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Slowly

Thanks for the kind words.

New Years went OK , W out partying , me and D stayed in and watched movies so that was nice.
W's behaviour has taken another turn and I guess it could be described as passive agressive. For example she had a couple of days off and normaly likes to spend at least some time with D.
While we have no formal arrangement we have been good at comunicating expectations and she will let me know in advance what days she would like D to stay etc.
Now she has taken to making no commitment , I needed to do some stuff yesterday and the day before asked W , Are you comming down to pick up D and if so what time so we can be here? I got " I dont know " then " I dont know what I am doing minute to minute " . I just said it makes no difference to me I enjoy taking D along with me , I just dont want you turning up expecting us to be here.
Yesterday I did take D with me and we got home around mid day . W turned up about an hour later and stayed for about 3 hrs , did not do anything with D or S , sat out on the deck looking unhappy (second day in a row ). This behaviour is starting to affect the kids , S 16 tried to interact with W and in the end gave up walking off , looked at me and raised his eyebrows. Even D who normaly sticks to W like glue was avoiding her.

I think its depression mixed with anger , who knows . I am paying for not setting proper boundaries and being too accomodating early in the Separation , I wouldnt go sit at her place for 3 hrs in a huff.

Is it a reaction to me pulling away ? Me going out with OW ( as innocent as it was ) was the turning point in this.

Without a doubt reality is sinking in and her choices will have life long consequences. How different things are to when she moved out.

watch this space , I am sure things will change .

Dave,
Her recent behaviour should have no impact on you. She is continuing on the rollercoaster ride which she started out on. Just stick to your path and keep doing the things that will make you and your kids happy.


Do you think this is really all bad? I think that it is interesting that she wants to come to your place when she is in such a mood. There are opportunities here for you. I think she is looking to see how life looks back on this side of the fence...whether the grass is maybe greener here than she remembers??

Next time, maybe just try " acting as if..."
...you are glad to see her?
...you would like her to join you and the kids in some activity or another? (Here you have to be careful. Make it an invite and then go even if she doesn't want to.)
...you really care how she is doing. (just ask, listen and validate)

I am not sure if you still want to try to work on your M/R, but if so, I think there are some opportunities here. Of course, I am halfway round the world, so I could be total wrong

SD

Dave--
Even her willingness to continue contact with you can be seen as a plus, even if huffy. Was it ever a problem for her before, saying that you didn't notice how she feels? Maybe you can take her a small gesture (or have one of the kids bring it to her), like a cup of coffee the way she likes it, say "You looked a bit down..." smile quietly and walk away.

Either way, wanted to let you know that I was thinking of you...

D

Hi Dave,

It does sound like that reality is setting in with W. Apparently, things (seperation, etc.) are not going as she envisioned. Such is the way of successful DB'ing.

My observation is that she is in a precarious state: fence sitting, as you put it. Be kind, gentle, and open (as you have been) as maybe the sun will shine on your M. I think you should figure out what you want (D, M, R - whatever) and let her know before the sitch changes. She is in a state of limbo, it would appear, and nobody enjoys that. Set a goal and work yer butt off - don't be sad! I will stay tuned and see how things unfold.

Best o'luck,
--Chris

Thank you SD , Donna and Chris.

SD you are right , W is still riding her own roller coaster and is emotionaly all over the place.
I realy dont feel like I have the energy to do too much other than to carry on with my life and try and let her affect me as little as possible.
Donna , I did sit with her and offer her a coffee but she chose not to interact with me so I just carried on with my day. Acting
"as if " is natural to me now.

Following on from this I went away for a couple of days and W looked after Kids and house. When I got back she was in a better mood and had even done some yard work! . She did not stay long though after I got home.
Yesterday I invited her over for dinner with me and the Kids and she did seem to enjoy this , dressed sexy too which can be tough to ignore , perhaps I was not supposed to ignore this but shes going to have to do better than that.LOL. I told her about a woman at the supermarket who was trying to hit on me and then W gets a little flirty. Read into that what you like , I have some ideas but am staying on course .
Good news is W is taking better care of herself , is excercising and eating properly so has gained a touch of weight and is looking much healthier.

I have a bit of a theory as to what is happening.

Firstly there is no doubt that W lost attraction for me during our M and this was some years back. This led to where she met OM and was ready to leave our M.

Since then being separated and OM have perhaps lost some of that early romantic appeal.

In that time I have worked on eliminating my " attraction killing " behaviour and paid some attention to her LL's.

