Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Midlife Crisis H just moved out, 13 months post-bomb

BND, Thanks so much for posting to me, I was starting to wonder if being off the boards for a couple of months meant everyone had lost interest in me! (Just my insecurity showing, I guess.)

I have been signing up for a lot of free or low-cost resources (tele-seminars, books, programs) for improving my life in general, and my finances in particular. That's something. However, I am aware that the key to improving things is to actually break the inertia and get moving. I am nervous about this, because I have such a nasty history of not getting things done, but I am asking all of you to hold me accountable. Here are my goals for today:
-- Begin working on an order for a client that I have promised to deliver by Tuesday
-- Do SOMETHING concrete towards getting my website up (at least the first item on the list my tech guy has given me, and preferably more)
-- Check on the cost of having the pool liner replaced (H agreed to the idea of having the tax refund go towards that long-overdue repair expense)

That's probably enough for one day. Yesterday I did a lot of reading and watching videos on these programs for self-improvement, and I completed the shredding of a HUGE stack of papers which went back to 2006! With all of those papers processed, I was able to reshuffle things under my desk so that I actually have a clear space for my legs under there for the first time in several years! My feet are actually free to swing around as I sit here typing! I know, it's not a life-changing accomplishment, but I think it is helping me get unstuck.

Want to hear the latest news about H? I didn't mention it in my previous post because I was trying to summarize, but last Sunday night, he called me at 2 a.m. (I was awake, but I wasn't expecting a call at that hour, so I didn't have my phone nearby and didn't get the message until around 7 a.m.) That was pretty strange...he would have expected me to be awake, as I'm an incurable night owl, but it's very odd for him to call me at that hour. Anyway, he said he hit a deer on the way back from [OW's state], and his car wasn't really driveable but he was driving it anyway(?), and he wanted to know if he could stop by and pick up our extra car so he would have something to drive while his was in the shop. Long story short, I haven't actually spoken with him since then, but we exchanged a flurry of messages that day, and he ended up coming by while I was asleep and getting the extra car (which was okay, except that if I had known beforehand that he was coming then, I would have made a point of being awake and spiffed up).

In his last message, he asked if we still had AAA (emergency automobile service, FYI for you non-Americans), because he had had to jump-start the car before he could get it moving when he picked it up, and now he was off in the city working and it was dead again. When I got that message I left him one, politely explaining that I had let the AAA membership lapse in February in order to save money, and asking if he wanted me to reinstate it (this is the first time we haven't had it since I signed up for it at age 16). I have not heard from him since. I thought it was a little bit of irony that I had to jump-start my own car on Thursday, at which point I discovered that he had taken the jumper cables out of my car so I no longer had access to any. I really don't think he was trying to make things difficult for me, as my car is normally pretty reliable, and the car he was taking isn't, but we've never had more than the one set of cables between our three cars. Oh well, at least I was home and it wasn't a big deal that I couldn't get where I was going immediately. I think I will reinstate our AAA membership, but will charge it to our joint account (as it used to be). After all, which of us is more likely to need it--the one who rarely makes trips out of our area, or the one who travels five hours away (to visit OW) every couple of weeks?

In other news, I am excited to report that my work is currently appearing in a MAJOR national wedding publication, and more of my work will appear in the next issue of the same magazine, so that is six months of exposure to my target market...and I even got paid for it! I am really thrilled about that, and they even got my name and contact info all correct in the credits!

Thanks, all, for all your support! It's good to be back!

Peace,
Dawn

Hi, Dawn!

I'm glad you are still "among the living" and actually you sound like you are doing pretty well all things considered.

You say you are off all ADs?? As I recall, you have a history of suicidal thoughts......I have recently been dealing with that issue (for the first time in my life), so I'm wondering on how you are doing on that issue if you have stopped meds and/or counseling.

Remember, it's not a bad thing to go to a lawyer for advice and help. You need to stand up for yourself and not let your H's "woes" mess with your head!

((((((HUGS))))))

That's awesome!! Sounds like a great opportunity for more business. Great job !!!

Now that I have posted to a bunch of other threads, I'll put something on my own...

Trapt and SC, thanks for checking in and posting to me! I do appreciate it!

Yes, Trapt, I am thrilled about the magazine exposure, thank you! Despite being in what some people consider "fly-over" territory here in the midwest, I've even gotten an inquiry from England! Now if I can just get the $%^&* website fully operational...

