Thanks so much for the advice. My H came to the house on Saturday to work on our computer for his work. We had brief conversation and it was easy going. He hugged and kissed my cheek. He had brought up going to dinner this week and he asked me again on Saturday if this Wednesday would work. We had gone to dinner a almost 2 weeks ago and had a good time b/c relationship was not brought up. We then had that conversation last week where he told me that nothing has changed since he moved out and he just wants to be by himself and "chill". My thought is to let him know that I think dinner would be fun, but to postpone to next week b/c this week is not ideal. This would be the first time that I would be pushing back seeing him since this whole ordeal started. My thought is that maybe he needs to miss me a little. The hard thing is that I also would want to go see him, have another great time and leave it at that. What do you think? Should I push it off to next week saying that I am tired I just had a long weekend w/ a friend from out of town)and make him wait? Brita
Hi, Thanks for you response. I am doing okay. I just spent a long weekend w/ a friend that fed my ego the whole weekend. The "you don't need him, screw him" attitude is all she talked about. Friends can be so funny when they are trying to protect you. Anyway, my thought is to distance myself a little this week. He stopped on Saturday to use his computer and then he called yesterday and I didn't return his call. He brought up dinner this week and I originally said I wanted to go. Now my thought is to tell him this week will not be good after all b/c I am tired after having my friend in from out of town and could be maybe do it next week?....I mentioned in another post that I have never postponed a plan w/ him. When he first moved out he said that he wanted to do New Years Eve together and then we told me 2 days later he was getting his own place (by the way, he left it that info on my voicemail) I told him that I didn't think that it was a good idea to spend that evening together. He acted like he was fine about it and then later on, told my next door neighbor that he didn't want to spend the evening alone after all. He is so hard to gauge. I am not sure if I should play hard to get. When I have avoided his calls, he seems indifferent and then when I do take them, he seems nice and always asks me questions about what I am doing and where I am going. I am so confused about what to do! Brita
... He had brought up going to dinner this week and he asked me again on Saturday if this Wednesday would work. We had gone to dinner a almost 2 weeks ago and had a good time b/c relationship was not brought up....... My thought is to let him know that I think dinner would be fun, but to postpone to next week b/c this week is not ideal... My thought is that maybe he needs to miss me a little...
--- I've heard people mention this strategy fairly often, but I don't subscribe to it. It seems to me a bit shallow and not really addressing the problem at hand. For one thing, MLC men are having a lot of mental turmoil and not really thinking straight or rationally, and this is more the strategy of a straightforward newly courting couple without a history. ---
.... The hard thing is that I also would want to go see him, have another great time and leave it at that. What do you think? ...
--- I think 'yes'. Especially because it is what you really want to do, and to do otherwise will certainly come across as being manipulative, and therefore frightening and a turn-off for H. But if it were me, my strategy would not end at just 'leaving it at that'. My end would be to eventually obtain a regular, reliable schedule of contact with H. Something that is mutually satisfying to both of you, something that would allow you to hang in there comfortably with him for the long haul. Enthusiastically agreeing to this dinner date proposed by H would be one of my first moves in that direction. ---
.... Should I push it off to next week saying that I am tired I just had a long weekend w/ a friend from out of town)and make him wait? ...
--- No. Think of H as a skittish horse who jumped the pasture fence a while back, who is now having a few fond thoughts of former comfort & relationship mixed in with exciting but nebulous thoughts of freedom, and you're out there with him near a dangerous expressway trying to get close enough to get a halter on him. I think it is foolish, if you value this horse, to decline any movements of his towards you. ---
Hi Appleroad, You make so much sense. But....what about the fact that he has his own apartment, his freedom and then his wife available to him everytime he summons me? I was thinking of saying that I think the dinner would be fun, but I have tired the last couple of days and could we do it another day?...Then I would see what day that he would suggest. By the way, I just got off the phone w/ him. Nice talk, he asked me about dinner and said that I was tired from having my friend in from out of town. Would there be another day that he could do? He said that he wasn't sure about what was going on over the weekend (it seems that he always wants his weekends to go out w/ buddies). I told him I had plans already for Thursday and Friday. He asked again about Friday and said that I couldn't that I had plans. He said for me to call him Wednesday and we could see how I feel and otherwise, we could find a day that work better. He mentioned that he understood b/c he would want me to take care of myself and then I hung up. How do you think I did?
But....what about the fact that he has his own apartment, his freedom and then his wife available to him everytime he summons me?
Brita, I think you are doing great with this situation! Your instincts are all working A/OK. What you did here with H in this phone call was a bit of negotiation. You maintained the friendliness and respect in the relationship but you also let him know you have a life and that you will not be always at his beck and call. Just keep on keeping on. Know what you want and steadily work towards that using DB techniques.
Also, you could turn your attention towards using whatever exists in the present situation to your own advantage and pleasure. That H has his own apartment seems to be s source of misery and discomfort to you. And probably a big part of this misery comes from general societal expectations about how married people should live -- ie. together! -- and general societal ideas that separation is an unmitigated bad/negative thing leading inevitably to divorce. But Brita, this really is not a one-size-fits-all situation/problem/solution. Where there are dependent children of the marriage there is not so much leeway for some creative thought or plan. I can't see LBS with small children to be raised having much more on their minds than a speedy return of WS. But for people without children, and where there is no financial dependence/constriction, there is nothing but pure relationship between LBS and WS, and that relationship can be carried on in all kinds of venues over a long period of time if both are comfortable. In my case, I had an early interest in H's 'bachelor pad' in town. I thought it would be fun and exciting, re-vitalizing for our marriage to have a second courtship played out in 'the country house' (mine) and 'the city house' (his). H cottoned on to that idea, he refers to our set-up as 'town-and-country'. We're having a good time with this. OTOH, don't get me wrong that this is nothing but pleasure -- in my sitch there was a yearlong EMA, now finished with xOW 2000 miles away with another man, so there is plenty, plenty of emotional fall-out from that to be resolved before I would even consider having H back to live with me. If you read some of the stories on the Piecing Forum you'll soon realize how much LBS angst there is after WS returns home. It is another whole journey for LBS to resolve feelings around betrayal/abandonment -- this is what I'm going through right now, and frankly, I'd much rather do this while H is not here in the house living with me, I don't know if our relationship could take it. So remember, Brita, there are some advantages in the separation. It's a matter of perception, of seeing your glass half-full instead of half-empty.
