Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers I feel so lost and so tired

I have come to believe that we wait for feelings to come....we make decisions based on feelings (very important decisions at times) and think too much about feelings. So, for now, I would suggest that you stop worrying about what you feel or don't feel toward your W and just do what you know is the right thing to do in order to try to salvage your M.

When I was wanting to walk out on my M of many years, I honestly thought I would never feel any stronger love for my H than I did a brother. However, it is b/c of all the mess you are put through when in all the pain of the R and trying to make decisions and trying to decide what is best and what you really want b/c you get to the place.....after a while....that you aren't sure about anything. At least, that happens if you are putting too much stock into "feelings".

I hope that you two will go in August and that both of you can make a turn around in your lives. But, even after that trip, it still takes work on part sides. It will always take work if you stay together.

Take care,
Sandi

Well, after I thought I gained and inch just a few days ago, I think I lost it and more today. This flip flopping just kills me.

So after the other day where she agreed to go to Retrouvaille and confirmed that she said we should get a babysitter once/week, I think it's all off again. We met up for lunch today, and then she says that she's been thinking us.

Now I'm wondering what this will be about. And she goes on about how she has tried and tried to get feelings for me again but can't. She has looked at pictures, and tried to remember things, but sees no hope of wanting to have us together again. I say that if she has been trying to rekindle her feelings all by herself, it might be hard that way, and I asked if maybe she'd like to try to go back to MC together. She says no because she decided that she doesn't want to do the work for it anymore. That she did enough work for the marriage before and is done with it now. And would only be going because of guilt of leaving the marriage and because of our son, and doens't want to go for guilt.

So I ask how come she won't go to MC if she agreed to go to Retrouvaille? And now she thinks that going to Retrouvaille would be a bad idea. And that she doesn't think she has any reason to go, and would only be there because I guilted her into it. And also cause she doenst' want Retrouvaille or MC cause it'll just give me false hope.

She said that she has already decided that she does not want a marriage with me because she wouldn't be happy with me. And thinks that she doesn't like my personality, how I talk, we didn't have anything in common, etc, etc. Of course I validate all that though I don't agree or understand some of it. I ask if she always felt I was all of those things from the very beginning. She says yes. Of course in my head, I didn't agree with that cause we were together 5yrs before even getting married for 10, and if I was so bad since the beginning, then why are we married in the first place?

But she is again feeling that we are completely wrong for each other, there is no hope for her being happy in the marriage, and she only wants us to be good parents together and close this chapter of her life and move on. She mentioned that she has been considering moving out again.

And she didn't miss me the 4days I was gone to Vegas. And I say that of course she didn't, she was never alone. Whenever I'm gone, she's at one of her sister's, or she invites them over. So I don't know if she could even have time to miss me ever cause she never seems to let herself be alone.

I may have stumbled a bit in my DBing by trying to convince her to give MC with a different counselor a chance, and giving Retrouvaille a chance, but we were already on the topic anyway so I took a chance and went with it.

But I really feel that from what was said that she really has herself convinced that I was, am, and will be the wrong person for her. And that somewhere along the line, in addition to resenting me about things, she lost respect for me. But yet, she can't tell me what it was that caused this lost of respect.

And since all her friends are supposedly in unhappy marriages, I think it really is having an affect on her. Again she mentions that seems like 'everyone she knows' is not completely happy in their marriage, and so she doesn't want to end up that way. But then of course none of these women are doing anything about their marriages. I just want to tell her to stop hanging out with these women cause they are messing her up in the head...but of course I can't do that.

Sigh...just when I thought I gained some encouragement when I really needed it, it flipflops back again.

Stay Strong my Friend!

I know exactly how you feel. It is really discouraging.

After a month of movement in an encouraging direction, and then another month of backward movement, I just had the same discussion with my W yesterday - no MC, no Retrouvaille, nothing that is going to try to "force the marriage to work at all costs" - she feels it is dead, useless, feels trapped, etc.

I even was gone for part of the weekend and got the same line - "I didn't miss you, and in fact it's easier for me when you are gone"

In my case, I am am positive that it is because she is back with OM at some level.

I'll give you the same advice I am giving myself:
- It is not because of you. She has to deal with this herself
- you can only focus on yourself
- get back to making yourself happy and strong
- let her go - back way way off - if you think you are detached and giving her space, you aren't yet.


I agree completely with the "Sigh" in your last post. I just signed mine that way too...

Take care and good luck

Sounds like we are both in pretty much the same boat.

But it is hard to detach completely since detachment is kinda one of the reasons I am where I am right now. And also since she has mentioned that she thinks we have grown even farther apart in these past few months that I have been trying to DB and detach/give her space. But when she said that I was thinking...'wtf...you were the one asking me for space or a separation, but then when you get space, you say we're growing farther apart and use that as another confirmation that we are wrong for each other?' It really feels like I live in a damned if you do,damned if you don't place right now.

And what also gets me is that she says that she knows one of her faults is that she does not like going back and fixing things regarding relationships. And I'm thinking that if you know its a fault, then I dont' understand why you won't try to change it.

Are people ever worried that in trying to detach, they get to a place where you are really, really detached. A place where you let yourself get over the other person, maybe because it's easier on yourself emotionally? I have to admit, that is one of my fears and something that I think I would regret one day.