(Warning: If you hate pity parties and gloom and doom, better skip the rest of this post.)

SC, yes, all of the ADs are long out of my bloodstream by now. I went off cold turkey, which I should know better than to do by now. I had a hard time for a while when the levels were going down. Since I came off of them, I mostly feel sort of neutral...not "dead" emotions as some get when on AD's (I have experienced that once or twice), but not particularly happy or sad either, mostly. I cry more than I did on the AD's, so I guess overall I feel worse, but I'm not having frequent major down times. Of course, when one is on AD's, it's hard to remember what it was like without them, and vice versa.

I've been at least mildly suicidal for almost 30 years now, so I'm pretty accustomed to that kind of thoughts. I'm still alive, after all. Lately I have begun thinking of the suicidal urges a little differently, although I don't know how much this will help you if you aren't of a certain religious bent. There's a verse in one of the letters in the New Testament (I'd have to look up the reference) that talks about how a married person (whether husband or wife) doesn't have exclusive say over their own body, because their spouse has certain rights regarding it. The context has to do with sex--namely, that spouses shouldn't withhold conjugal rights from each other--but I was thinking about it in terms of suicide. If you look at it a certain way, my rights to my body don't extend to killing myself, because that would infringe on my H's rights to my body...and I'm not just talking about sex. (The fact that he is already violating my rights to his body by having sex with someone else instead of me is irrelevant to this topic of discussion.) I don't know if this makes sense to anyone else, especially since I can't quote the exact reference (I will look it up if someone asks me to), but I figure that the people who care about me will be happy if I find another reason not to kill myself, no matter how wacky they think the reason is!

Another huge insight regarding suicide that has occurred to me recently: a noteworthy part of the problems I have had all along, including a lot of problems with my H, is that I have never truly committed myself to NOT committing suicide. I've been wrestling with this idea a great deal over the last few weeks. I did once promise to H not to follow through on those impulses, long ago when he insisted, but I later explained to him that I wasn't sure I could keep that promise. I don't know if that makes me a bad person, or dishonorable, or just as deserving of contempt as someone who goes back on their marriage vows--I hope not. I don't blame H for getting upset about it, then and later, but what was I supposed to do, lie to him? No, I won't do that, even now...but I don't say much to him about what I'm thinking or feeling, because I don't think it would help anything or anyone.

Anyway, I've always had suicide in reserve, mentally, as my escape clause for when things get really bad, and I don't just mean in what I say to H or to other people--I don't mention it often, and never to H any more, although he sometimes talks about being concerned about my suicidal tendencies, at which time I just listen. If I could reassure him, I would, but I don't think he believes anything I say anyway, and I don't really feel right about telling him I'm different regarding the suicide thing now, since I'm not completely sure I am. Since the age of 13, I have NEVER, that I remember, felt that I or the world would definitely be better off if I stayed alive. During the bad times I was sure it would be better for me and everyone else for me to be dead. During better times it has been more a feeling of, "Wait and see if something happens that makes your life worth continuing to live." Well, I'm still waiting...and waiting...and waiting. Is it any surprise that I never wanted to have children? _I_ don't want to be alive, so why would I inflict that on anyone else?

Is this making any sense? My H has said that he simply cannot understand this mindset, and he would go through any amount of pain, physical or emotional, rather than die...so I suspect that most people who have never been suicidal will not understand where I'm coming from.

I don't believe in reincarnation. I believe in divine eternal reward and punishment, and I believe I know where I am going when I die (and I'm not sure suicide wouldn't send me to the other place, which is another reason not to do that). But even if I believed there was no afterlife--believed that this life was it, and when we die, that's the end of everything that we are--I think I would still have just as much of a problem with the idea that my being alive is a good thing.

I just don't love myself. I don't think I ever have. I don't even know if it's possible, after so many years of trying to love myself and always failing. Part of me doesn't blame H for walking away from me, because, yeah, yeah, I know, if I don't love myself, how can I expect anyone else to do so? I never understood why he fell in love with me in the first place, so I didn't understand why he stopped, either (although he says he still does, but his actions don't back that up). I was afraid to let him know the real me, for fear it wouldn't be good enough for him. Now I don't know if I just created a self-fulfilling prophecy.

