Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums For Newcomers Divorce looming #4

Kevin,

Why are you doing this custody agreement with out a lawyer? She can't make you sign. Tell her you need to know that everything is fair. Also, it is a custody agreement NOT blackmail. She shouldn't have anything in there about the OM....

I support you on your decision not to say anything. Why in the world did you sleep with her today. By doing that she knows that she will always have you right where she wants you. She has controll and she loves it.

Take controll back Kevin..... There's your 2x4

Love ya anyway
(((Hugs)))

Our agreement before I head to Florida that will be signed and notorized Monday morning unless I have seriously missed something in this.

Moving
Me and W will agree to the best location in Plano or Frisco for everyone.

Me
1. I will move to Lutz, Florida to study for a new career path and to grow as a man. I will be living with my father.
2. I am expected back by June 30, 2009. This date will be moved up if W’s employment status changes.
3. I will receive a bi-weekly allowance of $240 during this time, provided W is gainfully employed and can afford this sum.
4. I will line up job interviews and send out my resume beginning two weeks prior to returning to Texas.
5. I will not follow W, have W followed, nor snoop through anything W deems personal.
6. I will vacate the house by Monday, February 23rd
7. I will not take the children and leave if the opportunity presents itself unless it is agreed to by both parents.
8. I will not purposefully or unintentionally do anything that will hurt W financially
9. I will not purposefully or unintentionally do anything more to hurt W or prolong this situation with W as a parent, or as a woman.
10. I will cease and desist with all attempts to sleep with W, to reconcile with W anytime in the immediate future unless W has indicated otherwise, or to generally try to make any efforts to extend this situation in any way, shape or form.
11. I will not say anything offensive or derogatory to the children about W.
12. Upon my return to Texas, I will begin to alternate weeks of custody with W.
13. I forfeit alternating custodial weeks if I am not gainfully employed and providing full support of the children by September 30, 2009 until I am again gainfully employed and able to support the children.
14. If I break this agreement or contact OM or OM's W, I will be immediately liable for child support to W in the amount of $661 per month for each month I was unemployed as well as all costs for the children’s health insurance, half the costs for any health costs for the children, all monies paid for both my cell phone and car insurance for all months while unemployed, the additional costs of covering me on W’s health insurance plan, and the total sum of all allowance money paid during the unemployment period. Additionally, W will immediately cease all support for me monetarily.
15. If I break this agreement or contact OM or OM's W, my W will also refuse to entertain any further thoughts of friendship or a relationship with me in the near or distant future altogether. Additionally, W will immediately make arrangements for the exchange of the children during each parents custodial week so that W will never again have to see me unless there is a child emergency, child’s birthday, or an event the child is participating in. In those instances, W will require that I not address her in person unless it is necessary. I will also not be allowed to call W at all. Email and text will be the only allowable forms of communication.


Wife
1. W will not have my move to Lutz, Florida declared abandonment.
2. W is in agreement that she will assist me with my return from Florida. The extent of the assistance will be directly dependent upon my attitude and behavior.
3. W will ensure that I get to speak to the girls at least once daily if at all possible.
4. W will work to ensure the children are able to video chat with me.
5. W will provide regular (weekly) updates to me regarding the children’s well-being and lives.
6. W will contact me and include me (via conference call) on the parent session with kids counselor that is being requested in 2-3 weeks. I will ensure I am available for this session.
7. W will cease to support me in Florida on June 30, 2009 unless I am actively pursing employment and providing daily proof to W until September 30, 2009 and provided W is employed and can afford to.
8. W will not have me served by an officer of the court suing me for divorce.
9. W will not say anything offensive or derogatory to the children about me.
10. W will not take the children and leave if the opportunity presents itself unless it is agreed to by both parents.
11. W will continue to pay for my cell phone charges until I am employed, subject to W’s continued employment and ability to afford such charges. I will not seek another plan. My phone charges are those in association with the current account.
12. W will continue to pay for my car insurance until I am employed.
13. W will continue to pay for health insurance for me until the divorce is final as long as W is employed and can afford to do so.
14. W will obtain my agreement on the Divorce Decree prior to filing with the court. I agree to be reasonable and provide said agreement no later than the end of the 3rd week of March.
15. W will keep the credit card and be liable for all charges incurred. W will also continue to pay this bill on time so as not to damage my credit.
16. If either I or W remarries, the person who has remarried agrees to not seek additional support from the other parent if there is a double income. Additionally, the person who has not remarried will not seek additional support if they are fully able to support themselves and the children.