Yep, I feel the same way - but realize that it is a mistake. My w said the same things, and I started coming back - and she ran away again almost immediately.

Please remember that you W does not feel the same way she did when she was asking you to be around and pay more attention to her. If she is like mine, right now, any attention from me is actually repulsive.



because if she is like mine, the thought of trying to fix it is inconceivable. In her mind, it can NEVER be fixed.



Yes, absolutely. In fact it happens. I have to admit that the more I detach, the more I start thinking that maybe she is not the one for me. I also start noticing other women more. I fight it off, and am in no way ready to move on, and am not going to start anything myself, but I can see it happening if this goes on for months / years.


Stay strong.

Another question. I did not see it in your sitch, but maybe I forget. Is there an OM in the mix?

There very often is -- hidden and not being discovered until later in the process. If not, I hate to cast doubt in your mind, but, it is always better to know.

Take care and stay strong for yourself.

She says there isn't when I have asked. But I suspect there may have been an emotional affair somewhere in there, though I have no evidence of anything. I just have this feeling from something she said before, but has since denied saying and says I remembered wrong. And of course she used that as an example of how I remember things wrong and twist things around. But I think I remember everything that was said very clearly. But I have no evidence and she denies anything of that sort.

But my IC says from what she has heard of the goings on in my stich from me, she kinda suspects that there is or was someone else.

I wonder if there is a little bit of MLC going on too cause she is going to be 40 this year. She is reevaluating her entire life, and seems that she thinks she made a mistake in the past with getting married to me cause 'she wasn't that in love with me, and it was all due to her past insecurities'. And now she wants a clean slate to start life all over using her 'new found knowledge' of what really makes her happy before it's too late and she is too old to start over.

In my case, I discovered the EA first, and that drove my W to then drop the bomb, etc,

However, my W tried very hard to hide it and continue it - I suspect right up to today. I have found that my sitch seems to ebb and flow with the R with the OM. The more she is thinking about the OM, the more repelled she seems to be by me.

Keep your eyes out and just be aware. I would not threaten her or try to get her to admit so anything, but be aware of the possibility - and also that, from what I have seen in my sitch and elsewhere here, the existence of the OM seems to drive and extend the withdrawal of the spouse. There is no reconciliation so long as OM/OW is still in the picture.

In actuality, the actions you need to take are the same (A or none) - detach (lovingly), stop all pursuit, focus on yourself, make changes and wait and see.

Yes, LBS are terrified of detaching b/c they are either afraid of losing their S or they are afraid of what you just expressed. It has happened both ways, but I still say that pulling back (detaching) is the way to do it. As an AWAW, I can tell both of you men (all of the men) that the more you press your wife to go anywhere for M help.......and they are involved in an EA or PA, they will not want to do it and it will make matters worse. I know you feel desperate and I am sure this is showing to the wife. The more you try to convince her to go, the more she will resent you and I could see myself when you were describing your wife not like the way you talk and finding everything wrong with you that she could. That is what WAW's do. They get to a place that they can't stand their H's b/c they are so turned off to him and want to escape being anywhere around him. That is why she says the mean things she does. Plus, she is trying to find excuses for ending the M.

If you are so afraid that your detaching will end your feelings for her......well, that makes me wonder if your love is that strong. But, I do not say that in a mean way, just wondering why you were be so afraid of it. If you do not "feel" anything, then would it not be a lot easier for you? Yes, time and distance do make a difference and that is a good thing when people are getting over a break-up, but if detaching is going to change your feeling for "her".......then you just need to drop the rope and get a life. Stop trying to control her and pressure her to go to meetings, etc. Leave her alone and see what happens. B/c I can promise you that it will continue to be a flip-flop on every subject or issue that comes along until she is over the A.

You may see this as not "fighting" for your M, but it is.......it is just in a different way.

Sandi

Hi Sandi,

As always, thanks for the advice. It helps keep us grounded.

Recently, I made the mistake of convincing myself that my W was moving past the EA and OM and that her distress was due to the sitch with her mom. This caused me to engage, try to support her, etc.

Unfortunately, I now realize that OM is still in picture, and she still is turned off to me and trying to escape. My attempts to support her were in fact pursuing... (oops! - live and learn).

...now, however, she has agreed to a MC session, so I have to figure out how to best use it and not push her away.

Keep up the advice.

Is there usually an OM when the W has lost any feelings for the spouse?

I know that from what I have said of my sitch that people here and my IC think that there is or was one. I have snooped and found nothing so far. And she has denied any and said that she has thought that our marriage wasn't so great for years which built up to where we are now. But I dont' know if I'm just that stupid or oblivous, but I really, really had no idea. The bomb was a complete shocker for me.

And I don't know what I'm supposed to be 'normally' feeling, but I now find that I feel some anger in addition to all the other 'normal' feelings. I am a little angry that if she was so unhappy for years then why didnt' she try to communicate it to me in a way I would have actually heard. She knows I don't get subtle hints most of the time, just give it to me straight. And I'm kinda angry cause I feel like my trust has been violated. I know that I'm not perfect, but I honestly thought I always tried to be a good H.

I dont' know if some anger is good or bad, but that is where my mind seems to be going.