And I feel that all of the good I have tried to do in the world is far overshadowed by the drain I have been to it. Good intentions aren't enough. Oh, here's an analogy for you...you know how the research scientists have now decided that the composition of the universe is mostly "dark matter," which is not detectable through visible light, although I don't remember all of of the specs--something like 97%? Well, the way I _feel_ is that my bad qualities and deeds are like the dark matter in proportion to my good ones--not as openly obvious, but much more predominant.

I have a lot of pity parties, and sometimes instead of forcing other people to attend, I just make myself scarce so they aren't subjected to them. Heck, if I knew someone like just like me, I wouldn't want to be her friend; she's a whiner who does nothing but complain and talk about herself.

I've read that most people have a few beliefs that are incompatible with some of the other things they believe. Well, I recognize some of mine. I believe that God is omnipotent, omniscient, loving, and created everything, and it was good. I believe that all things work for the good of those who love God and are called to God's purpose. I also believe that I am a mistake on God's part and never should have been created. I believe that God _does_ make junk, and I'm an example of that (not that I'm saying I'm like him or anything, but does anyone want to make the case that Hitler was part of that "it's all good" concept?). Maybe I should withdraw this part of the discussion; I really don't want to trigger a big argument about religion, especially on my own thread.

I know I have good qualities (which I won't bother listing). I know my bad qualities too (which I also won't bother listing). I know that I am honestly not a significantly worse person than the average. But it's not so much about whether one's character tips to the good side or the bad; it's about how one _feels_ about oneself. I hate myself so much that on my bad days it seems like it's just a matter of time before everyone else hates me too.

One of the reasons I dislike taking the ADs is that it's sort of like using crutches for a permanently unstable knee. The crutches allow you to go about your activities, but they don't actually fix the underlying problem, and they don't actually allow you to function the way you were meant to, without any pain or worry or awkwardness or difficulty. ADs are a kind of crutch, although I don't see anything wrong with using crutches when needed. I recommend ADs to people all the time. But they don't actually fix what's truly wrong. And I hate taking drugs, especially for the long term.

My gosh, I am getting sick of listening to myself whine. And just think...this is one of my "neutral" days, not a bad one!

I now expect to be beating off a flurry of 2x4s saying "get over yourself!" Yeah, working on that. It's a long-term project. I try not to go on and on about how I feel about myself, usually, but I do cherish this board as a place where I can be honest and open to an extent beyond what I can do with people in my RL.

I think that's quite enough for now. Thanks for listening...

Peace,
Dawn

GOD does NOT make mistakes, not with me and not with you. It's not of GOD that you have these thoughts, but I guarentee if you call on him and believe in him he will wipe those thoughts right out of your mind.
As far as medicine...crutch or not, if I need it, I am taking it.
I also have thought before what good am I to this world if the only man I have loved for 20 years dont want me and cant live with me? BUT it is NOT us that is MESSED UP, its THEM. We are normal and we ARE capable of being loved and if we want we will find love again, whether its with our xh or someone else.
The main thing is turn it all over to GOD and he dont need our help.
Dawn I will be praying for you.
Listen remember this, GOD loves you so much that he gave his ONLY son so you could be saved and go to heaven. There is a Heaven and Hell and there is good and evil. Please just let GOD have your problems and he will fight the battle for you.

HUGS to YOU,
Renee

Renee,
Thank you for reminding me that it's not me, it's him. Thank you also for praying for me. I will gladly take all of the prayers I can get. And thank you for reminding me to let God fight the battle for me. I know all of that already, but I keep backsliding on formalized devotional plans.

I just get kinda sick of wondering why I find it so difficult to change the things I know perfectly well I need to change. For example, I am late to almost everything, and have been for years and years. This is not rocket science, and I really don't enjoy being late; why can't I fix this? It's not like anyone is preventing me from leaving the house on time or anything. Why do I sabotage myself? Why do I have so very much trouble starting projects, especially starting them early? I mean, what the heck is wrong with me??

Believe me, I am not knocking ADs; they have saved my life repeatedly. I would just like to find some effective non-drug way of dealing with my depression, especially since I have no medical insurance right now. I am doing okay for the moment with the depression, but I could be a whole lot better.

Man, I'm tired. Just once, it would be nice to wave a magic wand and have the nightmare be over...

