Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Midlife Crisis Only look forward

It happens. Don't beat yourself up. Only one person was perfect in all history. Christmas was hard on me too b/c it was hard on the family.

It was hard on you b/c you care.


Positive. Most kids her age would not share - let alone three pages worth. You have a great daughter. She trusts you, even if the letter outlined what she felt were your shortcomings.

And then you did the alpha male thing and set up a family dinner! I am proud of you frank. Proud.

Just remember that our kids want to see us a perfect and it is a jolt when they see we are human after all. But seeing their parents as human is also part of growing up. That is how they learn.


Disagree, they matter the MOST. Don't be something to your daughters that you are not. Be frank. Worts and all. That is what they need most - not what you think they need.

Be true to yourself first or you cannot be true to others.

You are doing well. And you know what need to be done.

Strength and Honor.

Good that you identify your shortcomings and slip ups. Dont put all the blame on yourself. D17.99 is going through a difficult time in her life now as she transitions to adulthood.
I cant give you any more advice about teenagers as I have quite a few years before my kids are that age.

I know finances are tight, but have you ever considered any of the retreats, mens groups or mentoring at http://bettermen.org/index.asp

I think they are pretty close to where you live.

Finding a friend that has gone or is going through your similar situation sounds more like you want to have a pity party/rehashing of the past. Look forward to getting your divorce completed. Look forward to spending more quality times with your kids. Look forward to finding someone new to love (and have sex with).

Frank,

Good idea on the finding a friend. Check with the pastor at the church you have gone to and find out if they have any men's ministry going on there. Go to a meeting. It's going to be extremely uncomfortable, but it's what you need. Start up some conversations and be vunerable. That's the only way you will get out of this funk is to face your fears. And don't expect to find the perfect match the first time. Just take the step.

If they don't have a men's group, ask if they can recommend someone you can meet with, who can help you out.

Look on the web for a Celebrate Recovery group in your area. Take that step.

Here's one in Ventura.

http://www.bfconline.org/con_careAndRecovery.cfm?c=1000115

Your D17.99 needs a hug. When was the last time you hugged her?

N.

this afternoon during our discussion.

Do you talk to your husband like this?



How much of this is your anger towards your H? I know what a 'dry drunk' is. I have never been that kind of man. Remember, and if you don't, look at my threads from 3 YEARS ago when W Was ' in love' with her Soulmate. I didn't drink for 11 months, and I DB'd her back but she did NOT change, and I carried all the pressure of our relationship. You yourself said 'when is she going to carry some of the load'.

Nobody here can help me at all. This is not a 'self esteem recovery group. It's a 'Divorce busting group' which only works when the member has the emotional strength to get through this.

It's a group who's focus is on bettering themselves so they can 'attract' their WAS back, or at least find strength in themselves.




So, AmyC what you are saying is I do not need any support. Just a clue?

Fair enough, I agree with you on this one.

I am not a newbie. I still hurt. But It has to become irrelevant.



I don't need 'kudos' from anyone. I was actually expecting 2x4's for being a wooose

But, I got from you some grenades.



I hear where you are coming from.

You are 100% wrong about my need to make some local friends. 100%.

I am alone every night, stuck thinking about how my STBXC is down the street fuc*ing her 'boyfriend' . Yet I am 'stuck' being financially responsible for her life.

Yeah, it sucks. I hate it. And I DO need a local friend who is not [censored]*ed up like my current one is. (ken)

So stop thinking you have the all encompassing answer.
You dont.

Frank,

Not sure how much medicating you've been doing, but given the history, any drinking is probably a less than stellar idea right now. I assume you realize this now.

Keep in mind that your daughters have likely heard your wife go on about your drinking "problem," making them more inclined to think there is a problem if they know you've been drinking at all.

That just means there is zero tolerance in that area right now.

And the others are right to remind you of the tenuous position it could put you in. Makes no sense to give your wife ANY ammunition as things move forward.

As for friends, I know many have posted here over the past year urging you to get out and form a social circle of some kind. I get that this might be tough for you, but you have got to do this is some way, shape, or form.

You know doggoned well that this site is MORE than just busting divorces. Especially for those of us who have been here for awhile. I sure hope it's not true that no one here can help you. That would be really sad.