Your right Appleroad. I have to look at the separation as a positive for him to find himself. He happened to come over unexpectedly about 2 hours ago. He called and said that he had lost his keys when he was out running errands. He lost his keys to our house and to his new apartment. Work had called and there was a situation that he needed to log in to work and therefore had to come into the house. When he came in, I left him alone and I could see that he was really stressed out about the situation at work. When it was complete, he came over to me and said that he was sorry to come into the house and be in such a bad mood. He then when on to tell me that he was really upset about losing his keys. That his afternoon was ruined b/c of it and that he had to go track down the landlord of his apt and then work called and they said he had to fix things right away. He mentioned that he was so stressed out about everything his head was about to explode. I just listened (normally I would have made suggestions or try to console him). He then said he had to go. He also brought up that he doesn't handle these types of situations well b/c he has emotional problems (I was surprised he made that comment) and then he got teary eyed. When he was leaving, I followed him out and said that I would lock the door. He looked at me and said, "So we are still on for Wednesday?". I said for him to call me and I would see how I was feeling. He mentioned that we could work something out if I wasn't up to it on Wednesday. I am still conflicted. I think maybe I should tell him that we should do it next week instead and that way, we will have a little more time apart. Who knows?....Everyone is telling me that I need to make it so he misses me a little. This is a guy that told me 2 months ago that he didn't need to spend that much time w/ me and that he never misses me. He likes when we get together, but he doesn't to spend it w/me. I see that he does the same thing w/ his mother. I placates her and will see her briefly just to make sure she is okay, but really he doesn't need to spend the time w/her. I think he makes plans to see her every so often b/c he feels bad. He is a nice guy and sensitive to peoples feelings so I know that is why he always make sure to call her and check in. That is what keeps messing me up. Could he be doing the same thing w/me?.....
Your H really does sound a lot like mine has been over the past several months, Brita. I never thought of H as being an anxious person before this present crisis, but now he's revealing a lot of work-related and other general life related anxiety. But your H is actually verbalizing to you -- 'emotional problems' -- giving you a much stronger signal than mine has done.
It would be nice if he would go to IC, but likely he won't. And even if he did, he would be lucky to find an IC knowledgeable and competent for MLC problems.
I could be wrong -- I haven't been thinking about and conciously using DB techniques for very long -- but I continue to believe that the idea of leaving him be until he misses you and appreciates you and mends his ways is not DB. I think that is more like unenlightened mainstream thought. Michele has something to say about that in her book.
Brita, maybe it would be very helpful for you to contact a DB coach and talk over some of these things.
Hi Brita, and appleroad... I'm confused guys! I've been reading your thread Brita, as your H as alot of similarities with my BF, who moved out today into his own apartment :-(
I too was of the opinion that my BF may be in MLC, or just have emotional probs (good progress that your H opened up to you enough to admit that to you! My BF is also crying out for counselling, but much like your H, would probs not go). And so like you, I was trying to do what I thought was best, and not chase or contact him, but as you say, "leave him to miss me".
Like you, I thought we were supposed to leave them to "stew" and sit with their decision and come to their own realisations that maybe its not the R thats the source of their unhappiness?
But Appleroad...you are saying that you dont subscribe to this approach? Should we in fact be reaching out to our partners?
I dont know about you Brita, but I am worried about my BF, he seemed very depressed today and ended up in tears. Makes me want to reach out and contact him, but I thought that was against DB principles? My BF also told me a few months ago that he didnt miss me. Today he looked less angry/frustrated and more emotional. So like you, I'm also conflicted...
Whats the best thing to do !!?? Sorry I cant offer advice! I am just interested in the advice you are being given and can only empathise with your confusion as to how to proceed...
Hi, Did he tell you where he staying right now? My H, got his own apartment 2 weeks ago and never told me the address. I never asked b/c I was trying to do a 180 and not ask questions. My that is really screwed up! He knows where I live and comes by the house when he needs things but, I am not allowed to know where he is?........ Brita
Don't feel bad, H has always been secretive about where he and OW are living. I have a hunch but there are so many apts. in that area. I asked him where he was living last year and he would not divulge that info. and I said it is a good thing to know because of the kids and he still would not tell any of us.
Pretty strange.
The Bomb: 08/05 H moves out: 06/2006 H moves back: 01/07 & Out again: 01/07 H moves back: 03/08 & Out again: 04/08 H moves back: 05/09 & Out again: 07/09 Divorced 08-12 Kids: 22, 20, 19
But Appleroad...you are saying that you dont subscribe to this approach? Should we in fact be reaching out to our partners?
Ali, I don't think there is any 'should' to it. People do whatever they can to preserve their important relationships. I simply never resonated to the conventional wisdom about MLC spouses. "Leave them alone and they'll come home, wagging their tails behind them" just didn't do it for me, mostly because of the time frame involved for MLC to run its' course. I'd rather go out and join the MLCer who jumped the pasture fence (as long as there's no active OW) and have a relationship with him and not be overly concerned whether he's ready to come home or not. I'm not trying to talk anyone into doing anything which doesn't make sense to them, only to mention that this is the course I have chosen and so far, so good.
