While I would really prefer to go to a MC with my W (to this point she has refused to do that), I might go by myself. How do you go about finding an SBT-trained counselor? Do you just ask "are you SBT-trained?", or does Michele keep a list somewhere, which would make it easier?
The suggestion of setting some concrete goals is excellent, thanks. I'll try to start making a list.
Notice at the top of the article there is an email address for requesting a referral to a therapist in your area. In my case, I simply lucked out, but if I was doing it all over again, here's what I'd ask or cover on the phone after compiling a list of names from the phone book:
1. Where were you educated? 2. What degrees do you have? 3. Can you tell me what licensures you have obtained? 4. Are you licensures current in this state? 5. What are your areas of specialty? (Look for marriage and family counseling, affair recovery, your issues, etc.) 6. What is your theoretical perspective on therapy? (Look for SBT, if they don't mention it ask specifically). 7. How many sessions does a typical couple recovering from an affair spend with you before terminating counseling? 8. How long is each session? 9. How much does each session cost? 10. Will insurance pay for the couples sessions? (Beware if they answer yes for couples therapy - it could be an indicator that they engage in insurance fraud - more on that if you're interested). 11. How much advance notice do you require for cancellation of a session? 12. Do you have any homework I can do to prepare for my first session? (This can be an indicator of their experience with SBT, especially if it involves goal-setting exercises). 13. Can I start marital counseling without the active participation of my W, who isn't as sure as I am about committing to this R?
That's just a preliminary list. Others may have some good questions to contribute as well. Make sure you really grill your potential therapists over the phone before walking in the door for your first appointment. MC can be expensive, and your time is even more costly, so don't waste it on someone who isn't going to meet your needs ASAP (i.e., on the first appointment). Try to avoid seeing counselors who subscribe to the "peeling the onion skin" type of psychotherapy that can take years of work. Make sure you communicate your need for immediate solutions to your problems.
Thanks for posting your list. I had an affair and want my marriage back. I am changing (moving out soon from om) but I don't want to push the issue with my ex by asking all kinds of questions on how can I earn his trust. I printed your list, so now I have a male's point of view. Hang in there and thanks again
Anita - I just want to say that it takes an great deal of courage to pursue your course of action. I hope that you'll start your own thread so that we can follow along and give whatever help / insight we can.
Quote: She started to tear up a little, and said that she was feeling sad and just needed a little time to get over this final goodbye, and said it mainly felt like she was losing a good friend. She also said that it was hard to hurt someone that she cared about so much (I guess he took the goodbye pretty hard.) The fact that she didn't want to hurt someone she cared about was very annoying to me -
When I ended it with the OG it was HARD and I was sad.Sad for lots of reasons...not necessarily for giving him up but for the friendship that was lost forever between several families, sad knowing I had contributed to causing people lots of heartache, sad because I had caused myself lots of heartache, sad knowing that I had to make a choice and mad at myself for putting myself in the position to have to make a choice. Even though I knew the OG was a dead end relationship he did give me lots of support and really was a good friend. I miss him- we had FUN which I wasn't having at home...and it wasn't about sex. It was about someone telling me I looked nice, someone caring what I thought,etc (you responded to my thread- so you've got the basics of my relationship with my H!)I would assume that your wife is sad for lots of various reasons...not just because she had to end it. Which- by the way- I think you are a saint for allowing her time to "wean" herself from the relationship.I would never even had considered asking for that. I knew what had to be done and I did it- period. If I was in your shoes- I would have expected an immediate ending as I'm sure my H expected an immediate ending.
Ironicaly enough, I had come to the decision that enough was enough and I just couldn't continue talking to him and seeing him. We had spent some time together with another mutual friend on a Saturday while his W was out of town and so was my H. It pissed them both off very much and I planned the next day to tell og that it was over. That night before I could enlighten him- he decided to tell his W. When that happened it was DEFINATELY over on my part. I didn't want EITHER one of them at that point and told them both to leave me alone!But I digress...back to your post...My point is that she is probably sad for lots of reasons- it is a time for great reflection and sometimes what you see if very painful.