It's good that you were able to come clean so to speak. Now we know. Now we can help from a position of knowledge. And if we can't be straight with each other here on this relatively anonymous board, what chance do we have of being honest with a real person in our lives?

Yeah, it sucks. It also is what it is. And you are definitely man enough to navigate your way through it.


Blessings,

Bill

sorry, double post

I would absolutely speak harsh truths to my husband - and I HAVE done so - when the coddling, justifying and lying and calling it 'just a slip' no longer worked.

And I did not say you do not need support.
You however, would take a walker over doing something that actually propels you into the real world functioning among flesh and blood people because you are insecure.

You have been hugged, cheered, encouraged, understood and had your back patted repeatedly and been given idea after idea as to how to get back out there and carve out a life for yourself.
This has been done repeatedly over a very a long period of time and you just keep saying you get it but clearly you don't.

I hope you got that link KerryK posted.
It sounded really good.
Of course, you're the only one that can get yourself up and out there.

Good luck with things.



AmyC

Yes I did get the link Kerryk posted. I have the 'NUTS' book. I have all the 'how to' books.


WHat I don't have are local friends who aren't needy in some way.
What I don't have is anyone who will support me while my house is in foreclosure, The IRS is hammering me, and I have to pay all the bills to keep my kids in their home. LIke to the tune of $5000 or more per months.

Nobody gives a shiiit about my life, my pressures. My burdens.

The other day my STBX called to tell me that her VISA card had changed their rates, changed the interest and lowered the credit limit. They expected her to pay $1,000 this month. Her response was that she would have to file for bankruptcy.

Well, she can't do that because we are still legally married.

So, what choice did I have? I had to pay it for her even though it screwed with my financials.

She asked me 'why would you do that?' I said because whatever happens to you happens to me. You get that? She gets to run away but I'm still stuck with the consequences of OUR actions together.

So Hey Amy, sometimes we find ourselves in situations where we have no choice. none. And we are forced to 'do the right thing' even if it hurts.

And we're still alone. Still having to do what has to be done.

I'm not the only LBS who found themselves in these situation. Your husband (LBS) is lucky that he has you , who never asks for help and is capable of managing on her own. BUt that is rare.

Yeah, I suck. I hurt, I escape.

And every morning I feel like shiit because of it.

And my kids want their mom back.

And none of this will happen. None of it.

See, we aren't the WAS who is looking for forgiveness. We're the LBS who won't be forgiven but are stuck with the pain and responsibility of our children. Of our WAS, of everything that went wrong. Because as MEN we are the only ones who can fix it. Not to restore our marriage, but because we have no choice. We MUST survive.

Perhaps this might be insightful, it may make you look at your husband and his life and see how HE has struggled to keep his house, and his sanity during these difficult times.

Maybe I'm out of line, I don't know.

You're still one of my most loved friends.

Don't hit me until you examine where I'm at.

I Love you.

frank

Frank,

Couple things. The dinner with your d17 for her 18th is a must. Suck it up for a meal and a nice gift, even if it's all paid for by you, as it is also a must. She's turning 18 and it is a big deal and only happens once. And she is hurting and has expressed that pain to you. That's huge. 3 years ago our d19 told her dad how she felt, and cried as they took a 2 hour walk, and she asked him to stay and "how can you leave me/us now?" and h didn't change his mind. She was crushed and still is. She has brought up that discussion (from 3 years ago) with me many times, including the past week. It matters a lot to them. So, when your ds mention the drinking, it means they want you to stop.

The drinking is very likely a problem you need to deal with. People in your life think it is. So it is. Sorry, but that's how it is with these things and I speak from two perspectives, as you know; both the adult child of an alcoholic (I hate the labels but they do save time) and someone who became dependent/addicted to pain pills after back surgery. Although my experience was over a decade ago, it still counts as one of the most significant events of my life. We've discussed this and can again if you like. I know how hard it is. Kids take parent's drinking personally. Period.
[/color]
Growing up, I had a brilliant, well educated father who functioned extremely well at work. His job was extremely stressful, and due to his nature as a public official and the nature of the work itself, he could not discuss his work with us. I'm sure that increased his stress. I'm one of nine children born in 12 years too. Um, yeah, that's stressful. My mom was obviously a sahm and there were financial issues too. So Dad had lots of stress and no tools for venting or coping that felt safe to him, due to his work and his own issues. Like you, dad had some childhood baggage not of his own making. His Mother died giving birth, he had a truly mean step-mother, and he had epilepsy at a time when it was called a "mental defect" so he was always treated weirdly growing up. Yet he was actually highly intelligent, got a bachelor's degree, a master's, a PhD and a law degree. He was not mentally deficient. But he had no effective tools for dealing with stress and inner pain, and he didn't get them. So he drank. A lot. (But Only at night, and sometimes he'd quit for a few weeks or months. Just to prove he could....)