Peace,
Dawn

Hi Dawn, I really understood your post b/c I have had times in my life when I have felt the same but for me it has been an odd episode,so to live with it continually must be so hard.
I guess you have tried other therapies other than drugs, I am thinking maybe life coaching or NLP? I think that may help you more than AD's,which I too think only mask the causes.

I think you also under estimate your good points!
As for suicide and your rather strange theory about it not being just your body in a m, well I am not going there but it is not so long ago really when if you took your own life you were not entitled to be buried on consecrated ground- how times have changed thank God.
I think it still affects certain insurance policies.
I believe that our life is a gift and as such we should live it to the best of our ability. I also believe that God does not make rubbish but I do believe that life, society whatever can do a very good job on corrupting minds. Far to complex an issue for me to get my head around.
Recognising all these things is a huge step in the right direction as I guess life must feel an uphill struggle for you most of the time.
When I had my x leave I was "ILL" for several years and know how you can think people would be better off without me thoughts, unlike you I have children and all I can say is thank God b/c otherwise I wouldn't be posting to you today. I think at my worst I had a season ticket to intensive care.
For me the slow road back to living began with very small things, a bird song, a rainbow in a puddle,lots of time outdoors in quiet and solitude,that somehow reconnected me with life.
I don't know the answers I do know that it can and will get better if you want it enough.
I am so proud that you can find the voice to say hey this is me-is anybody there? type thing.
So check out alternative therapies if you can.
Do yoga (a life enhancer for sure)Spend time with your loved ones even if you don't talk much.
Surround yourself with positive and funny people,it rubs off.
Reach out to those less fortunate, smile at strangers.
Make a point of speaking to people you don't know in a queue wherever.
Stroke an animal-get a cat or dog or just pet those you see.
Never underestimate the power of a touch and smell.
Fresh flowers or an oil burner with oil of rose, or lavender are good mood enhancers.
OK I am rambling but I hope some ideas may feel worth a go to you.
Take care.

((((((((((DAWN))))))))))

Gosh, Dawn, thank you for sharing that! Once again, just when I need it, somebody on these boards makes me see how much of a complete whimp I am!!!!

I have dealt with panic disorder off and on for the last 25+ years. I was always grateful that I didn't suffer from depression, which I was told usually goes hand in hand with anxiety. For the past year I have worked with a therapist and come to see that in fact I did suffer from depression, it just wasn't recognized because we (me, husband, mom, kids,.... everybody!) all just thought I was lazy. It was a standing joke that when God handed out domestic instinct I was absent!

In my H's mind (and mine) I was a fat lazy couch potato wife. When I went out to work, I was still defective because I didn't come home and want to cook a meal, clean, do laundry. I would rather pay someone to do those things, and I wanted fun times in the evening/weekends with H and the kids (H always wanted to "do something productive"). I never wanted to "work in the yard"and he never wanted to "go for a drive". And I always felt like a failure!

I could say more, but I won't. I'll just say that I think I understand a little of how you feel/felt. I didn't have the "death" component so much, but I sure haven't ever felt like it was OK to like myself, and that's a terrible feeling.

You have no idea what a remarkable person you are to deal with those feelings every day and still have the courage and compassion to reach out to people here! It's easy for people who don't have feelings like these to just move merrily along in life, but what people like us do takes real hoodspa!

Dawn, there must be some way to get the meds you need like medicaid or something.......please look into it. Also, I'v heard that exercise really helps some people. Sandycay says it has helped her immeasurably, so I am trying to take some more steps myself in that direction. I am also trying to do more meditation, and my sister recommended something called "brainwave entrainment". It's just listening to some sounds through stereo headphones which supposedly "equalize" the two hemispheres of the brain........sis said it really helped her meditation......I'm still skeptical, but what the heck!
And my therapist is trained in EMDR so I am going to try that too. Anyway, success is in the not giving up.......

If you ever want to, feel free to e-mail me through the alternative universe, and I'll give you my number too!

((((((hugs))))))

naej,
Thank you so much for posting to me; I treasure your advice as one of the "wise ones" who comes to the board and helps others even though your own sitch is in the "inactive" file.

