gotcha. I'll pull back some more. Any tips on trying to get her to think about what she's doing to us ? A little introspection ? Don't want to come out and say she's wrong. She is trying to distance herself I feel like that's what's she doing anyway.
2. Your relationship with your wife is over when YOU say it is over ----MarkF
I have made it clear to her (by my actions, not words) that what is happening to us isn't fazing me negatively. as far as she knows I'm fine with all of this (quite a change from when I was a sobbing mess and she wouldn't go anywhere near me or talk to me)
What you're shooting for is letting her know that you're NOT "fine" with what she's doing -- whatsoever -- but you WILL be okay.
thanks PD; i know you get frustrated with me by the things I have done, like moving out, but if she left, my son would leave too, and I couldn't kick my toddler out of his own home and I wouldn't want to. i'm sorry. he isn't to blame for this. If i didn't work midnight to 8am and I could be primary caretaker overnights this story would be way different.
Buster, I don't judge you. I made PLENTY of mistakes in my own sitch last summer (just read my threads!), and it's VERY difficulit to do the right things when you're right in the middle of it. Just because I don't always agree with people's methods, doesn't mean I judge them or are "disappointed" in them!
I think you're a man trying to grow stronger and demonstrate more maturity and better character, and learn from your past mistakes.
1. First, when your "friends" tell you to give up, ask them "When your marriage is in the shitter is that the advice YOU want to HEAR?" And LEAVE. Tell them "sorry, but I need optimism when my life is difficult, if you won't help then I have to find it elsewhere right now. I am sorry, but I have to go."
Be sure you don't cut off ties with your friends, don't alienate them, but it is IMPERATIVE that you make them understand that when life gets tough "give up" is NOT the answer a friend should be offering. When you are looking for work "give up" does not help, when you are having a rough time with school "give up" is not help, when you are having arough time raising kids "give up" is NOT help.
You do seem to have the idea...but you need to inspire these guys to understand. You can help a lot of other people by being the guy who stands up and says "this is going to happen."
When life gets rough, roll up your sleeves. Nothing worth having was earned easily, and if it was, you will end up paying for it later, with due interest on top just for good measure.
2. You need to detach. I know you are hurt, I know you are miserable, I know you are angry. You need to change your look at this. You are looking at your marriage as something you NEED rather than something you WANT. Until you can stand back and say "I don't need her, there are women out there with more maturity and compassion" you arne't detached. You need to be able to feel like life without her will be survivable. She will pick up on your desperation and it will frighten her away.
How do we detach? Get out there, meet people, realise that it is a HUGE world out there and you are a young guy, you have a world of opportunity at your fingertips and she has you cowing like a dog. Don't let her do this to you. Sure, you love her, sure, she's hurting you. So do parents and friends and children. That's life. Do you need this woman? No, you do love her, so I say keep up the fight, but realise she's something you want, not something you need.
That's when you really know you love someone, when you DON'T feel that soulmate fluff, when the music STOPs playing and you just see a person. When you look at her and say "yes, I want this woman" then you are there. You write like you need her, not like you want her.
Are her two "friends" supportive of her affair? If not, talk to them, tell them to not let her stay with them. Time to rally up the troops.
HER parents BS about letting her make her mistakes needs addressed. That's nonsense. I would get them to read some material on marriage science - Divorce Remedy for a start - and educate them that sitting back while your child makes foolish mistakes that impact her husband and child isn't just silly, its irresponsible.
Her parents took a stand in telling her that the OM is not welcome in their home, they can push more than that I am sure. They can tell her to go to MC and stay away from OM.
YOU though, you need to get a life. You are doing other things but you are doing it for HER not for you.
And most important, as puppy has pointed out, you are WAY TOO IMPATIENT. Divorcebusting takes MONTHS. You expect a visible change in her that YOU will be exposed to in just a few short weeks? WAKE UP.
Leave her alone, get to work on YOU...not working for HER because you need her, but for YOU because YOU need YOU at 100%. You are not 100% or even close yet.
You are doing better than you were at the start, but this is a LONG JOURNEY, not a fence hop. You have a LONG way to go yet.
And until you are HALF way there don't expect your wife to show any sign of change. It took me eight months to get my WW to end contact with OM. And THAT lasted TWO DAYS before she fell off the wagon.
Her ending contact told me my work was affecting her. It took a LONG TIME. Divorces aren't saved over night, they arne't saved over a weekend, they are saved over weeks and weeks and months and months of work.
You FALL in love, but you CLIMB into a successful marriage.
You have a lot of work to do yet.
You are having impact, you have to trust the program and the facts - she's got a wall up, she's not going to tell you what she's feeling inside. The LAST thing she wants YOU to know is that she has doubts. To admit she has doubts would be to admit she's been monstrous. She can't be honest about her doubts without inviting a WORLD of SELF_LOATHING on her. She is NOT ready for that tidal wave right now.
You have put dents in her plans, I have no doubt about that. What I suggest you do is buy a pot, some soil, and some seeds,and plant something in that pot. And watch how LONG it takes to see anything happen. Something sorely lost in this day and age of computers and an economy running 24 x 7 is the virtue of patience.
Ages ago people used to plant their food,work the land, and they had the patience to wait months to see what nature would bring them for all their hard work.