Financial Assistance for the Children
1. All assistance being requested by either me or W will be for the sole support of the children and will cease immediately when each child reaches 18 years of age.
2. I will begin to provide health insurance for both children as soon as I am employed if my insurance is a better plan and more cost effective than W’s. Regardless of who carries the health insurance for the children, the cost of the health insurance as well as all health care costs will be split equally by both parents.
3. W will provide all support for both children until I am employed. I and W agree to assist one another with support in order for the children to not have to live in an apartment, as each can afford it and provided neither has voluntarily quit, is financially irresponsible, or has taken a position with a salary that is not commensurate to their employment experience.
4. Me and W will each cover the cost of supporting the children during their custodial week. For example, I will pay for childcare and cost of food and entertainment during my custodial week. W will pay for the same during her custodial week.
5. Upon receiving my first paycheck, I will immediately begin supporting the children financially.
6. W will provide health insurance for both children as long as she is employed, able to afford it, and/or until I provide health insurance.

Hi Stacy,

Why did I sleep with her? Ugg... because I am a man. I am human. I can't resist her physically. Its a weakness of mine with her. And she knows it.

The agreement is posted. I'm thinking more and more about letting an attorney look it over.

Thanks for the 2x4. I know I needed it.

Kevin

Kev,

If I understand you right, you are getting something in writing b/c you are leaving the state and you fear that once you do that, you'll be at a disadvantage legally, correct? You are afraid she'll do something to you while you are out of state? I can see that. But you are not thinking straight if you don't have an attorney review it. That's my 2 x 4.

I have more to say on the other stuff, but for now, you have only one thing to choose between; what works and what doesn't. We don't know what, IF ANYTHING, will get your wife back. WE DO know what won't. Pursuing her at this time,
won't work. Hasn't yet. And acting in anger has made things worse as well. So you say you do own your part in some of the issues; like losing some of the ambitions and drinking too much. She will need to know, WITH TIME, that you really are sober. That you are on track. That you bring something to the table; and you are doing that with the Florida endeavor, it sounds like. So that's cool. You identified the rest as far as being upbeat, attractive, etc. Did your attitude of complacency lead to getting out of shape or something? I know that is superficial but that is her mode right now. It's all about the surface right now. Time erodes the surface of things and will reveal what matters most; things like character, fatherhood, honor, etc. Things you will be manifesting the next few months. I think in a way Florida will allow you to detach better though you'll miss the kids a lot. But the changes you'll make, will be more noticeable to her upon your return. Dress differently and do some 180's. Join something you always wanted to join, or take a class or hobby deal that you never made time for before. If your training prevents that for now, so be it. But show some sort of 180 and act different on the phone with her asap. Be the one to end the conversations; politely, b/c you are busy moving forward...you have things to do, people to meet, places to go, etc. Upbeat, but moving on. Let her see a bit of mystery. That will NOT make her think you don't care. Please. Pursuing and manipulating things to control the outcome will not work and will push her away more. Let go of the results, leave those to God. Do your best as a man.

Your other goals will require a big focus on the kids; how to keep in touch with them from Florida and how to resume your R's with them when you return to Texas. As I recall, there is no alimony in Texas, nor are there fault grounds for divorce other than fraud or insanity (sorry, as crazy as she's acting, it won't meet the legal definition but just so I'm clear, I am NOT giving you legal advice here, okay? )) You need to see an attorney there as I don't know all your facts and do want to be clear.