It is indeed hard to live with the constant temptation of suicide running in my head like background music. But...I don't know what it's like to be live without it...you know, like a "normal" person. I don't talk about it as much as I used to, and I try to pay less attention to it. It has long been one of the issues between H and me, and I have done my best to take it off of the table, although he brings it up regularly (I never do with him, not since the bomb) and I have to figure out how to defuse the situation again. I can't honestly tell him that I would never consider suicide again, but I do the best I can with his concerns without being untruthful.

I still firmly believe that H subconsciously tries to push me and push me, by doing more and more hurtful things but being polite, to get me to actually off myself so he can get rid of me without actually doing something for which he can obviously be blamed. I think that's one of the reasons it took him so long to move out after the bomb...he subconsciously hoped that his actions would cause me to take some action--either killing myself or at least kicking him out--so he could stop having to deal with me but what happened would obviously be my choice, and not his fault. After all, why else would he have OW staying at our house with him while I was out of town, and then when I got home and found out, and was being as polite as I could be with my teeth gritted, clearly say that he knew this ought to upset me, and ask if I was going to kill myself? What kind of a person does something like that? One who is very eager to avoid blame--that's my take.

He has a hard time making big decisions, and is a people-pleaser, so I think my approach of being polite but distant, not initiating contact or pursuing anything other than necessary business with him, just leaving him alone, is the best path to take with him. I will not do anything to help him decide to get farther away from me, I will not put any pressure on him, I will not ask him for anything. I just leave him alone and try to act self-sufficient and content, and not to seem at all needy, when we are in contact.

Well, that was a little bit of meandering off-track from what I intended to say. To return to the point...

The only non-drug therapy I have actually pursued for my depression has been cognitive behavioral therapy, and all I did was some reading about it. I had trouble getting going on the CBT (that whole procrastination and lack of focus thing I get with my depression), so I signed up with a therapist to help me, but...she turned out not to really be into that, even though I had specifically requested a therapist who could help me with it. And now I can't afford any therapy at all, especially with no health insurance, so I'm kinda up a creek. I don't know anything about NLP, and I think you must mean something more specific with the term "life coaching" than I am thinking of. Any pointers on where to look or what to do to pursue those or other non-drug depression treatments?

The professionals (psychiatrists/therapists) I have consulted about my depression have never suggested anything other than drugs, regular talk therapy, or CBT. I even have a relatively close friend who is a psychiatrist...but I haven't talked about the depression with him in about four or five years, and I'm always hesitant to seem like I want a friend's professional help for free anyway. I have done a little poking around on the internet, but I haven't really dug deep on any of the possibilities I have found. I have to admit that I am not very happy with the standard Western medical community these days, since it seems like with most medical issues they just offer drugs (and/or knives) and a pat on the head. I simply find it hard to believe that those are the best ways to correct whatever is causing the issue in most cases. If you don't feel well, that is your body telling you that something is wrong--there is an imbalance, an injury, something--so you need to fix that instead of papering over the symptoms with drugs or cutting out whatever is getting the brunt of the imbalance.

Okay, medical rant over. BTW, yes, I know that my theory about rights to one's own body in a M is sort of strange. I will probably outgrow it sooner or later.


Oh, YEAH!!! I don't know how much of this feeling a "normal" person gets, but good ol' Sisyphus is my model every day. There is no "coasting" anywhere near my life.

I am sorta tired of the whole "blame your issues on other people" trend, but I will say that there's no question in my mind that other people's actions do affect us long-term, and sometimes we have to fight against our natural programming--I think everyone on this site would probably agree. After all, if it were "natural" for us to take the proper actions when our spouse decides they don't want to be with us any more, MWD would be out of a job, and none of us would be on these boards!

In my case, I was raised by a mother who obviously loved me, but had nearly impossibly high standards, which fact I didn't understand for years...for example, if I brought home anything other than straight A's, I got the third degree about why I had screwed up so badly, and I thought that was normal. It wasn't fun to go through that, so I think that only happened a couple of times when I was in high school--I actually had to endure the shame of getting a B grade in one of my classes for the semester. So now, of course, although my mother is more supportive of me since the bomb than she has been since I was small, I know that I'm a great disappointment to her, even if she doesn't really say much about it. I don't make a lot of money, I'm not using the degree she spent so much money for me to get, and I not only got married (which she didn't want me to do, because that's too dependent), I wasn't good enough at being a wife to hang onto that husband I was stupid enough to want.