Today, we go to the grocery store, swipe a card into a small pretty box, and in a few seconds we have months of hard work in our hands, and we did next to nothing to earn it.
I know you work full time, we all do here. But you get your kick every two weeks, your reminder every two weeks of why you are there.
Well, life used to be a lot more casual than that. It used to take months to find out if your family were going to starve to death or enjoy a warm full tummy for the winter.
MONTHS
YOU need to get out of the year 2008 and realise that emotions take time to heal, just like any other damage that's done to anything organic.
Trees, birds, plants,it all heals but it takes time.
One woman can have one baby in nine months, but nine women can't produce one baby in one month.
The lifespan of most natural events is preset, you can't hurry it along. Spring comes when Winter decides to leave, babies arrive when they are ready to grace the world, and people heal from pain at their own pace. You can water a plant and you can nurse her pain, but it takes time, not worry.
You are not alone, we are all working, and trying, and working even more. Our spouses aren't a need, they are a want, we have found lives outside of them, and we have grown all the better for that. We have learned that that new life we bring to ourselves and our home often helps heal the pain of those around us we have wronged.
Give her time, give yourself a more fulfilling life, and enjoy everything around you that you are not taking full advantage of.
If all your friends and family are putting pressure on her, I would suggest you go and do something kind to repay them for their support. MANY people on this forum do not get HALF the support you are getting.
In my case all my gf's friends just turned a blind eye to it all and have kept quiet. They won't say a word.
I talk to them and I get "this is a private matter between you and her".
You have some supportive people around you - repay them. Don't take support for granted, it can be taken from you at any time.
mark there is no way her friends will tell her what to do. She would just get mad at me for talking to them anyway. She doesn't tell her friends what to do and vice versa
2. Your relationship with your wife is over when YOU say it is over ----MarkF
Buster, this has NOTHING to do with her. Where in my post did I say to tell her anything?
I wrote for you to 1. tell your friends that "give up" is not supportive in any way and 2. to detach.
Do you think she wants to hear she's making mistakes right now? Do you really think that's going to bring her ANY closer to YOU right now?
When SHE shows some signs that she wants to talk then you can talk, but if she isn't interested, don't pursue it. My bet is it is way too early for her yet to hear anything you have to say.
I really doubt she's in the mood to hear it. You need to read her mood. I would be in COMPLETE SHOCK if her mood was in any way ready for her to broach a R talk with you, other than for her to thow you a wall like "You aren't the man I want, let go"
That WALL DOES COME DOWN..but for god sakes it takes a LONG TIME.
She's VERY HURT BY YOU right now. She is NOT going to take that wall down for you one INCH right now. We are talking BERLIN WALL here, it takes a lONG TIME to take down those walls.
If something IS said, BY HER without YOUR INSTIGATION that is in any way an opening for a CONSTRUCTIVE discussion THEN and ONLY then do you try something.
Let me give you an example :
My WW once sat in a chair in our living room and slumped back. For the first time in months she looked at me LOST rather than ANGRY
WAYWARD WIFE Do you really think we can save this?
BETRAYED HUSBAND You are worth finding out. I am in for every ounce. Counselling is here if we want it. I have already been. It make me feel alive for the first time in years.
WAYWARD WIFE You are f%$g crazy.
And she left.
My point is, she opened a door there. She wanted to hear something hopeful and I put something there for her on the table. She heard it, and up went the wall again. She TOOK the OFFER then put up the wall again.
THIS is how it CHANGES
YOU are expecting her to just drop the wall, rush into your arms, and say I am sorry, I have been a horrible monster and I love you.
It almost NEVER HAPPENS.
You will win the lottery if you even get a sincere apology.
1. Tell your friends to support you, and to stop beating you up. 2. Detach - find a reason to want her rather than just succumbing to a need for her.
Enjoy your life. Your friends don't have to save your marriage, but they can take you out for some fun. Play some music, live your life.
If she opens up at all put something there for her that offers her some hope without PUSHING her. Otherise, you will have to leave her alone and let your support group do the pressure work on her. THEY can do that, YOU CANT.
Her friends don't have to tell her what to do in order to be supportive of you.
They can shut the OM out. Tell her he's not welcome in their home. They can refuse to talk to her. They can do a million things without pushing her around.
I think she's hanging around some very ignorant people. That's a shame.
This couple can tell her they would be happier to see you two together.
There's a million things they can do and say without telling her to DO THIS NOW.
If you want something to say to her, if you THINK she's not going to be pushed away by it :
"Our pastor feels sad for us, he thinks we should be talking to him or a counsellor rather than hurrying paperwork right now. He thinks we could both benefit by talking to him a bit to work out how we feel about everything. He wants to help us through this so we both feel our best and our family is unharmed when this is resolved."
"I have spoken to him and he did me a world of good"
"He said you are welcome to contact him at any time day or night"
You need to realise Buster that she isn't likely to take this as a positive, you Really need to be careful with this one.
But I honestly don't think she's going to talk to YOU about any of this right now. She needs exposure to someone who is marriage-friendly that she trusts and respects who has the talent to ease her into a safer place with you.
But if she's pushed too hard, it could set you back months.
If you want to gamble and try something you can try to get her to talk to someone sensible, but I honeslty think she's not ready.
