Bravo! To all who write in this thread, I thank you. Indeed some adventure time is needed. No letter is required right now. I sense that it would serve no purpose. Just heaping more BS on her that I am sure, intellectually, she already knows. What she takes to heart is pretty much on her.
IDEAS: 1) Getting my life back. This IS in progress. Working out incessantly, Going to get back into martial arts I think. Lots of golf.
2) Focus on "doing the right thing". Help around the house, enjoying what time I have with my kids, treating her with love and respect.
*side note: The part that I think Puppy said about not needing her, but still wanting her....I need to explore what this looks like for real...any help here?*
Also a small victory for me yesterday....for our whole marriage, my wife has insisted that she drive the car when we would go anywhere as a family, last night my oldest had a spring orcestra concert. I came home and confirmed the time with my wife. I then said to her, "this might sound kind of stupid and petty to you , but it is important to me. Tonight when we go to this thing, I am going to drive us." She said "OK, but it was you who said that you did not mind me driving, and that you did not have a problemwith it" Then the sprout of one who has balls said..." I know I said that in the past, but I have ALWAYS HATED riding shotgun as I have always felt humiliated by it, that ends tonight" WOOOHOOO...YAY ME!!!!
It sounds like you are getting on track. It will be tough to start living out on your own edge, but you will feel the difference and not want to go back.
"*side note: The part that I think Puppy said about not needing her, but still wanting her....I need to explore what this looks like for real...any help here?*"
This, for men in your situation, is a defining period in the marriage. Once you truly believe that you no longer "need" your wife, the scales will just drop from your eyes, and you will see her as she really is, not the way you wanted her to be, or desperately hoped that she would one day be, or the way that you somehow thought you deserved her to be. You will see all her imperfections, issues and problems in sharp relief. You will stop trying to change her from what she truly is.
You may seriously ask yourself whether you truly love the real woman at all, much less desire her in a sexual way. You then have a choice, you can say "no" and share your new-found masculine freedom with another woman, or you can stay in the marriage, now acting and speaking as a red-blooded autonomous man, and see what happens. If you stay out of choice, you will no longer feel that you live in captivity. You will love her without expectation, without agenda, without "guilting" her, you will do things only because they are right, or because you truly want to. If you are acting as the very best man that you ever wanted to be, you will be surprised how much inside you will become unlocked. My own view is that a true man gives all he reasonably can, but needs no "reward". That may sound a lofty ideal, but history tells me it is one we all have to strive for.
Does that mean you are some kind of martyr in this marriage? No - you now already know you can leave at any time, without bitterness, because this life is now all your own choice.
So does that mean your wife will carry on being ungracious, mean-spirited and unfeminine? She can, but I doubt it. The majority of women are no more screwed up by "society" than us men. Let us assume your wife is in the majority. If you fundamentally change - on the deepest and most spiritual levels you can reach - only for you and no-one else, she will notice the difference. She will notice, because you will be beyond her control, marked by boundaries which will not move or cave in under her pressure, her complaining, and even her anger. Women have a powerful urge to "test" masculinity - otherwise how would they know it was the real thing? It may take time, but real inner masculinity is unmistakeable. It is a ship that always finds its way through the storm. She will feel attracted to you, and sparks will start to fly. You will then have a healthy atmosphere in which to have an honest physical relationship. This does not mean an endless diet of sex - but that is missing the point. You and she will be able to have real sex, not obligation sex. Some form of new equilibrium will be reached. You may well end up enjoying this new, honest marriage, even though it is not what your own parents' relationship led you to expect.
On the other hand, your wife may still choose to withold from you her own gifts of sexual femininity, but if you only want rather than need her, your reaction this time will feel different and will be differently expressed. You may be wistful or even sad, but you will not be angry, depressed, scared, weak or needy.
Ultimately, you may decide to leave her. But you will do so for the right reasons, and you will not harbour the illusion that out there somewhere is a woman that is just perfect for you, who can help you be the best man you must truly want to be.
Last edited by Strong&Alive; 04/30/0801:36 PM.
"A man can be destroyed but not defeated" - from The Old Man and the Sea, by Ernest Hemingway.
Which I take to mean that every man has within him a spirit of relentlessness and optimism. Its already there; he just has to cultivate it.
Do you want to express yourself or do you want it to 'work'.
Hunh?? I don't understand this, SG. Are you replying to S&A, or to Tired? Assuming it is the latter, are you implying that S&A's advice (which I thought was excellent) wouldn't be effective? If so, why not?
