Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums THE SEX-STARVED MARRIAGE Could all of this be because our M has been a SSM

Thanks for checking on me, my friend!!
You know I wouldn't as far as I am without out you!

Dug_in - Since he has only recently come home again, maybe he just feels a little uncomfortable? Also, I from time to time have those not quite up to "standards" performance issues (I'm 47). Sometimes it is fatigue, sometimes it can be for no apparent reason. It's just one of those things as we men get older. (If you have read Bagheera's posts on ED/PE issues, there are things guys can to to improve in this area. I wouldn't worry your H with it right now as it could have been just a one time thing.)

I would not read too much into it since this was your 1st ML since his return. When my wife and I reconciled about 7 years ago, I remember the 1st time we ML again, it was awkward. It seemed like we should be able to just pick back up where we left off. We had lost our connection though and until we felt really together again it wasn't just an automatic act.

Keep working on your emotional connection with him. That physical connection will follow.

Cinco

Cinco has it exactly right:

With regard to erection problems, take a careful read through my recent post on this topic and the replies that I received about it. Now that your husband has hit middle-age, there are some adjustments that you will BOTH have to make, in order to avoid making ED a chronic problem for him.

The most important thing to learn is that you can no longer take his arousal/erection for granted. Both men and women get used to the man being easily aroused, from the first onset of sexual interaction, almost regardless of circumstances (location, relationship state, emotional states, etc.) --> it takes a lot for it NOT to happen when you're young. But sometime in the 40's, things start to change and the "auto-erection" goes away: you have to work for it, and performance anxiety, worry about the relationship, anger or disconnect with your spouse, worry about your erection, can all kill your arousal state and ruin your erection. The best way for me to explain it is that the man's arousal/erection state becomes much more tied to his emotional/mental state; that is, his arousal/erection state begins to behave like a woman's arousal cycle, and should be treated as such, by both himself and his wife. It now takes time to build, and a proper emotional atmosphere. It often takes physical stimulation in addition to other forms of stimulation.

When this first starts so happen to a man, it can be REALLY scary, and EASILY become a viscous circle. The more you worry about having an erection, the less likely it is to occur, and the more you have to worry about, and the chances become even smaller (literally) that it will happen....and so on. IF you and your husband make his erections a major issue, it will BECOME a major issue, and he will really begin to avoid sexual interaction with you.

The two worst things you can do are:

(1) Become angry about it: "WTF! Why aren't you hard?"
(2) Take it as a personal insult to YOU: "If he's not getting hard, there must be something wrong with me! He's not attracted to me any more!"

Now that I've hit middle age myself, I've encountered both of the above reactions from my wife, and I can report that they are BOTH erection killers. I don't like seeing her angry or feeling unattractive, particularly when we're supposed to be making love, and I feel awful about it and become angry with myself and my own body for not behaving in the way that I want it to (and the way that it used to). It becomes a self-fulfilling worry, and no one is happy with the result.

So relax about it -- it's NOT you -- it's a part of growing older together. Learn to romance the 'soft-on' and build his arousal in the same way that he (hopefully) builds yours. The more he can RELAX and *not* worry about it, the more likely he will be able to respond positively.

Best of luck, and thanks for bringing this sensitive issue up for discussion.

-- B.

Well it sounds like I've done all the wrong things up to this point.

And, Bagheera, after reading your other link, it sounds like the "scale is tipping to the other side now". I had the issues back in the day with my mind not relaxing enough to "get were I wanted to go". Now, he could be having the same thing. He was the one that was "always on" and now I am more able to relax and clear my head.

Now, 2 things:
1) We did the 5 love languages quiz. He is the PHYSICAL TOUCH one. And he has identified sexual intimacy as his #1 need. If I can't give him that, how can I meet his need for emotional intimacy?

2) Discussion of our "relations" does not happen. So how do I communicate to him what you and Cinco have explained to me here?

Him, me, Cinco, and nearly every other HD male on this forum would identify physical touch as our #1 love language -- hence why we come here, venting, frustrated, and agonizing over it.

The best thing that you can do is: KEEP REACHING OUT TO HIM PHYSICALLY.

All it takes is about 20 seconds of touch to produce a rise in Oxytocin (the 'bonding' hormone) in the recipient. A touch, a caress, a hug, a kiss (in its infinite varieties), a massage, sitting thigh to thigh, cuddling, spooning.....all of this goes toward making him feel loved.

And yes, the highest form of this is sexual intimacy, so as you are able to (and comfortable with yourself), coax him in that direction. Treat his erection state as of no real concern, relax and help him to relax, take it in stride, and be aware that he may require higher levels of physical stimulation (manual, oral, or whatever) to become fully erect, than before. And if he's not able to relax and respond, then FIND ALTERNATE ACTIVITES and achieve a high level of physical intimacy anyway. Hopefully, he's attentive enough to pleasure you regardless of his own arousal state --> if not, you'll need to gently direct him towards doing that.



As DanceQueen is fond of pointing out frequently: he's going to have to get over this sex-talk phobia. In order to have a happy and fulfilling sex life for both partners, frequent, open, and very honest communication MUST occur, period. There's no way around it. It took me months of steadfast work to bring my wife around to this mode of thinking, but now we can bring up a bedroom topic pretty easily with each other -- and it has made a world of difference in our sex life. Now that we can talk about our sex life outside of the bedroom (where it can be done more 'academically'), we're working on our communication inside of the bedroom: it's hard for both of us, and we both tend to be overly-sensitive about directions/corrections coming from our partner 'in the moment.'