You say she doesn't seem sorry for having the A and is trying to blame it on you...I would go out on a limb and say that she IS sorry for the A. It's just hard to admit it when she is hurt/angry, etc because of the problems in your M. I dont' blame my H for the actual A- I blame myself. But he has to understand his part in the sequence of events that led me to make that very bad choice. He had a choice too when he went to the ow house he met at the bar- that was his choice but my actions contributed to the choice...Does that make sense?
I like what Michelle says on her seminar tapes- Forgiveness is a gift you give yourself. You don't forget but you forgive. You don't want to forget- you want to learn from your mistakes so you don't repeat them.She says you should give your s the benefit of the doubt- they heard you and you should give them the opportunity to make the M better.Leave the past in the past so you can move forward. Wipe the slate clean and start from this point on...
I know it's easier said than done...but that is what I am trying to do. Both with my H and with myself. Gee here I am giving advice when my own M is so crappy! Hope that helps some!
Sandra
Never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience...
thanks, I am not sure how to do a "thread" I will have to look that up. I think sometimes I do have courage, but other days I'm scared. I miss not having my daughter, I let my ex have physical custody because I had just lost my job, so I moved in with my OM (really wanted my own place) and I wanted my daughter to live in her home (we had built a new home in a better town with a better school system) I did not want to take my daughter away from all that, I only would be hurting her. But then I think I will be explaining myself and under a tight thumb for the rest of my life. One time, my ex had broken his heel and I would come over and do the wash, get dinner, get ice and one night I was really horney and told him that, he said it would make things complicated and I said that I didn't care, but I tried everything and he couldn't get it up. I never felt so sleazy in all my life. I was felt like is was forcing him to have sex with me.I made him loose his "moe-joe" and I think that I probably ruined it for life! and it wasn't that great to begin with!
Anita - when you go to any of the forum listings (Newcomers, Midlife, Piecing, etc.) you will see an icon with the word Post next to it. Click on that and you'll have a thread to call your own.
Thanks for your reply. It's good to get the perspective of someone who has been in my W's shoes. I had said that it was "very annoying" when my W said that it was hard to hurt someone that she cared about so much. Let me amend that. It was actually much more than very annoying. I felt a white-hot flash of anger (which I quickkly suppressed, and said nothing about). I cannot begin to count all of the many times over these last few months when she has said or done things that hurt me so much. I'm still waiting for her to express some sadness about that. Maybe some day. I guess it's one of those things I can't demand - she either is or isn't sad or sorry about it - and it's an issue for a later time, but oh boy how quickly that white-hot anger can be triggered. From calm to maniacal (though well hidden) in about 2 seconds flat.
I hope I can give her what she found in the OG. I think I know what some of those things are, but it's very hard to get her to open up and talk about it, that's one of the challenges ahead. She told me about a month ago that she thought that she had said all that needed to be said previously. The discussions she was referring to were back in February, and she hasn't wanted to talk about them since. I'm not sure why not, I mean, if it were me, it would be great if she would be willing to hear my list of the things I would really appreciate her doing or changing about herself. Perhaps she didn't want to have such a discussion until after she felt more committed. If so, then now (or soon) might be an appropriate time.
Tuesday evening we went out, saw a movie and had dinner at a local brewhouse. Had a great time. Came back, had sex, went to sleep, and then had wake-up sex in the morning (gotta love that part of reconnecting). Took the day off, went to IHOP with the kids for breakfast, lounged around the pool most of the afternoon, and had some neighbors over for drinks later on. Another excellent day. No R talk, of course, but we did talk about some future plans, and that always feels reassuring.
You mentioned forgiveness. I have not yet forgiven my W. Well, that's not entirely true. I have forgiven a few things, but mostly I've been waiting for the sincere apology that in a perfect world would preceed the forgiveness. That may not ever come, so I will be left to forgive anyway. That is something that I think that I can do. But not yet. It's not that I really expect a pound of flesh, and I don't want to hang onto these hurt feelings and the right to inflict guilt on my W forever. But, well, maybe I DO want to be able to keep the right to inflict guilt, at least a little longer. Forgiveness, I think, means giving that up as a weapon. It's not a weapon I've used; I've never thrown the A in her face. But while good Brian wants to forgive and move on, evil Brian wants to keep that arrow handy in the quiver, to pull out and use in some future argument. Anyway, it's something I'll continue to think about.
!! 
and thanks again 