However, if you have half custody of the kids, you're entitled to a share of HER income since there is a disparity. Do NOT sign away any custody rights. Texas favors shared custody. So when you see a lawyer (let your w babble about "you delaying things" if she wants; you are trying to protect your rights as a father and if that takes time, so be it. What the heck is the rush anyhow? Does she have any regard for the wife and children of OM? Interesting how off the path she has gotten. ) But it isn't just paying 25% of his salary and giving up half the community property that happens, he'll have to pay for transportation of the kids to and from him if needed and she'll probably have to do the same if she moves...but I sure would like to see them stay in one place and can tell you the court will likely prefer that. They want stability for the kids and that is what you have to offer them. God knows the kids want that too. They'll see her wackiness and your absence at the same tinme. That's tough. So, make sure you call often. Really often.

Show your strength in this arena as it won't come off as vindictive as long as it comes from a place of fatherly love, make sense? IOW, assert yourself there in a calm way. I cannot stress to you how attractive it is to a woman when a man who is asserting a legitimate right, does so calmly and without rancor. Not to punish or "show her"...but to protect his offspring. It is also a great model for your kids to see what a man of honor and dignity does in the face of this betrayal. Someday, they too will be hurt deeply and face huge setbacks. It's your job to show them that even though your pain is deep, it is not fatal and it is not eternal. You will heal and you will love again. Perhaps it'll be their mother, whom you will always honor as the mother of their children even if she acts otherwise...

Perhaps it'll be someone else...but for now, you have enough on your plate.
You are doing so well for being in such a new place of confusion and darkness. I don't believe anyone gets out of these episodes well, without God, however you understand Him. Lean on Him, b/c He will help strengthen you thru this more than you thought possible.

I never prayed so much in my life. Sometimes I just had to turn it over to Him, b/c otherwise the anger would consume me. I literally would say that out loud in the shower, "God I turn this M over to you, (or) "I turn this pain/anger over to you" b/c it was too much and too heavy for me to carry. You may want to try that Kev.

You are in the right place, however dark it is right now. It DOES get better and hey, I promise you that.
((( j )))

25,

Yes. My fear is that I will be at a disadvantage legally once I leave the state. So I feel like I have to get this now.

I have been sober since September 2008 now. So W has seen it for months.

I have set my kids up on video/web chat on a laptop I am leaving here in Dallas. This way I can see them each night and they can see me each night and we can talk.

W has no regard for OM's kids in that she doesn't care if they go through a D. Why would she? She is putting her own kids through one. Her thought is just put them all in counseling. She probably assumes she would be a better mother to OM's kids than his own W. She thinks OM's W is a terrible mother and doesn't want the kids anyways from things she has told me about her.

The rush is she wants me out of the house Monday. And since her parents own the house, the judge will side with her.

Plus she can use me quitting my job against me. Even though it was better to quit than be fired which is what I was looking at since I could not focus for months at work because of all the D stuff going on. I had also been written up at work. I want to make sure my butt is covered.

The main purpose of Florida is to better my career. My W doesn't want me coming after her for child support since she is a contractor and her job may end in June. But as a business analyst with her experiance now, she won't have any problem picking up where she left all somewhere in that pay range. Ya, I really need to seek an attorney for advice on that one and the rest of this.

Did you have a chance to look at the agreement I posted that we are to sign? If so, what are your thoughts?

Kevin

Kevin,
I've read over your agreement and COME ON! ARE YOU KIDDING ME? It's obvious she drafted most of it. Read through it again and you'll see how she's controlling you again.

Especially that stuff about contacting the OM. If she decided that she didn't want to pay you any more, she could say that you contacted the OM even if you didn't and even if there's no proof, she can still cut you off from your kids and everything.

Read through it again and you'll see that it sounds like it was written by a high schooler. Don't do it until a lawyer looks at it! Protect yourself! I can see so many loopholes where she can just leave you in the dust with nothing. Not even your kids.