I have a question for you if it is not too personal.
Is your Wife really and truly LD? Was she ever HD? I cried when I read part of your post and really cried LOTS OF TEARS when I read Nopkins version of letter to your WIFE. I used to be "HD" and became "LD" according to my H. I hurt him terribly and it has taken him years to recover from me being "LD" but under it all I was never really "LD" . I was in just as much pain as he was and it took a lot of pain and heartache and work for us to get to the "almost Happy" place we are today. Passionate Marriage is also a great book to read. I have read it over 3 times....There is so much under the suface of not making love or touching one another. There are layers and layers.... for me I did choose to work really hard to put aside all my baggage and make love before I felt the connection. It is really hard to look at yourself and know that you can cause someone you love so dearly so much pain. When I finally heard what my H said like you said here.....
Quote:
It blows all feelings of “maleness” right out of the water, makes me feel like I am lees of a man, and the cumulative effect is incredibly damaging to our chances for improving the marriage. I simply have no words to describe how painful it is to go to bed each night and wake up each morning with the single most enticing woman I have ever known, and know that not only can I not touch her, but that it feels to me, that she has absolutely no interest in being intimate with me. This has to change. I submit to you that our marriage DOES depend on it
I cried for a whole day off and on.
I also agree with what someone else posted to you. You need to go out and get strong on your own and not need you Wife but want her. This will take time but it can be done.
When my H told me I had to make him feel better and it was all my fault this put tremendous pressure on me.... I was supposed to then be this SUPER HOT Wife and also fix him at the same time? it seemed impossible to me. IT ACTUALLY IS.
What did you enjoy doing before you got Married what made you feel like a Man Then? One person can really change a Marriage... that much I can tell you. It will not happen overnite, but all things are possible. Get strong ....begin to go out and take life in... stop waiting for it to magically change or for her to read your mind~ Love and God Bless....
Do you want to express yourself or do you want it to 'work'.
Hunh?? I don't understand this, SG. Are you replying to S&A, or to Tired? Assuming it is the latter, are you implying that S&A's advice (which I thought was excellent) wouldn't be effective? If so, why not?
Puppy
Agreed, I am confused as well. I absolutely want "it" to work. I have been expressing myself for years, it is not working. I want my marriage to work, or in the alternative, I want to be sure that I have done all I could to save it before I put the marriage in a long overdue grave.
I have a question for you if it is not too personal.
Is your Wife really and truly LD? Was she ever HD? I cried when I read part of your post and really cried LOTS OF TEARS when I read Nopkins version of letter to your WIFE. I used to be "HD" and became "LD" according to my H. I hurt him terribly and it has taken him years to recover from me being "LD" but under it all I was never really "LD" . I was in just as much pain as he was and it took a lot of pain and heartache and work for us to get to the "almost Happy" place we are today. Passionate Marriage is also a great book to read. I have read it over 3 times....There is so much under the suface of not making love or touching one another. There are layers and layers.... for me I did choose to work really hard to put aside all my baggage and make love before I felt the connection. It is really hard to look at yourself and know that you can cause someone you love so dearly so much pain. When I finally heard what my H said like you said here.....
Quote:
It blows all feelings of “maleness” right out of the water, makes me feel like I am lees of a man, and the cumulative effect is incredibly damaging to our chances for improving the marriage. I simply have no words to describe how painful it is to go to bed each night and wake up each morning with the single most enticing woman I have ever known, and know that not only can I not touch her, but that it feels to me, that she has absolutely no interest in being intimate with me. This has to change. I submit to you that our marriage DOES depend on it
I cried for a whole day off and on.
I also agree with what someone else posted to you. You need to go out and get strong on your own and not need you Wife but want her. This will take time but it can be done.
When my H told me I had to make him feel better and it was all my fault this put tremendous pressure on me.... I was supposed to then be this SUPER HOT Wife and also fix him at the same time? it seemed impossible to me. IT ACTUALLY IS.
What did you enjoy doing before you got Married what made you feel like a Man Then? One person can really change a Marriage... that much I can tell you. It will not happen overnite, but all things are possible. Get strong ....begin to go out and take life in... stop waiting for it to magically change or for her to read your mind~ Love and God Bless....
Ali, Thanks. Right now all Ican do is find me. I lost him somewhere along the line. I truly pray that we find a way, I find a way to get her to follow me. If not, I am resigned to the fact that I may have to decide to end this for my own survival. Life.