Having said all of that, let me recommend a book: The New Male Sexuality, by Bernie Zilbergeld. If he won't talk to you about what's going on, then perhaps you can convince him to educate himself? This book would be a good read for both of you, as it smashes a lot of myths (held by both men AND women) about male sexuality, and contains several chapters describing the detailed exercises used by sex therapists to treat such problems as erectile dysfunction and permature ejaculation. He needs to realize that what he's going through is --> NORMAL <-- and something the two of you can adjust to with love, patience, and understanding.

Best regards,

Bagheera

I will give it a shot.

I know one big inhibitor in all of this is that my DS4 is still sleeping in our bed. I think that being preg. with him when I found out about H's A created a very strong bond between me and my DS. Now he doesn't want anything to do with sleeping in his own bed.

Thanks for the great insite!

Well, things have gotten a better in this department and we are working together to get DS into his own bed.

He has be EXTREMELY helpful around the house since he has been home. He has heard that alot of my anger came from a feeling of being overwhelmed with household chores, taking care of the kids and holding down a fulltime job. So he has really stepped up to help out with that.

Its been a month since he has been home. We have done some "fun" things to help rebuild that aspect of our R. I've let him pick the things we do without complaints from me. We've gotten better at touching, even if its just sitting on the couch with arms around each other. Thanking him when he does things.

So I see things moving in the right direction.

Now here is the thing, I just feel like there is something missing. I kind of feel like my needs are not being met but I just can't put my finger on it. I think its that I am not hearing "I Love You" much unless I initiate, I'm not being complimented on how I look (although he has been picking me up when he hugs me, which makes me feel good. Seems he has noticed that I am much lighter now) and I am not being romanced. And, just as before, we don't seem to have any "real" conversation. Without these needs being met, I still feel disconnected and insecure in our R.

Dilema then seems to be how to get him to understand and meet my needs, in the midst of all the progress I see in him in other areas? I don't want to come of as a "complainer".

First off, congratualations on the progress that you two HAVE been making! He's really in there trying, and so are you -- keep it up!

Seocnd: have patience. Easy to say and hear, harder to do, I know. Making significant changes in a relationship, and making them 'stick' permamently, requires doing things in small, --sustainable-- steps. It means consciously making a decision to do someting differently day after day, until it finally becomes habit and comfortable, and only THEN, upping the bar and moving on to the next level of change. His giving you more support around the house and with the kids is a HUGE and necessary step on his part: lay on the appreciated for, and acceptance of, him and what he does generously (but genuienly) -- the more encouragement you can offer, the better. One month of change does NOT make a habit: if he can keep this up for 6 months to a year, THEN you've got sustainable progress.

Thirdly, on the issue of romance, affirmation, and THE CHASE, as I refered to it when you first posted here, there are three ways you might be able to get the message across to him:

(1) Tell him directly that this is what you need. Have an open and honest communication about your need to have his attraction for you affirmed, and then to have him actively romance and pursue you. Admittedly, most women could never say the above, and doing so just ruins the affect: you shouldn't have to ask for it, and it feels artificial and conttrived if you do, right? However, consider this: many married men don't understnad a woman's need in this regard. I know I didn't. I watched my wife read hundreds of romance novels and never GOT the fact that these fed an inate need on her part to feel desired and to be romanced and seduced. We were married. I had litererally CAUGHT the girl....why then, should I need to keep 'chasing' her?? I finally woke up and GOT it, but it took a major epiphany to do so.

(2) If you don't want it say ot directly, but can get him to read a self-help relationship book, then I would recommend the first several chapters of The 5 Sex Needs of Men and Women, by Gary and Barbara Rosberg. Alternatively, Passionate Marriage: Keeping Love and Intimacy Alive in Committed Relationships, by David Schnarch also gets very good reviews here on this board.

(3) Have you found a counselor that you can both go to yet? This is something that an MC might be able to teach him an get him to start practicing. In this manner, the advice comes from an educated third-party, rather than seeming like a 'complaint' from you directly.

Hang in there and be patient, Dug_In: you're on the right track and making progress.

-- B.

Thanks for the response and encouragement!

I do see him making efforts and that does make me happy.

I think I need to start with #1 but, like a friend told me, maybe just 1 need at a time. Don't want to overload him.

As far as the MC is concerned, we went to our 1st session last weekend with my IC. H was not talkative. ONly answered questions when asked. We've been to MC before after the A, for 1 year. He doesn't really think it works but is going because I made it a requirement. My H is an attorney and knows how to tell people "what they want to hear". Everyone but me, that is. I see thru that and don't let him get away with it. I think thats where alot of my anger started. He would "lawyer" me when we had a conflict. When he came home, that was another requirement: NO LAWYERING ME.

The thing that gets me, is that he KNOWS these are my needs. I listed all the same things out when we first went to MC after A. I listed them out to him again, right before he left. ITs not like he doesn't know that I need this. Its like he doesn't want to do it or can't do it.

I am sure its partly his upbringing. No communication in his family. No show of love, let alone speak it.