He was not "the life of the party" when he drank. If we were lucky, he was goofy or morose. If not, he was violent and enraged. He was irrational and abusive when he drank, and almost always "forgot" what he did the next day. So there were never any apologies or even acknowledgments that something had happened the night before. This makes for poor conflict resolution. And we never saw or learned what forgiveness looked like. How could we? Seemed it was "acting as if nothing happened"...

When he quit drinking, some things changed for the better. But a lot did not. He still lacked the ability to apologize for his actions, or to take responsibility for the marriage problems, or the R issues we all had with him. He still had a really hard time relaxing or being fun or having fun. When he finally went to AA, he changed. I got some of my dad back, the dad I had when I was 9 years old who played with me, read books to me and took me places. That dad.

When he got to the "make amends" and "taking the moral inventory of his life" he got stuck. (The word "stuck" is a word you use often, btw...) couldn't do it for reasons discussed later.

Eventually we built a R that began to get pretty good when I was in my late 20's. We became fairly close. I went to him for career advice during a cross roads of mine. He helped me a lot then, and he watched me do my biggest court argument (went to the Supreme Court, best lawyering I ever did and he helped prep me for the oral argument....) Few months later he said he felt sick and went to the doctor. He had liver cancer and died in 59 days. I miss him.

I wish he had let the 12 step program help him more. But back then, the hardest steps were too much. To really face the consequences of the pain he had caused to those who loved him was too painful for him. And scary, b/c inwardly his childhood was so insufficiently nourishing to him psychologically, that he may have feared down deep, that he really was as worthless, unlovable & bad as his stepmom said and therefore, facing his faults was too frightening. He didn't really know that down deep, he was a good man who tried to live well, who simply didn't know how. Lots of strikes against him not of his own making...I think you might relate to some of this Frank. Not all. Some. Is going to AA really such a bad idea? If the girls think you are an alcoholic, isn't it better to be a "recovering alcoholic" than an actively drinking one? I have been to meetings where the others there weren't as smart as me, or as financially successful or as good a parent or as educated and had either never had a good thing in their lives or had lost it all, and blah blah blah SEE?? I don't have a problem b/c I haven't gotten THAT bad... so the question becomes, how bad does it have to get?

Couple other things...
Your d's have sent you a few red flares. Answer them. And you are giving your w some ammunition. Why? I mean, if nothing else, don't drink around your d's.

Also, your work is isolating you, so is there something you can do that alleviates that? Are there people who "get" what you do and could help youwith it, or can you teach what you do? Somehow finding a professional outlet seems like a good idea too.

You say you are financially responsible for your w but think about it, that isn't really true is it? I mean, she didn't make much money before, and she is willing to take zero alimony or support from you, and the girls live with you...so how are you exactly financially supporting her? Won't that sitch improve with a D? I am not saying to file or surrender to the Div, but financially speaking she is not trying to take you to the cleaners. You seemed hurt more by that. It seemed to me, (and could just be my impression) that it hurt you more b/c you saw it as her wanting so badly to get out of the M, that she'd take nothing just to get out of it.

I can understand that feeling but it doesn't strike me as fully accurate. And besides, it does beat her being financially vindictive, and she isn't taking the girls away, so....

I know you don't want to hear that "the glass is half full" speech. I'm just trying to give you a little reality check, okay? You are a good man trying to love and be loved. You are a dad and a friend and a businessman and an expert in your field. You are in pain now. But her (apparent) rejection of you does not mean you are not lovable or worth loving. First off, why is this all about you? What if it has very little to do with you? I no longer believe h's mlc and "A" with Alaska had much to do with me. Moving 4000 miles away from me and the kids was about him, not me or our daughters. So, let's get back to GAL and if that includes AA, so what?

for now, that's all I got.
j-