Screw your W already, concentrate on your kids. Postpone whatever you have going on until this is done right if you need to have it done. You are going to be the biggest loser in all this and it is obvious! For example, in terms of the contacting OM's W. That has nothing to do with your single rights and your children's rights. That's just covering her ass!

My opinion again is DON'T DO IT!

Yeah I didn't even read it all and I am cringing.

"2. W is in agreement that she will assist me with my return from Florida. The extent of the assistance will be directly dependent upon my attitude and behavior."

I mean...wtf

Who determines this exactly. Why is there a "I don't really have to do anything" clause?

Kevin,

Don't sign that - are you kidding?

Also, STOP having sex w/her - I hope you used protection. I can't believe she told you that she feels bad about cheating on HIM. I hate to say this, but she has absolutely zero respect for you. You need to take charge - and fast - for the sake of your kids.

Kevin,

You have my thoughts. Like mentioned above the property settlement is final and can't be changed. The custody and child support can be changed anytime. Get a lawyer to look it over please.

I feel your pain.. Try a wife who made $93k and a husband that made $80 k. Being told that same thing as you have... I'm attractive and I can do better. Then after telling your spouse it's not that we don't make enough... it's we spend everyting we make - I get another phone call telling me I haven't got a clue because our combined income of $173k just barely puts us in to the upper lower class to lower middle class. MY goodness!!!! Not to throw salaries around but this shows the insanity at this part of the process?????? You are not alone friend and do not let this affect you. It is not the salary you are competing against... it is her mind.

To 25yearsMLC... I am in love. Good luck with you relationship as it sounds so positive but if things don't Please Marry Me

Kev,

I'll look again but did NOT see what she wrote. Is it buried within another posting?

(( j ))

OKAY I found the "agreement". DO NOT SIGN THIS....period. I could list item by item what is wrong with this but it would take all day and look like I'm trying to practice law from this state into yours so I cannot do that. I'm telling you it's a joke. It is not enforceable but even so, it gives your wife the illusion of power and control and the reality is, Legally speaking, SHE IS REQUIRED TO DO A LOT OF THIS AND YOU HAVE TO DO ALMOST NONE OF IT, ....why oh why on earth would you sign it?

You are NOT protected/benefitted in an enforceable way, as the only thing she's giving you is temporary support. *(So tell her as long as the checks keep coming, you won't do anything to jeopardize THAT) and let that be her "leverage" and as for the rest, it's all about what is best for the kids. STOP mixing the issues.


An "online" attorney is not considered seeing one, okay? Just as I will not pretend to practice or counsel you here on this board, I cannot imagine why you'd think asking an online question would suffice for the most important thing you've ever signed or done. Would you consult an "online doctor" for a cancer diagnosis without any lab work or actually meeting you???? This amazes me.... Kev, you are too upset to be thinking straight right now. SLOW DOWN. Take a breath and step back...

As for quitting your job, maybe it is too bad you didn't get fired b/c you'd probably have gotten unemployment and or, she could not argue you are "under earning" on purpose but that is really an argument for HER to make when the checks don't come to you. See?

Do Not sign this. Instead, see a legal aid attorney or someone who writes up temporary orders in an "emergency" kind of temporary restraing orders pending the resolution of issues and often you can get those for 60 days or so, as that is the typical "fast track" divorce there, and does NOT resolve custody but marital status only. Get someone who can write up something temporary about maybe just not changing the kids residence for the next 6 months, and both parties agreeing not to initiate legal action against the other, nor to engage in "parental alienation " which means neither of you bad mouths the other spouse to the kids, and that includes you not telling OM's family, FOR NOW, anything. In most states, if you bad mouth the other parent to the kids, it's called "parental alienation" , and you can LOSE custody and in most ways, I like that rule. (So I guess if you want to cuss out your w, STAY married to her ??))
Point is it hurts the kids. Places the anger of one parent over the needs of the child.

And Kids figure things out on their own anyhow. They tend to bond more with the parent who "lets them love the other parent" more, meaning, anger does not benefit you with your own kids. The angrier parent LOSES, as far as who the kids want to be with. That's a fact.

