Okay, so W and I are going out to dinner tonight. Any suggestions of anything I should do differently, or bring up?
Where do you feel the relationship stands? Is she still at a point where she could bolt if you come on to strong? Do you talk about a future together? What is the understanding about where your R is heading....towards divorce or towards reconciliation...or just a friendship. I'd know what to suggest if I knew where you stood. Sure, invite for Christmas.
In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. Abraham Lincoln
It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. Theodore Roosevelt
Where do you feel the relationship stands? Is she still at a point where she could bolt if you come on to strong? Do you talk about a future together? What is the understanding about where your R is heading....towards divorce or towards reconciliation...or just a friendship. I'd know what to suggest if I knew where you stood. Sure, invite for Christmas.
Our R isn't heading in any particular direction right now. No one has talked divorce for two months, we live separate but spend maybe 50% of our time outside of work together and we've not completely severed financial ties.
Right now, I think she would freak if I came on strong really quickly. She tells me that she doesn't want an R with anyone right now (which I know isn't the whole truth), but we certainly have a more intimate relationship than two people who are just friends.
I think W is scared that if we got back together that we would quickly end up back in a chaotic and stressful environment like we were in before. She talks a lot about this, although she takes equal blame for the fact that things got to that point. I don't know why she would even bother talking about it if she wasn't trying to figure she and I/us out. I know she isn't ready for romantic stuff right now - The one time she talked about us trying again she told me that she wasn't ready for that kind of relationship. That said, she says a lot of inconsistent things, so it's hard to get a really good idea of what is stewing in her head.
Basically if I ignore what comes out of her mouth, she is following what she suggested we do to being to get back together - Live apart, work on ourselves, spend time together as a family and take it slow.
Last week when we were together after going out, we talked for a long time and she told me that she forgave me for a variety of things, but she could not forget. She also told me that I needed to 'get over her'. When I left we kissed a bunch of times, hugged and told each other ILY. Last week she told me ILY on her own, that she respected me and wanted me 'close by' when I was looking for somewhere else to live. Heck, I even asked her a couple of times a month ago if we could start living together again and she said she would think about it. We've not talked on that topic since then.
So, it's mostly a whole bunch of mixed signals right now. She responds favorably to flirting and playfulness on my part, but I think she's afraid to let her guard down all the way with me.
Sounds to me like she still needs to get OM out of her system, but maybe she's working through it. It would have almost been better if this "relationship" with OM had completely imploded. This "what could have been" can be a real bugaboo. But eventually she'll realize that she's completely content with you.
Yeah, she needs to just figure it. I'm sure the repeated rejection she gets from him all the time will get old eventually, particularly if at some point I start to withdraw from her as time goes by. Not planning on doing that right now, but we both can't live like this forever. Every time I've pushed on the OM point it has turned out that they were already experiencing tension anyway, so it never really did a whole lot in my favor.
Originally Posted By: Just_Me
Don't know if you are reading too much. Sounds like she's enjoying her time with you. Just go with it and enjoy. My gut tells me that it's just a matter of time. I can't understand what the hold-up on committing to you is, but she'll get there. Can you just go with this for a while? Have you lowered your guard enough that she's not scared you'll reject her if she wants more with you?
She seems to enjoy it - She told me yesterday that the time we spent together out of town on Thur/Friday last week was a lot of fun. In theory I'm okay with the way things are for the time being, but I don't know if the dynamic will change significantly when I move, especially if I am closer to W (right now we're about 30mins away from each other).
I don't think there is really anything that would give her cause to believe I would push back if she wants more. We've not had any stress or tension between us at all in the last two months.
Okay, so W and I are going out to dinner tonight. Any suggestions of anything I should do differently, or bring up?
You really cleared things up for me....now it's as clear as mud, which is an improvement. In light of what you previously wrote, I don't have a good suggestion as to what you could do differently. Make sure you're fun, happy, confident. Don't be afraid to be sweet to the waitress. If you've previously been obviously hung up on your wife, then be a little less engaged. If the reverse is true, you've been a little aloof, then tell her she looks nice.
Nothing was off limits to me. I was a big time pursuer. So I suck at this part. You are close, but not close enough. She still needs to take more steps your way. All you can do is be someone she'd be crazy not to chase
In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. Abraham Lincoln
It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. Theodore Roosevelt
You really cleared things up for me....now it's as clear as mud, which is an improvement. In light of what you previously wrote, I don't have a good suggestion as to what you could do differently. Make sure you're fun, happy, confident. Don't be afraid to be sweet to the waitress. If you've previously been obviously hung up on your wife, then be a little less engaged. If the reverse is true, you've been a little aloof, then tell her she looks nice.
Glad it makes sense to someone
Usually when we're together, if I withdraw a little she notices it and questions it - If I seem quiet, frustrated, whatever. She'll ask if there is something wrong. If I am attentive and caring, she never usually says anything bad about it. Sometimes she'll ask me to stop if we're out in public, but other than that she doesn't pull away, push me away or try to avoid it. Hell, I think she initiates 90% of the hugs and kisses we do together.
