves, this tool of just listening might work. Build up their deflated self esteem and you use this time to let off some of your 'steam' yourself.
Reverse babbling is not hard.... you just need to NOT think!"
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"I said your H feels that he is at war with you. Not that there was a war but it does take 2 to tangle. So remove yourself from his made up conflict and eventually he will he that the only one fighting is him.
When my Ws used to yetll at me, I put up with it until I had the strength to say, 'hey, you want to fight go do it with the mirror or your special friend (OW). I no longer have the strength nor the desire to fight with you. Gave that speech about a 1/2 dozen times. He had a hard time with that one but I didn't.
Conflict avoiders have a bigger problem since their worst enemy is themselves. While I love myH and we were suppose to be one, I felt his pain but I was not privy to the cause. RE: I did not know everything he and the OW knew!!!! My disadvantage.... but I learned how to turn it around and eventually I was able to have the frame of mind to keep moving forward as their A kept losing ground. Haven't stopped yet."
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"If it is a choice between an angry outburst or an RB comment, I chose the later. Sometimes the choice has to be made right away or else I have to bite my tongue (ouch )!!! I watch how much I say. Trust me, I have a lot more to say in my head than I did say to him and the OW. Yet I do not keep it all in. It would not be healthy for me."
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“The point is too keep them off balanced (easier t/d than you think). Short responses and leave them hanging.
Putting doubt in their minds, confuses the WS, this helps the BS keep their balance.”
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And now for some samples!
WS: I need my own space. Reverse babble (RB): Yes you do.
WS: I love you but I am not in love with you. RB: Yes, me too.
WS: You need to move on. RB: Yes I do. Here is a list of what I need: 1. All bills paid 2. New home, new furniture, etc. 3. New car 4. All Ens met for entire family 5. Children's education all paid for 6. Guaranteed alimony for life 7. Guarantee that you will never be difficult to deal with. 8. WS meet with Steve/Jennifer or MC and then show family how WS will keep the family safe from any harm. 9. WS guarantee he/she will be there to support family through good times and bad 10. WS never demand anything other than what the family requests. 11. WS not put demands on family or stress them out in any way shape or form.
WS: Go get the D. I don't want to be married to you anymore. RB: Me too. Go get the D.
WS: Why won't you talk to me? (I was in plan B ). Don't you love me? RB: Hm.... I don't know. Let me get back to you on that.
WS: Where is all the $$ I gave you? RB: I don't know.
WS: Do you want me to come back? RB: I don't know.
WS: You are so fat, if you lose weight I will come home. RB: I do have some weight to lose but when I do, I am not sure if I would still want you to come home.
WS: Be a real human. RB: I am. I have been wondering about you.
WS: You can’t come over to my house without permission. NOTE: This is not reverse babble this is a challenge. Do NOT respond to this. Just nod.
WS: I can’t trust you. RB: Yes, I can't trust you.
WS: You ruined my life. RB: Yes, you did ruin our lives.
WS: You ruined your life. RB: Yes, you did ruin our lives. NOTE how this is the same response.
WS: Your dad had to get you a job, and you have an MBA. RB: Yes he did and it is a good one. He certainly made a good choice. I'll have to tell him thanks. Thanks for reminding me.
WS: I love you. I don’t know why I love you, I just do. RB: You are right, I don't know why I love you also.
WS: She is just a friend (ow number 2) RB: Wow, with friends like that, why are you out there making enemies? I did give this answer.
WS: I was plan ning on leaving way before the A... RB: Why didn't you?
WS: I told you I was leaving you for a year. RB: Leaving for? or Me or your other W?
WS: I never want to live with you again. RB: Right now, I can see why you would not want to live with caring people anymore.
WS: We can stay married and live apart. RB: Ok, right after you can show me how to sleep in 2 beds in 2 different homes at the same time. Similar incident, I gave the above response.
WS: This is for the good of the kids. RB: You certainly are entitled to your opinion. When the children are older, I will share your words of stupidity with them. It will hurt but you are certainly entitled to your opinion. This one happened to me
WS: Just move on with your life. RB: I am.
WS: You are crazy. RB: ...and you have been a good teacher.
WS: I might go to counseling if you start to act normal. RB: I already have. When is your appointment?
WS: It was never the same with OW as you. RB: I am glad to hear that.
WS: Where did you get those shoes? NOTE: This is NOT babble. Just answer his question. Don't act like he said it with sarcasism.
WS: I can never live in our house again, there are too many bad memories. RB: Good idea. When will you be able to get us another home? This one happened to me.
WS: Don't expect that by coming back to this village that we will get back together it will never happen!) RB: Ok. NOTE: While this may be babble any words said while he is in this state of mind are not comprehended. So don't waste much on him during these times.
WS: I am now in love with OW so get over it RB: Ok. NOTE: While this may be babble any words said while he is in this state of mind are not comprehended. So don't waste much on him during these times.
WS: Do you know how easy you made it for me to leave! RB: Yes you did.
WS: We were just friends but now it's much more than that. RB: Your knack for picking trashy friends is getting better!
WS: What part of “I don't want to be married to you” don't you understand?"
RB: The “when” part. WS: huh? RB: You know, when....when did you not want t/b married to me? (I used the time line on my H went all the way back to the day he proposed.....jerk couldn't give me a date or even a ballpark year, that's when I knew I had him).
WS: I don't want to be with you anymore, I want a divorce. RB: You're right, I don't want to be with you 2. When R U going to get it? WS: What? (remember the WS expects the BS to fight this statement, walk away or hang up while they still look puzzled).