Again, keep it simple. It's about the kids, and I guess you need some money from her.?? Too bad you don't just cash in some community property.(?)

So just agree that your departure is temporary and for your job (isn't there something IN Texas that could accomplish this, or do you need your parent's support? Have you no savings with her wonderful salary?)

Again, DO NOT MIX THE OTHER ISSUES and even though in the back of my mind I was laughing at this "contract" b/c I know it's not enforceble --as if she'll get money from you if you exercise free speech ....as long as it isn't parental alienation, you can say what you want legally speaking...and as if getting a lawyer to review YOUR rights as a dad will be seen as a wrongful delay and anyhow, you have the LEGAL right to delay all you want....as long as there's no fraud, theft, etc. She's trying to get you to give up LEGAL rights in exchange for money that you MIGHT have the right to anyhow... wth?? Don't sign....

NOW OTOH, keep in mind that what you tell others or OM's family and how you refer to stbxw, and what you say to them, usually makes other things happen---

1) you'll look vindictive no matter what your real motives are (and let's face it, some or all of it IS vindictive and a desire to punish her and OM) and;

2) the judge will likely frown on the disclosure, feeling that the OM' w may know this already and be struggling with it, and when you make it public and take away HER shield, or have HER children learn something that was really up to HER to tell them, you are overstepping and putting your anger ahead of what is best for someone else's children. That news should NEVER be told to them from a stranger.

Most judges tend to view these disclosures as a petty & destructive act of vengeance unless there is a pregnancy (ie a fraud) or STD....and don't say the fact that you don't know if there is one, is your reason. Again, stop mixing the issues and letting her tell you what you can and cannot say and to whom. Promise her, verbally, and only if you feel like it, that you won't do anything to hurt anyone's kids, (and then remind her that she cannot say the same...)

Oh and a 3rd reason...remember your long term goal here? It isn't about "justice" as YOU mete it out; that's for God, it's about the restoration of your M . Oh yeah...


Remember how you want to KEEP THE ROAD HOME PAVED AND SMOOTH, which just means don't make it harder for her to snap out of this than it already will be. Does NOT mean be a doormat either. See a real L... dear God, or just sign nothing.

If you have to later prove that you went to Florida temporarily and your w knew this, (which the stupid document actually helps you prove) so she can't argue you abandoned them...but who knows what she's thinking? Do you really need her money right now? God knows I like that she's paying you something but not at this cost. Signing nothing is likely better than signing this crazy thing. Gosh I'm too tempted to go over the document line by line and I cannot do that on this board as it's too close to advising you....just promise us ALL that you'll see a real L and tell him/her the facts.

Hope this helps more than it confuses. And who the heck said you have to leave the house??? Excuse me but are you on the lease as well? Sure it's her parents home, but until you have a chance to breathe, since this is pretty new to you, can you at least see a real in person attorney to protect your rights as a FATHER??? Of course you can. Do it. And won't your inlaws understand this? Good grief, you are the father of their grandchildren Even if you have to go to a hotel for a week, to escape too much craziness, get a lawyer to review a real document and get some protection before you leave the state. Do Not Sign This... Oh, last but not least, no offense, but 5 months of sobriety does not a recovery make. Are you going to meetings? Are you in a program? Although I AM a believer in them I realize some men aren't. But 85% of successful recoveries are associated with some sort of program, AND more importantly, perhaps, is that the courts care about a program. Not just your word that you've been sober. Recovery is a lot more than just not drinking, okay? So, keep that in mind and don't assume others will see this problem as having been "handled". She will bring it up, no doubt. So do not drink and for God's sake don't get a DUI or anything like
that on your record if you want to see your kids unsupervised and have any chance of restoring the M.... If you are afraid going to meetings makes you an alcoholic, reconsider that rationalization. Besides, who said you have to tell her?
GOOD LUCK and our prayers are going your way buddy...
((( j )))