I have also been reading about " alpha males " and stuff from making her happy dot com. Now I am trying to interact with her as a woman who I do not know but am trying to attract. If that makes sense.

For her this is probably very confusing as she remembers the Old CK and now has this new CK . This slows the process up but I think its starting to have some results.

Its a long process but she is way more responsive to me than some other WAW's here.

I see that the only way this will work out is that her attraction for me is high enough for her to want me and our life together more than any OM or life on her own. Then she may be prepared to do whats required to build a healthy long term R.

My job then would be to maintain that level of attraction.

All easier said than done but its the only way forward that I see and even then may be a game that I dont want to win.

More later


Dave

Dave,
I don't think I'm saying anything you don't already know, but...
This is the key question. Michele doesn't really talk about it much in DR, but really, once you detach and GAL, the most important thing to do is dig deep and try to come to terms with the fact that something was/is missing from your life. Otherwise, the R would not have gotten to where it did.

I just don't see a whole lot of sitches where there were 2 (emotionally) healthy, married people with communication problems and all of a sudden, one was a WAS. Many more where there was something under the surface which caused a disfunctional relationship to develop, then leading to a WAS.

The question is, what is missing? In my case, my W's depression, NMA, caused me to spiral into a similar NMA, at least whenever I was around her. She saw that I was happy, except when I was with her and basically treated being married to her as an obligation and a burden (which it was). I definitely don't want back into that R and also don't see any effort on her part to address her issues.

Have you really thought this through at this level? If not, spend your time on asking some hard questions along these lines. If so, love to hear your conclusions!

Take care, my antipodal friend!

SD

SD

Thank you for your thoughtfull post.
There was very much something missing from our R over the last few years.
In our case there was a number of issues that dated back to prior to W's 1st A.
At the moment its way better for both of us that we are separated but generaly supportive than if we were living together. I see it being that way for the forseeable future .



Its a work in progress .

My W and my energy levels to a 'T'.
I am quite 'detached' ....just tired.
I had focussed so much on Christmas and New Year and now they have passed I have found myself needing to GAL again.
My GAL for the moment is to relax.



That was me too.

I guess we just have to be very patient for Ws to address their issues.
Not impossible though.....after all.....aren't we doing that as well?

Update

Over the last week or so I have experienced some interesting reactions from W.
The first been a lot of Anger even to the point of abusive txt messages. Next day she acts as if nothing is wrong. Her mood can change within a few minutes at times.

I decided to try and get some conversation going with her and how she feels and what she wants.

What I got was that she is scared to move on and be by herself . She is also scared to return to the M because she does not want it to fail again and have to go through all this.

Thats as far as we got before we got a abrupt change of topic and the wall went up again. I backed off then and while there was much more to discuss I decided that it would be unproductive.

I met her again yesterday to discuss ongoing arangements and to discuss how to find her a more suitable property to rent along with discussing how much support she expects financialy etc. This stuff we can handle quite well.

I still get the impression that she thinks that returning to the M will be her decision. I am trying to get through gently that its a decision for both of us. Either one of us can decide to live apart but it will take both to decide to live together.

Through all this and the last month or so there is a reinforced emotional wall. I think this is a direct result of me having gone out with another woman as innocent as that was.

As for me I have met another Women ( different to the women previously meantioned) We have been out in a group environment on a couple of occasions and for coffee . We do get on very well but both have recent breakups and are doing our best to keep things at a friends level as involving each other in our respective dramas would be unfair. She is a very good listener and I have been open and honest from day one. As an outsider looking in she is reasonably confident that our M can be saved .
The question is do I want it ? and how long am I prepared to wait?

Dave,
Thanks for the update. Very interesting stuff indeed!

Especially:


Maybe I am answering this for myself more than anything, but humor me!

Do I want it?... I think the important part is the "it". What kind of R will "it be?

...a return to the past sitch? Probably not what you are looking for!

...an uncomfortable R where W is still working on her issues but you are together? Again, not for me.

...a reconciliation after W has had a chance to really work out all of her issues on her own? Maybe, but who knows who the person will be who comes out of this process and whether the two of you will at all be compatible as a married couple.

This leads us to: How long am I prepared to wait?

For me, the above thoughts are leading me to the conclusion that I should not wait.

That said, if she gets to the third place above, there is no reason that you guys can't start dating again if that is what you want at that time and are still available.

Concerning dating, this aspect I have not pursued, as a personal choice. Mostly to give me more time to work on myself.

As usual, this is worth what you paid for it! Hopefully at least gives you another viewpoint to chew on.

Take care, SD