I always try to compliment her and boost her spirits - I know her self-esteem is pretty much trashed right now. I'm not annoying about it, but I often make random comments about her hair, her clothes and stuff - I told her I thought her hair looked nice the other day, and it turns out she had done something else to it, so that hopefully was a positive thing in her eyes.
She seems to be picking and choosing the parts of our R that she can handle right now. Nothing intimate or romantic (unless you call kissing and hugging romantic), but she still comes to me with problems and will lean on me when she is upset or stressed. I just don't know what it will take to push her over that edge into thinking that she can take that next little step together. Of course, she could also be content with how things are and just want us to be friends, but I don't get why she would be so touchy -feely with me if that is where the imaginary line is.
Originally Posted By: Just_Me
Nothing was off limits to me. I was a big time pursuer. So I suck at this part. You are close, but not close enough. She still needs to take more steps your way. All you can do is be someone she'd be crazy not to chase
Yep - That's pretty much what I'm doing. She's still in the 'when are things going to back to the way they were' frame of mind right now, so only time can help that.
This "what could have been" can be a real bugaboo. But eventually she'll realize that she's completely content with you.
I think sometimes just the fact that they've thought about someone else is enough to have them doubting their feelings for you. You are in a great position though Brit...and I think it's better that she tells you about it you're willing to listen. I don't know if guys & girls think differently on this one...but I would rather know than not know. Plus, she's probably feeling you out a bit when she talks about it. To see your reaction.
Have fun at dinner. J~
M 35 H 29 M 4 yrs T 9 yrs D 3 S born 10/19/07 Bomb 09/10/07 Separated next day OW - broke up and H moved out 09/07/08 Status - still figuring this out
I think sometimes just the fact that they've thought about someone else is enough to have them doubting their feelings for you. You are in a great position though Brit...and I think it's better that she tells you about it you're willing to listen. I don't know if guys & girls think differently on this one...but I would rather know than not know. Plus, she's probably feeling you out a bit when she talks about it. To see your reaction.
Absolutely - Someone else can certainly make any issues far more significant, as they almost become an excuse as to why they can leave and pursue another relationship.
I think the best thing I can do right now is listen. Even when I speak a little negatively about him during our conversations, she does agree with me. Whether that is simply to make life simple for herself, or because she really believes it, I don't really know.
Tonight was fun - W seemed to enjoy herself too, and she even told me
We went out for dinner together with D, which was crazy as usual. We talked a lot, laughed, played with D - We all seemed to have a good time. Afterwards we went to Target to look for something W's sister had suggested for on of her kids, so we pushed D around in a cart for a while. W picked out a bunch of toys for D, letting her play with them to make sure she liked them. She also bought me DVD of National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation, which I was talking about being the perfect Christmas movie. Then she asked me what I wanted for Christmas, and asked if a camera would be okay. She took me over to where they were and asked me which one I wanted - I felt pretty bad having to pick one out, since I know W has no money, so I just told her what I would like as far as features and such and left it to her to decide.
We got back to W's house and gave D a bath. D pooped in the bath, so I ended up getting her ready for bed while W cleaned up the poo. We played with D for a while, and W asked me if I wanted to watch Borat with her - She had watched it last night, but said it was good. So, after D went to bed we put the movie on and had a good laugh together. I don't think I've seen my W laugh that much in a long time.
Afterwards I excused myself as it was getting pretty late and W was getting sleepy. Usually when we go out to dinner together on Tuesday's I leave by 8-8:30. Tonight it was after 10 when I left. While I was getting my things together and putting my coat on, she just stood there with me and talked - When I was done, she reached out to me and hugged me. I'll admit that I probably went too far squeezing her butt a little and rubbing her back under her shirt, but she didn't say anything about it. She gave me the DVD and kissed me as I was leaving - I put my arm around her and sort of rubbed her tummy and she giggled. I asked her if I could play with her tummy button and she was okay with it - Yes, it sounds really weird, but she would normally freak out at the prospect of me touching her. She got a little wiggly and told me that she didn't think I was going to 'accost her tummy', but I think I just over did it - She certainly wasn't mad about it at all, if anything, she's still uncomfortable about that part of her body after having D. We kissed a few times, ILY'd and she told me she had a lot of fun as I was leaving.
I have no idea why she didn't complain about me touching her - W is very sensitive to being touched and even when we were together and happy, she was often very uncomfortable with it. So, if nothing else, it's a sign that some trust is coming back, even if it's going to take a while. I also don't get why she initiates hugging and kissing every time we're together - We were never particularly affectionate like that. It wasn't as if I would hug her when I got home, or anything. She seems to want it and enjoy it, so I do my best to make her feel safe and loved, so she knows she can do it again.
Overall I think the evening was positive, but I'm a little uncomfortable and feel like I maybe overstepped something at the end. Hopefully that didn't cloud the calmness and ease of the evening in W's eyes.
Oh, she also told me that we're going to her Mom's house on Sunday to make cookies for Christmas. Fun stuff.
If you've previously been obviously hung up on your wife, then be a little less engaged. If the reverse is true, you've been a little aloof, then tell her she looks nice. 