<sigh> I really seem to be on a roll with the rants tonight.

I think I am just worn out with trying to make things better, and feeling like it's wasted effort, because it's hard to remember a time when things really were better. I know at least part of that is the way depression affects memory, makes it hard to remember a time when you felt different than you do right now. But I can't remember a time when I was actually _happy_ for more than brief periods (like, a couple of hours). I don't really feel bad, exactly, but just sort of...uninterested in putting forth useless effort. I have a major inertia problem--it's really hard for me to get started on things. Mostly I only start anything if I have a deadline staring me in the face, unless I have good reason to believe I will really enjoy it. I don't even eat regularly, because it's too much trouble to fix myself a meal. I'd have a problem with pets who didn't actively demand food; I might accidentally let them starve, and then I would feel horrible.

Thank you for all of the suggestions. I do yoga, and have been for about 15 years, and love it. It would be good for me to practice it more often.

I would love to spend more time with people, but I just don't have that many friends left after H got custody of so many of them (and I feel like I have worn out many of the ones I still have with all of my whining about my sitch over the last few years), plus all of his family, who no longer speak to me (although I suppose they would be polite if we had a chance encounter). I never really developed my friend-making skills, and it's showing up pretty starkly in my empty datebook. I know, join up and do activities that you think you will enjoy...I can do that, but I get stuck on the step between seeing people in an organizational venue, and actually doing something with people who seem interesting--potential friends--outside the confines of that venue...like having lunch together or something. Is that just ridiculous? Is it just my insecurity telling me not to reach out because of the fear of being rejected again, even though there are plenty of other people out there who might want to be friends with me? Maybe guys have this easier, having been trained that they have to stick their necks out there to ask for a date and having some practice in that matter (although I am _not_ at all wanting a romantic R; I'm committed to my H for life, and that's that).

I have three cats who light up my life every day. They are my kids. They are also one of the reasons I'm still here--nobody loves them the way I do.

Once again, way long enough post...time to do something else, like maybe eat (breakfast [defined as the first meal of the day]at 1:30 a.m....a bit odd, but I've only been awake for 6 hours...).

Peace,
Dawn

Hi, SC, so glad I could help! You know what they say...if nothing else, one can serve as a bad example!

Having just posted a massively long and overbloated response to naej, I will be more brief now...


I haven't usually thought of myself as lazy, but I sure have a lot of trouble getting things going, especially on a deadline. My H was more understanding than yours, but it was still a big issue, and I don't think he (or just about anyone else) ever understood the problem. I don't want to make excuses for myself, though...I just want to fix it, but I don't know how!

And yeah, it is a terrible, dark, ugly feeling...that I will never be "good enough," no matter what I do or how hard I try. Like trying to fill up a black hole by tossing pennies into it.


...no, I really don't, but thanks!...


Thanks, I do what little I can... However, I'm not sure anyone's life is "easy"...I think we just have different challenges, which ebb and flow. I once read about an attitude adjustment exercise as follows: Take any group of people. Have each write their three biggest current problems in life on a slip of paper. Put all of the slips in a bowl. Have each person draw one slip at random, making sure they don't get their own back. Then tell them that they get to exchange the problems they wrote on the slip they put IN for those on the slip they drew OUT. Assuming such a thing were possible, would they agree? Odds are, not just "No" but "^&*( NO!!"


I could get some ADs (not what I had just been on, but one I've taken in the past) for $4/month, but the trouble with that is that I would still have to pay the full expense of the psychiatrist checkup visits, and mine isn't exactly cheap. And...I have been looking into medical insurance, and even if it's pretty cheap, it's still a quarter of what I made last year (which was a pretty pathetic amount, although it was more than any year since 2001). I simply need to earn more money, that's all there is to it.

Anyway, the big problem is that I would like to get away from the drugs, just because I'm tired of being on drugs if I can find an alternative that deals with my problem.


If that's true, then I'm the nardling Queen of the Universe! 30 years now fighting the suicidal whispers, and I'm still standing! But that's not enough--it's one of the things H always complained about, and in this case I have to agree--it's not enough for me just to exist. I have to actually _do_ something beyond just survival if there is any point to my continuing to live. Otherwise I'm no more than a parasite.

Thanks for all of your kind words and support!

Now I'm off to get some food...

Peace,
Dawn